Getting jaded with the metagame...or a lack of it

H

hashverda

Aspiring Trainer
Member
Although perhaps the title isn't the most clear of things.

I find myself in a strange situation that I wouldn't mind some opinions on. Having recently got back into the TCG after being away since Fossil (stupidly long time I know), I've come to the conclusion that I play to win. Play to win in the sense that I'd love to go to Nationals, but there's nothing surprising there I suppose, a lot of people do. The thing that annoys me on the other hand is this:

The metagame that surrounds my local area (and unfortunately it's a pretty isolated one) isn't anything close to top tier decks. As an example, I'd say the highest tiered thing that people run there is an overstacked Blastzel variant that would collapse at the first sign of trouble when a tournament glanced in it's direction, but sweeps the field due to a lack of competitive nature in the local community.

*shrug*

I ramble.

Point is, I'm at a crossroads, and I can't work out whether I am being unreasonably frustrated when I look at ways to deal with the situation, and bear in mind I look at these from an investment POV. Options are these:

1. Stop trying to compete in the local metagame and focus purely on higher end competitive play. At the end of the day, I think this is the option that would have the most potential benefit, although with a lack of people to playtest against, it could fall short.

2. Invest in older and/or a wider range of cards so that I can compete locally. Depending on how I balance cash I will probably find I am prioritizing one over the other, but eugh, I honestly don't know.

If you haven't gathered, I'm pretty stumped, and with a local tournament in a couple of weeks, I'm wondering how much I want to invest to actually run a tournament winning deck that can also deal with people in my local. It's also 3 am, so I'll probably throw some more info in when the morning looms if I don't make sense.
 
Sigh. With this worlds passing, I've come to the same stopping point. The game is stale. There is no other way to say it. I have not enjoyed the game since LA came out. I am a VERY competitive person and I enjoy most kinds of competition that I can play in. Competing is greatly enjoyable for me, and this game has previously given me an outlet to compete with. I have not had fun playing casually for years... but the competitions kept me in the game. Now, I feel that I am unable to truly compete as the game is VERY luck based right now. Games should be a little bit luck based, but it is hard to determine who is better than whom when it is VERY possible to have one player have horrible luck. Even so, I have a vested interest in the game as I have met MANY friends through it. Quitting the game would be losing the chance to see all of these friends in real life. Even so, that is the only thing I enjoy about these events now...

I'd recommend you start playing on a wider scale, and if that isn't fun for you, go do something else. You have less of an interest in the game than I have, so it is easier for you to start over and find a new game. Find something you actually enjoy.
 
Trust me, the competitive format is pretty terrible right now. Turn 2 Donkphan/Yanmega shenanigans are not fun to play against. At all.
I'd love to face some Blastzel rather than that, any day.
I usually don't really play for fun all that much (I have little time to go to leagues and whatnot) but I do like to play/judge at tournaments in the weekends, but right now I just don't see it. I refuse to bring a donk deck to a tournament. I'm probably going to wait until BW2 or BW3 is out and hopefully the format slows down a bit, because this is just too stupid.

Prereleases can still be a lot of fun, it lets you learn the new cards from close up. As for going to tournaments, I'd skip a few if you don't want to get donked every match.

Also, "stop trying to compete in the local metagame" is not really an option. A good competitive deck should have a solid plan against mediocre decks, too. You should keep this in mind when building.

About investing, getting a high tier deck is pretty cheap right now. I think you can build TyRam for about 40 bucks, ZPS for even less probably. Depends on your trade material, really. The only expensive card right now is Yanmega, but it's overpriced atm so you shouldn't bother.

(And I agree with Zero for the most part. The format hasn't been very fun for quite a while with Machamp,Vilegar and whatnot.)
 
Zero said:
I'd recommend you start playing on a wider scale, and if that isn't fun for you, go do something else. You have less of an interest in the game than I have, so it is easier for you to start over and find a new game. Find something you actually enjoy.
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Came back due to interest, stayed due to falling in love with it again :). It's just that nice blend of casual and competitiveness that I don't get from M:TG.

The sadist in me makes me want to lean towards PoryDonking my way through the tournament (oh, did I mention that they want to run it unlimited so that it's fair for everyone with older cards?), but at the same time it's just this awkward mash of DP, HGSS and BW that's just hacking me off.

Maybe it's just a rough patch that the game is going through, but from what you're saying and what I've read over the past couple of months, it's been this way for a while. Either way, wasn't intending for this to turn into a state of the game thread. I understand that would get this locked, and I appreciate the conversation.

StealthAngel667 said:
About investing, getting a high tier deck is pretty cheap right now. I think you can build TyRam for about 40 bucks, ZPS for even less probably. Depends on your trade material, really. The only expensive card right now is Yanmega, but it's overpriced atm so you shouldn't bother.
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I actually run a ZPS deck at the moment, or did until I took it apart to test run a Jumpluff explosion which has been working remarkably well. Just find the ZPS playstyle slightly inconsistent, although I may take it to the deck garage to see if there's anything else I can do.

Sometimes I think I invest too much in this game. Then I remember I play EVE.
 
