Expanded FearBats? (Darkrai EX / Gengar EX / Crobat)

[JadeEspeon]

Pokémon:

• 2 Darkrai EX (DEX)
• 3 Gastly (BT)
• 2 Haunter (BT)
• 2 Gengar (BT)
• 1 Mewtwo EX (BW 45)
• 3 Zubat (PHF)
• 2 Golbat (PHF)
• 2 Crobat (PHF)

Trainers/Supporters/Stadiums:

• 2 Crushing Hammer
• 2 Dark Patch
• 2 Fisherman
• 2 Energy Switch
• 3 Great Ball
• 2 Hypnotoxic Laser
• 2 Ultra Ball
• 3 Lysandre
• 2 N
• 2 Pokemon Center Lady
• 2 Rare Candy
• 2 Wally
• 1 Giovanni's Scheme
• 1 Hex Maniac
• 2 Dimension Valley

Energy:

• 2 DCE
• 7 Darkness Energy
• 8 Psychic Energy

Strategy:

Above was my initial starting point before I made a ton of changes. I just Before BreakPoint I've been manipulating the idea of creating this deck and through numerous play testing and changes to the deck, I've kinda lost it. It's a bit inconsistent, no matter what I change. The basic idea is to maintain zero retreat cost while spreading atleast 30 damage to collect KO's with Gengar. So, my biggest problem with the deck is a constant terrible start. I've tried adding and subtracting things so many times that I kind of lost sight of the consistency. SO. I need to be able to spread damage fast while setting up Genger (as with any deck requiring this much set up-fast.)

 

[Alphahitman4]

POKEMON:
2 Darkrai EX (DEX)
3 Gastly
2 Haunter
2 Gengar
1 Mewtwo EX (BW 45)
3 Zubat
2 Golbat
2 Crobat

TRAINERS
2 Crushing Hammer
2 Dark Patch
2 Fisherman
2 Energy Switch
3 Great Ball
2 Hypnotoxic Laser
2 Ultra Ball
3 Lysandre
2 N
2 Pokemon Center Lady
2 Rare Candy
2 Wally
1 Giovanni's Scheme
1 Hex Maniac
2 Dimension Valley

ENERGY
2 DCE
7 Dark
8 Psychic

TOTAL: 60

Above was my initial starting point before I made a ton of changes. I just Before BreakPoint I've been manipulating the idea of creating this deck and through numerous play testing and changes to the deck, I've kinda lost it. It's a bit inconsistent, no matter what I change. The basic idea is to maintain zero retreat cost while spreading atleast 30 damage to collect KO's with Gengar. So, my biggest problem with the deck is a constant terrible start. I've tried adding and subtracting things so many times that I kind of lost sight of the consistency. SO. I need to be able to spread damage fast while setting up Genger (as with any deck requiring this much set up-fast.)

You could throw in a 3rd ultra ball and play Hoopa EX (AOR) to help get Darkrai on turn 1 and give you the free retreat cost consistently. Id also play a few prfessor sycamores so if you are stick with bad hand you can Mulligan. I am not big on great ball, cuz its up to chance as well as Giovannis scheme. You could play muscles band for boost or the sycamores would help with draw power.

 

[JadeEspeon]

You could throw in a 3rd ultra ball and play Hoopa EX (AOR) to help get Darkrai on turn 1 and give you the free retreat cost consistently. Id also play a few prfessor sycamores so if you are stick with bad hand you can Mulligan. I am not big on great ball, cuz its up to chance as well as Giovannis scheme. You could play muscles band for boost or the sycamores would help with draw power.

I added Giovanni in later, because I had pulled a FA, it was quite useful in a pinch but not absolutely necessary. I had thought about Muscle Bands- mainly because I had so many games won against me with them. I'm not a huge fan of Sycamore turn 1 do to discarding an entire hand without means to retrieve any Stage 2's I might have to throw away. However, I can totally see where Sycamore could run well with Dark Patch/Fisherman. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll try it out.

