Pokemon Gym Leaders Based on Things Other Than Typing

[Blob55]

I think it would be interesting if there was a Generation where Gym Leaders use Pokémon based on Species, like Cats and Dogs, or based on Class, like Mammals and Reptiles. Or maybe even a mix of Type and Class/Order?

Here's what I think:

Janine: Venomoth, Dustox, Beedrill and Ninjask. This way she keeps her Venomoth and all her Pokémon are winged bugs. Most of which are known for being part Poison.

Brock: Onix and Golem - Rocky Reptiles

Misty: Starmie and Clefairy - Starry Pokémon

Lt. Surge: Electivire and Raichu - Both are of the Euarchontoglires Superorder

Erika: Vileplume, Bellossom and Venusaur - All of their flowers are based on Rafflesia

Koga: Crobat and Swoobat - Bat Pokémon

Sabrina - Alakazam and Conkeldurr - Humanoid Pokémon which carry two of the same object

Blaine - Arcanine, Houndoom and Mightyena - Canine Pokémon

Giovanni - Rhyperior, Nidoqueen and Nidoking - Rhino Pokémon

Blue - Pidgeot, Machamp and Exeggutor - No preference


The attachment is Pokémon by Animal Order.

 

[Leaf_Ranger]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

While I think that's a good idea, I also think that sometimes it wouldn't be understood by players and so it shouldn't be implemented. Some people already have trouble knowing the myths or creatures behind some Pokémon and species wouldn't be different, though to a lesser extent.
I think the next step in gym leaders' evolution would be to have them battling with Pokémon not just from one type (thought it would difficult things, even more when thinking that some Pokémon already have two types).

 

[Axell Starr]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

What about colour? Like all yellow pokemon or all white ones?

Also, theming them to seasons or desaters would me interesting. Like a hurricane themed gym leader can have flying, electric, and water types.

 

[Blob55]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

You can make up your own Gyms if you want.

 

[AlexanderTheAwesome]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

What is a Euarchontoglires Superorder?
Also why are wigglytuff and exploud in non living?

 

[Seven is a Color]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

In Pokemon Colosseum and XD, there was the pre gym leader who seemed to have an evasion theme. His Pokemon used a lot of techniques to increase their evasiveness (and even further, his Sandslash had the Sand Veil ability). I think it would be cool to have Gym Leaders that focus on a certain stat like that. In addition, they could use moves to lower your stats as well. For example, not only would a Gym Leader raise their own Defense, they would lower your Attack as well.

 

[Their Goominess]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

I agree with Leaf_Ranger; it would be confusing to young players.

I think the first thing is to do as a step in this direction would be to include more than one type in a Gym, but have themes, so it's like having a range of types that all fit the theme.

Something like a tropics theme which could include Water types (Milotic and Ludicolo come to mind), Grass types, and a few other Pokemon.

They could even go and do something like a construction site or a factory, or maybe some sort of haunted-house-of-mirrors which included Psychic, Dark and Ghost types - the idea could be that all the types could play mind games.

 

[Blob55]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

Maybe there could be something like the BF, but with people who fight with their faviourite kind of Pokémon?

1st Gym: Persian, Purugly, Purrloin, Luxray, Pyroar and Meowstic - Cat Pokémon
2nd Gym: Sandslash, Sunflora, Lunatone, Mothim, Cofagrigus and Heliolisk - Yellow Pokémon
3rd Gym: Vespiquen, Slowking, Kingdra, Nidoking, Nidoqueen and Empoleon - Royal Pokémon
4th Gym: Stantler, Jynx, Delibird, Dragonite, Lapras and Abomasnow - Christmas Themed Pokémon
5th Gym: Sawsbuck, Alomomola, Bouffalant, Crustle, Braviary and Scolipede - Zodiac Pokémon
6th Gym: Whimsicott, Klefki, Gourgeist, Ninetales, Banette and Florges - Light Pokémon
7th Gym: Simipour, Snorlax, Dunsparce, Relicanth, Musharna and Bronzong - Pokémon with closed eyes
8th Gym: Cloyster, Torkoal, Escavalier, Torterra, Kingler, Scizor - Shelled Pokémon

---

What is a Euarchontoglires Superorder?
Also why are wigglytuff and exploud in non living?

