Genesect EX's one weakness is easily beaten!

R

Ryan Sinclair

4-2-2 at my first Nats, 33rd/151
Member
So I was looking through the Megalo Cannon scans and translations when I realised that one idea I had a while ago is actually the answer to the problems our new big deck is going to face.

Virizion/Genesect (which I've taken to calling ViriGen) is weak to Fire decks which aren't too big right now, but cards like Victini-EX, Reshiram NXD/BLW, or even Moltres NXD are easily teched in to beat ViriGen. Every Fire card is weak to Water, obviously. So the answer would be to play a Water card or two that actually can attack and is easily powered. Keldeo isn't much of an option considering it's attack power is only boosted by Water Energy, and the fact that Grass and Water aren't on the same Blend is a pain.

So, PB community, I give you the card that ViriGen decks could carry a 1-1 line of in tech against Fire cards.

Abomasnow.

AbomasnowMegaloCannon20.jpg


[G][G] - Razor Leaf - 40

[G][G][C] - Bang Heads - 80
Both this Pokémon and the Defending Pokémon are now Confused.

Good Points:
  • It's not Plasma. Silver Mirror is a Tool that can be attached to non-EXs, and it provides full immunity from Plasma Pokémon. This is going to be played a lot in future I imagine, and the fact that Abomasnow is not a Plasma Pokémon means you don't even have to rely on Tool Scrapper to attack like you do for Genesect EX.
  • It's not an EX. And also similarly to this point, it has no Ability. Latias EX/Sigilyph decks are on the rise so this gets around both of those locks, and beats that deck's other main component - Victini EX. What with Suicune being a sort-of new Sigilyph which is looking at being played often, it gets around this too.
  • It does the perfect amount of damage. With Weakness included, Abomasnow does 160 damage, OHKOing Victini EX, Moltres, Reshiram, and with LaserBank, even Entei EX. The only drawback to the Bang Heads attack is completely overlooked thanks to the next point:
  • It's powered by Grass Energy! With Grass Energy attached and Virizion EX in play, your own Abomasnow cannot be Confused (unless Garbodor happens, of course). Also, because it has the same attack cost as Genesect EX, you can work out whether to start powering up a Genesect or your Snover/Abomasnow from your first Emerald Slash. You have the choice of a T2 Megalo Cannon, or a T2 Bang Heads.
Bad Points:
  • The Metal weakness. It has been spread a lot that PlasmaKlang decks will fizzle out with Cobalion NVI and Klinklang BLW being rotated out. Personally I don't think that's the case, I think they're still going to be just as big. Unfortunately, Abomasnow is easily 2HKO'd by Cobalion EX or even OHKO'd with LaserBank, and once the PlasmaKlang is out it's game over for you.
  • It's a Stage 1. The fact this is a bad point just proves what we have for a format, but that's another topic. Starting a lone Snover (which has 70HP and has a minimum attack cost of [C][C]) can cost you the game, or even if you bench it later, it can be Catcher-ed and OHKO'd by a number of different things.
  • It has a 2 Retreat Cost. It's unfortunate enough that it doesn't take advantage of Skyarrow Bridge which this deck plays in numbers, but 2 is the worst. It's too little to be retrieved by Heavy Ball (which this deck wouldn't play, but for other decks it might've worked), and it's annoying to lose 2 energies just to retreat. The deck doesn't need Float Stone because it has Skyarrow, but Abomasnow seems to need it himself.

A bit of a long post, but what does everyone else think?
If you're planning on building ViriGen, do you think you'll tech in Abomasnow? Or are there some even better techs?
 
I like the idea! I dont think a fire tech will give VirGen too much trouble, but if it does than it is worth a try
 
Genesect OHKOs Victini with a single snipe/Virizion attack and direct hit anyway. Abomasnow a stage 1 that requires 3 energy to not even OHKO say, Heatran EX, and if you don't have Virizion out it confuses itself so you can't even guarantee that it'll be able to attack easily the following turn. In addition, its complete wasted space (and Snover is a really bad Pokemon to start with) against anything not running a Fire Pokemon (and even those that are, but w/e). Latias/Sigilyph are on the rise? Where? And this misses the OHKO on Sigilyph and 2HKO on Latias anyway, so whoopdie do. Since when is 160 the perfect number? It hits nothing 150 doesn't, and its a ton worse than 170 and 180. Why are you using Laserbank in Genesect anyway?
 