 

[PokeDad5]

Just a question, not saying it to be mean, but what's the goal in this deck. Of course the goal of any deck is to win, but what's the idea/stratedgy here? I understand the BATS and Gengar, but what's the purpose of Darkrai and Mewtwo? Also, the trainers are kid of all over the place, which is why I asked. The hypnotoxic laser is great, but then why run Dimension Valley over a Virbank City Gym? Instead of great ball, try a level ball or Brigette. Also I dont think you'll need pokemon center lady or energy switch with that much energy and running dark patch. Would be nice to add some draw cards in there as well like a Birch or Sycamore. Also, to be more annoying, run Shadow Triad. You can get those Hypnotoxic lazers back for more fun

 

[JadeEspeon]

Just a question, not saying it to be mean, but what's the goal in this deck. Of course the goal of any deck is to win, but what's the idea/stratedgy here? I understand the BATS and Gengar, but what's the purpose of Darkrai and Mewtwo? Also, the trainers are kid of all over the place, which is why I asked. The hypnotoxic laser is great, but then why run Dimension Valley over a Virbank City Gym? Instead of great ball, try a level ball or Brigette. Also I dont think you'll need pokemon center lady or energy switch with that much energy and running dark patch. Would be nice to add some draw cards in there as well like a Birch or Sycamore. Also, to be more annoying, run Shadow Triad. You can get those Hypnotoxic lazers back for more fun

I added Darkrai and Mewtwo because they were cheap. I didn't have a lot of money at the time and I was starting over after selling most of my good stuff in 2013. But also, because Gengar/Bats don't have very good HP. Manectric is Overkill. Since they were all I had that were decent and might run ok with the energy cost, I threw them in. If another, not outrageously expensive EX would pair better- I am looking for it, gimme a suggestion.

Again, as far as Virbank goes- I no longer have one.

Shadow Triad would be a good idea, and also Brigette could work. However, I found when I added Sycamore it did more harm than good.

 

[PokeDad5]

If you want to do poison run Toxicroak EX. It's around $2.50 right now. It'll work with your stadium and it's an easy 3 poison counters per turn. Sycamore is still a very valuable card when you think about what you're trying to do. If you need cards you need cards. I would be willing to dump some things I dont want to rather than sit there drawing cards and not getting anything I need or can use. Plus, add some VS Seekers in there and those supporters you had to discard with sycamore come back to you. Also, look at the new Dragalge for Breakpoint. Pair that with Toxicroak and Gengar, that's a deadly combo. Gengar and BATS dont have a lot of HP but they don't need it. If someone can OHKO an EX they can OHKO the bats and gengar anyway.

 

[JadeEspeon]

If you want to do poison run Toxicroak EX. It's around $2.50 right now. It'll work with your stadium and it's an easy 3 poison counters per turn. Sycamore is still a very valuable card when you think about what you're trying to do. If you need cards you need cards. I would be willing to dump some things I dont want to rather than sit there drawing cards and not getting anything I need or can use. Plus, add some VS Seekers in there and those supporters you had to discard with sycamore come back to you. Also, look at the new Dragalge for Breakpoint. Pair that with Toxicroak and Gengar, that's a deadly combo. Gengar and BATS dont have a lot of HP but they don't need it. If someone can OHKO an EX they can OHKO the bats and gengar anyway.

I think Toxicroak is a great idea.

I have a few of those Dragalge I pulled at a pre-release. I hadn't really looked at them much, but I see what you're saying. And yeah, I guess no risk- no reward as far as Sycamore goes. VS Seeker could help with supporters for sure, but then what about the crucial stage 1 & 2 discards. I mean, sure it's not going to be a game ender everytime but, I don't know, actually, maybe I'm being too cautious here.

 

[PokeDad5]

If you're concerned about having to discard a stage 1 or 2 then run Professor Birch's Observations or Shawna so you can shuffle them back into your deck.