Wigglytuff is a balloon and Exploud is a pipe organ.

Euarchontoglires Superorder contains animals from the Rodentia, Lagaomorpha, Scandentia, Dermoptera and Primates Orders.
It's basically Rats, Hamsters, Squirrels, Rabbits, Tree Shrews, Lemurs, Apes, Monkeys and Humans.

 

[Cinesra]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

^Tyrantrum is more royal than Kingdra

I feel like Weezing, Castform, Rotom, and Cofagrigus should be non-living instead of amorphous because they all have a fairly defined shape and are based on inanimate objects(naval mine, those Japanese forecast dolls, haunted appliances, and a sarcophagus) as opposed to amorphous things. Garbodor and maybe Vanilluxe should be amorphous instead. How did you decide that Blaziken is a bird, but Aromatisse and Hawlucha are humanoid? I feel like they're about the same level of human vs bird. Nitpicks aside, good list.

An idea I haven't seen mentioned in this thread is playstyles. For example, a leader that uses offensive pokemon, defensive pokemon, entry hazards and pokemon with defiant/competitive/ghost types/roar/dragon tail/red card/whirlwind, various weather types, baton pass, trick room, etc.

Also we need a gym leader who only uses pokemon with hats. Ludicolo, Honchkrow, Mismagius, Slowking, Cacturne, Probopass, Breloom, and Lilligant.

 

[Juliacoolo]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

The issue with this is that Gym Leaders are given types so that players will develop strategy skills to overcome such challenges. Whether that be using a certain TM, making some party changes, or even adjusting play style, type-based gym leaders foster a competitive dynamic that cosmetic-themed gym leaders would not.

 

[Blob55]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

^Tyrantrum is more royal than Kingdra

Garbodor and maybe Vanilluxe should be amorphous instead. How did you decide that Blaziken is a bird, but Aromatisse and Hawlucha are humanoid? I feel like they're about the same level of human vs bird. Nitpicks aside, good list.

I was thinking about putting Garbodor in Amorphous, but it's based on garbage, which inanimate. Also, as for Vanilluxe, I'm pretty sure it's just a sold lump of ice, with a light covering of snow.

I find Aromatisse and Hawlucha humanoid, because they don't have proper beaks and one is obviously based on a cancan dancer. In fact, their beats are more like noses.

---

While I think that's a good idea, I also think that sometimes it wouldn't be understood by players and so it shouldn't be implemented. Some people already have trouble knowing the myths or creatures behind some Pokémon and species wouldn't be different, though to a lesser extent.
I think the next step in gym leaders' evolution would be to have them battling with Pokémon not just from one type (thought it would difficult things, even more when thinking that some Pokémon already have two types).

I agree with Leaf_Ranger; it would be confusing to young players.

The issue with this is that Gym Leaders are given types so that players will develop strategy skills to overcome such challenges. Whether that be using a certain TM, making some party changes, or even adjusting play style, type-based gym leaders foster a competitive dynamic that cosmetic-themed gym leaders would not.

But I'm talking about post-game here, not main game. Like maybe a Post-Game team for Gym Leaders won't involve specific types.

 

[Leaf_Ranger]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

^Tyrantrum is more royal than Kingdra

Garbodor and maybe Vanilluxe should be amorphous instead. How did you decide that Blaziken is a bird, but Aromatisse and Hawlucha are humanoid? I feel like they're about the same level of human vs bird. Nitpicks aside, good list.

I was thinking about putting Garbodor in Amorphous, but it's based on garbage, which inanimate. Also, as for Vanilluxe, I'm pretty sure it's just a sold lump of ice, with a light covering of snow.

I find Aromatisse and Hawlucha humanoid, because they don't have proper beaks and one is obviously based on a cancan dancer. In fact, their beats are more like noses.

---

While I think that's a good idea, I also think that sometimes it wouldn't be understood by players and so it shouldn't be implemented. Some people already have trouble knowing the myths or creatures behind some Pokémon and species wouldn't be different, though to a lesser extent.
I think the next step in gym leaders' evolution would be to have them battling with Pokémon not just from one type (thought it would difficult things, even more when thinking that some Pokémon already have two types).