Dark Void said:
Genesect OHKOs Victini with a single snipe/Virizion attack and direct hit anyway. Abomasnow a stage 1 that requires 3 energy to not even OHKO say, Heatran EX, and if you don't have Virizion out it confuses itself so you can't even guarantee that it'll be able to attack easily the following turn. In addition, its complete wasted space (and Snover is a really bad Pokemon to start with) against anything not running a Fire Pokemon (and even those that are, but w/e). Latias/Sigilyph are on the rise? Where? And this misses the OHKO on Sigilyph and 2HKO on Latias anyway, so whoopdie do. Since when is 160 the perfect number? It hits nothing 150 doesn't, and its a ton worse than 170 and 180. Why are you using Laserbank in Genesect anyway?
Click to expand...

It's not an OHKO if it takes two hits to kill though, between which a Victory Pieced Victini can come out and KO it in one. I accept that being a Stage 1 does suck and does reduce it's playability, but it only requires as much setting up as Genesect does. It would OHKO a Heatran with LaserBank, but then again Heatran is undoubtedly the worst Fire type EX we have and I'm certain we'd be more likely to play Entei or Victini over it, both of which can be OHKO'd by Abomasnow (the former requiring LaserBank). Also, there is no "if you don't have Virizion out", this deck ALWAYS has Virizion out, and if you don't, that should be top priority.
You could say it's wasted space, but if you're only running a 1-1 line, it's not wasting much space at all. Would you rather struggle against a rogue Fire deck, or be able to set up something that can slaughter it? It's a tech at the end of the day, not a main attacker. You don't have to use it. If your opponent plays no Fire, ditch the Snover and Abomasnow with Ultra Ball or something else that discards and you won't need to think about it.
160 is just as good as 150, in fact better in this deck, considering Genesect only does 20 snipe damage, which is enough to finish off a 180HP EX.
Personally, I play LaserBank in Genesect because there's no harm in extra damage output. I only play 1 Virbank due to having 2 Skyarrow, but most of the time the opponent will put down a Virbank anyway.

At the end of the day I know it has it's flaws, but as a mere tech idea against Fire-types in case we actually do see a rise in their play, this is probably the best choice Virizion/Genesect has.
If you have better ideas, I'm willing to listen.
 
There's no need to tech. A stage 1 line of something isn't going to beat fire techs. By the time you see the tech, you won't have time to react, especially with the small amount of search that V/G tends to run. Heatran EX is a notable one because if played as a 1-of in Plasma, in can come out of nowhere and absolutely demolish your field. If they're running an entire deck based around Fire (Victini EX) then you're going to lose anyway, regardless of techs. In all honesty, Virizion/Gensect is extremely overhyped and while it's still a decent deck, it isn't going to be good enough to cause Fire techs to become extremely popular (the only really playable of which is the previously mentioned Heatran EX, which kind of eats through you anyway). Keep in mind that you're assuming you can get Snover the instant you see a fire tech, then get Abomosnow AND an Emerald Slash off in the same turn. That's not going to work every time, making the two very valuable spots not worth it.

As a slight side note, I want to disprove the "just discard it with Ultra Ball" theory. Just because you have a way to waste it doesn't mean those two spots went to good use - as those two spots could have been much more helpful cards that you might need during other games and didn't want to Ultra Ball away. You shouldn't throw bad cards into a deck and claim they're Ultra Ball fodder; because if those were helpful cards, they can still be discarded with Ultra Ball, they just have more uses.
 
I repeat, what are you doing with Laserbank in Genesect? And you claim that Abomasnow OHKOs things that survive it with 10 hp due to Laserbank, but you claim that Genesect doesn't OHKO Victini EX, which it brings down to 10 hp? Like Blah said, a stage 1 means that unless you're dropping Snover in every matchup, you're only playing it once you see a Fire mon; that gives them a turn or two to Catcher and easily KO Snover/Abomasnow before you can actually attack with it.

Most of the time an opponent will put down Virbank? Are you playing against decks that don't include Plasma Blast cards? Laserbank is going to be far less common after Blast is out, and extra damage output actually does hurt if you're sacrificing consistency for it and not reliably getting any notable KOs out of it anyway. In addition, a 1-1 line means that if a deck takes out Snover (which as mentioned above is really hard to stop them from doing) then Abomasnow is a totally useless card for the rest of the game, and if one is prized then the same holds true. This means that most of the time your tech won't actually stop the fire tech anyway.

You should always have Virizion out? Yes, you should, and that's why your opponent will try to stop you from always having a Virizion out. In addition, if they've actually got a working Fire type card then you've probably lost a Virizion to it already (or a Genesect, in which case they take out Virizion while you set up your Snover and then your field is reduced to an Abomasnow, so getting rid of their Fire type doesn't even matter).
 
I dont think you really need a counter to a counter seems like a waste of good space to me but I guess if fire become popular its a viable option.
 
Abomasnow i think will work great but not just for a fire counter. Virizion-ex will stop Ambomasnow 2nd attack affect from happening to itself. Too bad its attack just does 80 damage :(
 
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