I've been having the same probably as you, except the only league at all is 2 hours away :/ (It's a great league tho) Try playtesting online via PlayTCG, RedShark, or skype, it should help a lot
 
If you're saying the format is stale, its far from it. Many people avoid thinking outside the box when it comes to building a tournament deck. Hence why there are always 2-3 main decks almost year in and year out. Last year it was G-Dos, Luxchomp, and Vilegar. After rotation it appeared to be Magneboar, TyRam, and Megazone. Take a look at the worlds results, the 2nd place deck was the most unique deck ever thought of. Donphan/Zekrom/Reuninclus/ Blissey/Vileplume/SEL/Pichu/etc... Its people like google that make the game fun, people who sit back and think outside the box.
 
Project696 said:
If you're saying the format is stale, its far from it. Many people avoid thinking outside the box when it comes to building a tournament deck. Hence why there are always 2-3 main decks almost year in and year out. Last year it was G-Dos, Luxchomp, and Vilegar. After rotation it appeared to be Magneboar, TyRam, and Megazone. Take a look at the worlds results, the 2nd place deck was the most unique deck ever thought of. Donphan/Zekrom/Reuninclus/ Blissey/Vileplume/SEL/Pichu/etc... Its people like google that make the game fun, people who sit back and think outside the box.
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Sigh. All google did was make a hard meta counter. I wouldn't call that fun: it is winning by metagaming the format. It is not thinking outside of the box, but it is rather choosing hard counters to most of what you see in the format and putting them together. People think outside of the box, but those decks don't seem to work very well very often. A strong format should be one with a large number of meta decks that have good matchups against eachother. Right now, all I see is a giant game of RPS. The winner of a tournament will have played against a large number of decks that his or her deck naturally beat.

Next, a good format should have luck take a back seat to skill. Currently, I have played 1 legit game in this format where both players' skill were put against eachother. Going first is hugely unfair, and the computer is really what decides what wins as decks often have 60-40 matchups and 40-60 matchups rather than 50-50 or 55-45 matchups right now.

Not to make an Ad Hominem attack, but your records don't exactly show that you are a very competitive person, Project. Many players who you hear about care about competition. They want to see how their skills match up against those of other players. These competitive players will choose decks to have the highest chance of beating other players to prove that they are the very best (like no one ever was). Playing more creative decks can be fun from a casual point of view, but decks that are not meta are often not meta for a reason. Most good players will look at most cards that come out and brain storm possible combos and interactions. It isn't a surprise that many of us came up with Magneboar independently at the same time. Creativity comes when a set is released and then the good decks are quickly established. Few "rogue" decks that aren't metacounters do well as they are often dismissed by better players as poor deck choices.
 
I still think the problem with this meta-game is that anything with 120 HP or less is OHKO'ed. Of course I'm new to the game, and it appeared that the Garchomp of last format was unstoppable. Why was it so unstoppable when it hit for 80 as opposed to the 120 of the dragons? (I know it was a snipe). That said, everytime I look at a card that has 120 or less, that seems to have potential... I just look away... half the time 130 seems far too low :(
 
Zero said:
but your records don't exactly show that you are a very competitive person, Project.
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I take offense to that personally. I get back in the game shortly after Arceus is released in 09-10. Attend 1 cities, 1 states, maybe 2 BR's and Nats my first year in. I start 4-1 at nats then finish 4-5.

Then this year I didn't have the opportunity to attend many tournaments due to working 3rd shift and starting my work week on sunday nights. attended 2 BR's (1 spring 1 autumn). Did 50-50 there. attended maybe 1 or 2 cities, finished under .500 there. 2 states,50-50 across two states. then regionals where I went 5-3 swiss with a 5-0 start and then lost in top 32 to the eventual winner of the tournament. Records don't show competitive-ness. Not to mention still being semi-green but semi-knowledgable person to the game I've had to face quite a few tough opponents on the way to where I am today such as Chris Fulop and Joey Gannon on a regular basis.

And while google's deck was anti-meta it was still a rogue that involved outside the box thinking.Look at HoPe or whatever that deck was called a year or two back, it was completely rogue but it was an anti-meta deck. And to say he didn't think outside the box to make this deck is a load of bull. If he wasn't thinking outside the box, he would've done what every other player at worlds would've done, taken a deck thats known to be good, TyRam, Megazone, etc.. and play that. But he didn't, he created a rogue and performed amazing with it.
 
why dont we just nag pokemon to release new sets quicker. i mean the format would change more so you would have to build more decks but at least you wouldnt have to stick with one crappy format. i started playing when SV came out and that remains my favorite set so i still play cards from it aside from pokemon organized play and that works fine even if the real tcg format sucks
 
The format is stale because most players these days net deck. They see what is legitmatly good then build it and learn the deck. Thinking is for players who want to find different avenues to winning. I myself do not like net decking or even going with the flow. As I see it as a waste of time just being cookie cutter and my modified legal deck uses cards most often not seen. Like Slowking and vileplume where I literally dictate your deck to you and it is consistent and a complete lock even against magnezone as I fill your hand with stuff you can not use. It is plays like this that makes me like the game. Where thinking outside of a box is normal and not seeing whats inside. That is my motto and I am sticking to it.
 
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