I agree with Leaf_Ranger; it would be confusing to young players.

The issue with this is that Gym Leaders are given types so that players will develop strategy skills to overcome such challenges. Whether that be using a certain TM, making some party changes, or even adjusting play style, type-based gym leaders foster a competitive dynamic that cosmetic-themed gym leaders would not.

But I'm talking about post-game here, not main game. Like maybe a Post-Game team for Gym Leaders won't involve specific types.

---

If that's the case then it's more acceptable!
I'll give my opinions regarding your lists and while they (my opinions) try to fit the species theme, they should have attacks that fit the gym leaders' type:
- Janine could also have Mothim and Volcarona beside Venomoth and Dustox (only moths);
- Koga could also have Noibat (too bad the only Poison attack it can learn is Toxic but it's still better than nothing and it would be unexpected to see Koga using one);
- the Cat Pokémon gym could have Delcatty, perhaps leave Pyroar and Luxray (they seem more like big cats);
- the Royal Pokémon...you seem wanting to add Pokémon with some royal title in their names but since you've added Empoleon, I have to suggest Serperior!
- Christmas...perhaps add Jirachi or Staryu/Starmie?
- The Zodiac: I think it should be more faithful and not just Isshu's style. Drapion should be Scorpio and while at it, why not also have the Chinese Zodiac!?

PS: I would like to see Pike Queen Lucy return with a team full of cobras/snakes (bah, Wikipedia is even more confusing and I'm Portuguese! -_-' ) - Seviper, Arbok, Serperior, Onix/Steelix, Dunsparce.

---

^Tyrantrum is more royal than Kingdra

I feel like Weezing, Castform, Rotom, and Cofagrigus should be non-living instead of amorphous because they all have a fairly defined shape and are based on inanimate objects(naval mine, those Japanese forecast dolls, haunted appliances, and a sarcophagus) as opposed to amorphous things. Garbodor and maybe Vanilluxe should be amorphous instead. How did you decide that Blaziken is a bird, but Aromatisse and Hawlucha are humanoid? I feel like they're about the same level of human vs bird. Nitpicks aside, good list.

An idea I haven't seen mentioned in this thread is playstyles. For example, a leader that uses offensive pokemon, defensive pokemon, entry hazards and pokemon with defiant/competitive/ghost types/roar/dragon tail/red card/whirlwind, various weather types, baton pass, trick room, etc.

Also we need a gym leader who only uses pokemon with hats. Ludicolo, Honchkrow, Mismagius, Slowking, Cacturne, Probopass, Breloom, and Lilligant.

In the name of Arceus, not Roar and Whirlwind! Either the game would have to allow us to catch Pokémon with Suction Cups or Ingrain or...yeah, I really can't see how I would escape that nightmare of having my Pokémon being switched out! It would be sooo frustating! I've had enough of Hoenn's Pelliper with Protect, Gigalith with Sturdy...Just yesterday I fought Cilan in the PWT and my team was Krookodile, Magnezone and Serperior: our last Pokémon were my Serperior with some damage from Ferrothorn's barbs (and good thing that I had paralysed it or my Serperior would have lost most certainly) and his Maractus and we had something like the fight between Ash's and the Samurai's Metapod but with my Giga Drain and Maractus' Synthesis with a couple of Sucker Punch...In the end Maractus' Petal Dance wasn't enough, my Serperior used his ability Overgrown and then Leaf Storm took care of it but it sure was quite tense!

Pokémon with hats? Do berets also count, because Smeargle seems to be wearing one!?

 

[Blob55]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

I was thinking about putting Garbodor in Amorphous, but it's based on garbage, which inanimate. Also, as for Vanilluxe, I'm pretty sure it's just a sold lump of ice, with a light covering of snow.

I find Aromatisse and Hawlucha humanoid, because they don't have proper beaks and one is obviously based on a cancan dancer. In fact, their beats are more like noses.

---

But I'm talking about post-game here, not main game. Like maybe a Post-Game team for Gym Leaders won't involve specific types.