 

[JadeEspeon]

If you're concerned about having to discard a stage 1 or 2 then run Professor Birch's Observations or Shawna so you can shuffle them back into your deck.

It's funny you say that because as I am here brainstorming I think I have a good list to start with on a Toxicroak/Gengar/Bats, I had put in Shauna.

I'm kind of curious if including like a 3-2 or 2-2 line for Dragalge would clunk it up too much or if I should disregard Bats in favor of Dragalge or what.

Also, would Lasers be worth the space with having Toxicroak and Dragalge?

Sometimes, I think over analyzing leads to me wrecking my decklists. XD

 

[TuxedoBlack]

POKEMON:
2 Darkrai EX (DEX)
3 Gastly (BT)
2 Haunter (BT)
2 Gengar (BT)
1 Mewtwo EX (BW 45)
3 Zubat (PHF)
2 Golbat (PHF)
2 Crobat (PHF)

TRAINERS
2 Crushing Hammer
2 Dark Patch
2 Fisherman
2 Energy Switch
3 Great Ball
2 Hypnotoxic Laser
2 Ultra Ball
3 Lysandre
2 N
2 Pokemon Center Lady
2 Rare Candy
2 Wally
1 Giovanni's Scheme
1 Hex Maniac
2 Dimension Valley

ENERGY
2 DCE
7 Dark
8 Psychic

TOTAL: 60

Above was my initial starting point before I made a ton of changes. I just Before BreakPoint I've been manipulating the idea of creating this deck and through numerous play testing and changes to the deck, I've kinda lost it. It's a bit inconsistent, no matter what I change. The basic idea is to maintain zero retreat cost while spreading atleast 30 damage to collect KO's with Gengar. So, my biggest problem with the deck is a constant terrible start. I've tried adding and subtracting things so many times that I kind of lost sight of the consistency. SO. I need to be able to spread damage fast while setting up Genger (as with any deck requiring this much set up-fast.)

First of all, I count 64 (P/17, T/30, E/17) total cards in your current list, not 60.

A few thoughts for your consideration. IMO:

Whenever running multiple, multi-stage Pokémon lines,running a max count of Level Balls are helpful.

The Crushing Hammer, could slow your opponent down, but has 1 50% chance of failure. Without including a max count of these Hammers, your chances definitely diminishes of getting needed favorable flips. These Hammers are really not needed.

2 Fisherman don't seem to "fit" the deck since you're not attaching mulple energy from hand (e.g., Deluge) or you need energy to draw (e.g., Scorched Earth), etc.

Great Ball is too "limiting" given the number of cards in your deck you can view.

Running Hypnotoxic Laser should also be accompanied with Virbank City Gym in order to get maximum effectiveness or were you thinking that most other players will run the VCG Stadium (like me); so, you may not want to include it in your deck?

3 Lysandre seem excessive.

Playing a Wally should result in gaining some type of advantage (e.g., evolving an active Phantump to Trevenant T1). In your case, Wally doesn't yield much at all (vs. a Rare Candy).

Lastly, while you setup, including a starting Pokémon like Yveltal would provide some energy-attachment acceleration and not expose your EX or low HP Pokémon to early damage.

There are only 3 limited, "card-draw" Supporters listed which is woefully insufficient.​

Given the aforementioned comments/observations: following are some suggested changes for your consideration:

-2 Crushing Hammer
-2 Fisherman
-2 Energy Switch - not really needed given strategy's damage requirements
-3 Great Ball
-2 Hypnotoxic Laser
-1 Lysandre
-2 Wally
-1 Hex Maniac - you don't want to shutoff your Pokémon Abilities, I suspect

-2 DC energy - none of Pokémon benefits from this energy
-4 Psychic - to get to a total of 60 cards in your deck

+4 Level Ball - gets access to your Basic and Stage 1 Pokémon fast
+1 Ultra Ball - to help get your Stage 2 and Darkrai EX Pokémon out, as well fuel your discard pile
+4 VS Seeker - helps maximize your utilization of Supporters
+4 Birch / Sycamore
+1 Professor Letter
+3 Yveltal / Trainer's Mail / Super Rod​

I hope you find these comments helpful.