---

If that's the case then it's more acceptable!
I'll give my opinions regarding your lists and while they (my opinions) try to fit the species theme, they should have attacks that fit the gym leaders' type:
- Janine could also have Mothim and Volcarona beside Venomoth and Dustox (only moths);
- Koga could also have Noibat (too bad the only Poison attack it can learn is Toxic but it's still better than nothing and it would be unexpected to see Koga using one);
- the Cat Pokémon gym could have Delcatty, perhaps leave Pyroar and Luxray (they seem more like big cats);
- the Royal Pokémon...you seem wanting to add Pokémon with some royal title in their names but since you've added Empoleon, I have to suggest Serperior!
- Christmas...perhaps add Jirachi or Staryu/Starmie?
- The Zodiac: I think it should be more faithful and not just Isshu's style. Drapion should be Scorpio and while at it, why not also have the Chinese Zodiac!?

PS: I would like to see Pike Queen Lucy return with a team full of cobras/snakes (bah, Wikipedia is even more confusing and I'm Portuguese! -_-' ) - Seviper, Arbok, Serperior, Onix/Steelix, Dunsparce.

---

Noibat is unevolved, so I don't count it. Its evolution is also clearly a Wyvern.
Delcatty is the worst of the cats and it's so bad that I don't think even a Gym Leader should use one.
Empoleon is based on an Emperor penguin, but with a crown. I don't really think Serperior is all that royal outside of PPWii2.
I was going to have Starmie for the Christmas theme, but I didn't think anyone would get it.
I know that the Isshu Zodiac isn't that good, but I thought I'd better go with that one, as it only has 8 FE Pokémon, instead of 12, which would mean I'd need 2 trainers who specialized in it.

 

[Leaf_Ranger]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

If that's the case then it's more acceptable!
I'll give my opinions regarding your lists and while they (my opinions) try to fit the species theme, they should have attacks that fit the gym leaders' type:
- Janine could also have Mothim and Volcarona beside Venomoth and Dustox (only moths);
- Koga could also have Noibat (too bad the only Poison attack it can learn is Toxic but it's still better than nothing and it would be unexpected to see Koga using one);
- the Cat Pokémon gym could have Delcatty, perhaps leave Pyroar and Luxray (they seem more like big cats);
- the Royal Pokémon...you seem wanting to add Pokémon with some royal title in their names but since you've added Empoleon, I have to suggest Serperior!
- Christmas...perhaps add Jirachi or Staryu/Starmie?
- The Zodiac: I think it should be more faithful and not just Isshu's style. Drapion should be Scorpio and while at it, why not also have the Chinese Zodiac!?

PS: I would like to see Pike Queen Lucy return with a team full of cobras/snakes (bah, Wikipedia is even more confusing and I'm Portuguese! -_-' ) - Seviper, Arbok, Serperior, Onix/Steelix, Dunsparce.

Noibat is unevolved, so I don't count it. Its evolution is also clearly a Wyvern.
Delcatty is the worst of the cats and it's so bad that I don't think even a Gym Leader should use one.
Empoleon is based on an Emperor penguin, but with a crown. I don't really think Serperior is all that royal outside of PPWii2.
I was going to have Starmie for the Christmas theme, but I didn't think anyone would get it.
I know that the Isshu Zodiac isn't that good, but I thought I'd better go with that one, as it only has 8 FE Pokémon, instead of 12, which would mean I'd need 2 trainers who specialized in it.

I didn't noticed that you only included evolved Pokémon :shy:
I don't like Delcatty either but it exists...someone somewhere might like it! XD
About Serperior, I was thinking about its..."title" as the Regal Pokémon and its "Rose of Versailles" inspiration!

 

[Blob55]

RE: Gym Leaders Based on Things other than Type

Noibat is unevolved, so I don't count it. Its evolution is also clearly a Wyvern.
Delcatty is the worst of the cats and it's so bad that I don't think even a Gym Leader should use one.
Empoleon is based on an Emperor penguin, but with a crown. I don't really think Serperior is all that royal outside of PPWii2.
I was going to have Starmie for the Christmas theme, but I didn't think anyone would get it.
I know that the Isshu Zodiac isn't that good, but I thought I'd better go with that one, as it only has 8 FE Pokémon, instead of 12, which would mean I'd need 2 trainers who specialized in it.

I didn't noticed that you only included evolved Pokémon :shy:
I don't like Delcatty either but it exists...someone somewhere might like it! XD
About Serperior, I was thinking about its..."title" as the Regal Pokémon and its "Rose of Versailles" inspiration!

Well, except for Onix.
I like Delcatty, it's just really bad.

---

^Tyrantrum is more royal than Kingdra

I feel like Weezing, Castform, Rotom, and Cofagrigus should be non-living instead of amorphous because they all have a fairly defined shape and are based on inanimate objects(naval mine, those Japanese forecast dolls, haunted appliances, and a sarcophagus) as opposed to amorphous things. Garbodor and maybe Vanilluxe should be amorphous instead. How did you decide that Blaziken is a bird, but Aromatisse and Hawlucha are humanoid? I feel like they're about the same level of human vs bird. Nitpicks aside, good list.

I didn't mention this before, but Blaziken is based on a fighting Chicken and it has a proper beak. Also, if you look at Bulbapedia, you can see that it's based on many different birds, like a Phoenix and Basan.

Castform and Rotom constantly change shape depending on their environment or what's near them.
Cofagrigus seems to be able to expand and contract its arms, so the actual Pokémon inside the sarcophagus may not have a proper form, or it can loosely change its own shape.
As for Weezing, its Egg Group is Amorphous.

 

[Juliacoolo]

Speaking strictly post-game, you have more of an argument. And in fact, I think your proposal has already happened to a degree. The Frontier Brains, while not exactly gym leaders, had the theme-centric teams that you alluded to. I would not be surprised if a third XY installment has a similar post-game mechanism.

 

[Blob55]

Speaking strictly post-game, you have more of an argument. And in fact, I think your proposal has already happened to a degree. The Frontier Brains, while not exactly gym leaders, had the theme-centric teams that you alluded to. I would not be surprised if a third XY installment has a similar post-game mechanism.

But their themes weren't Pokémon specific, they were just the rules you fought them by.

 

[Juliacoolo]

I think they were Pokemon-specific. Pike Queen Lucy had that "Edgy Beauty" theme going with her Seviper and Milotic. Brandon had an "Ancient Powers" theme with the pyramids and the Regiis. It's not completely theme-based, but I think one could make a solid argument that there are some thematic elements included.

 

[Blob55]

I think they were Pokemon-specific. Pike Queen Lucy had that "Edgy Beauty" theme going with her Seviper and Milotic. Brandon had an "Ancient Powers" theme with the pyramids and the Regiis. It's not completely theme-based, but I think one could make a solid argument that there are some thematic elements included.

Well what about themes for already existing Gym Leaders? ORAS could have:

Roxanne: Probopass, Glalie, Cryogonal and Electrode - Pokémon with big faces.
Brawly: Hariyama, Hitmonchan, Hitmonlee, Sawk, Throh and Hawlucha - These Pokémon are known for real world fighting styles.
Wattson: Mega Manectric, Tauros, Krookodile, Hitmontop, and Arbok - Pokémon with Intimidate.
Flannery: Torkoal, Torterra, Carracosta and Mega Blastoise - Turtle and Tortoise Pokémon.
Norman: Slaking, Archeops, Aromatisse and Mega Alakazam - Mix of Pokémon with bad Abilities and Skill Swap. Double Battle.
Winona: Altaria, Noivern, Mega Aerodactyl, Jumpluff and Yanmega - Different kinds of Flying Type Pokémon
Tate: Solrock, Braviary and Mega Sableye
Liza: Lunatone, Mandibuzz and Mega Mawile
Wallace: Milotic, Mega Gyarados and Wailord - Very long/big Pokémon (Also part of his normal team in Emerald)
Juan: Kingdra, Mega Gardevoir, Aegislash and Machamp - Kingdra and Gardevoir only learn Special and Status level up moves, while Aegislash Machamp only learn Physical and Status moves. They're all also part of a three-stage evolution.

 

[Blob55]

What about a GL who specializes in vertebrates? Or maybe even an E4 team who have specific Pokémon they like.