 

[JadeEspeon]

First of all, I count 64 (P/17, T/30, E/17) total cards in your current list, not 60.

A few thoughts for your consideration. IMO:

Whenever running multiple, multi-stage Pokémon lines,running a max count of Level Balls are helpful.

The Crushing Hammer, could slow your opponent down, but has 1 50% chance of failure. Without including a max count of these Hammers, your chances definitely diminishes of getting needed favorable flips. These Hammers are really not needed.

2 Fisherman don't seem to "fit" the deck since you're not attaching mulple energy from hand (e.g., Deluge) or you need energy to draw (e.g., Scorched Earth), etc.

Great Ball is too "limiting" given the number of cards in your deck you can view.

Running Hypnotoxic Laser should also be accompanied with Virbank City Gym in order to get maximum effectiveness or were you thinking that most other players will run the VCG Stadium (like me); so, you may not want to include it in your deck?

3 Lysandre seem excessive.

Playing a Wally should result in gaining some type of advantage (e.g., evolving an active Phantump to Trevenant T1). In your case, Wally doesn't yield much at all (vs. a Rare Candy).

Lastly, while you setup, including a starting Pokémon like Yveltal would provide some energy-attachment acceleration and not expose your EX or low HP Pokémon to early damage.

There are only 3 limited, "card-draw" Supporters listed which is woefully insufficient.​

Given the aforementioned comments/observations: following are some suggested changes for your consideration:

-2 Crushing Hammer
-2 Fisherman
-2 Energy Switch - not really needed given strategy's damage requirements
-3 Great Ball
-2 Hypnotoxic Laser
-1 Lysandre
-2 Wally
-1 Hex Maniac - you don't want to shutoff your Pokémon Abilities, I suspect

-2 DC energy - none of Pokémon benefits from this energy
-4 Psychic - to get to a total of 60 cards in your deck

+4 Level Ball - gets access to your Basic and Stage 1 Pokémon fast
+1 Ultra Ball - to help get your Stage 2 and Darkrai EX Pokémon out, as well fuel your discard pile
+4 VS Seeker - helps maximize your utilization of Supporters
+4 Birch / Sycamore
+1 Professor Letter
+3 Yveltal / Trainer's Mail / Super Rod​

I hope you find these comments helpful.

I was kinda just working with what physical card I had. I had previously stopped playing in 2012/13 and at the time thought I wouldn't have a chance to play in the near future so I sold all of the cards I had that were meta useful. I've been buying booster packs, finding a few cards I had saved, and hitting pre-releases here and there so I didn't have much. I just built on what I did have.

As far as the original deck list idea, I realized that buying singles would be financially possible for me in a few days. So, I've pretty much completely thrown out the old list and started over. I think this topic probably needs to be discontinued.

-------
EDIT: Sorry, I never did address the fact that your post DOES help immensely because there are quite a few new supporters that I'm not all that familiar with. So, the usual mechanics and comparisons are super helpful!

 

[PokeDad5]

Hypnotoxic lazer should always be in a poison deck. Plus like I said, shadow triad and vs seekers, you can player it a lot.

 

[JadeEspeon]

Okayyy, so to wrap things up here... Thanks to everyone who posted and helped me out. This was a severe instance of overworking a deck so many times it got senseless. I really wanted the gengar/bats to happen with 0 retreat. Sometimes we have to sacrifice. I'm currently testing a Toxicroak/gengar/bats/dragalge build that is doing pretty well and I am pleased with it. I used suggestions from pretty much every reply so again, thank you for input!

 

[PokeDad5]

Let us know the results and what what decks you did well against and struggled against.