CASE ON BBNINJAS BUT FIRST A COUPLE POSTS I DIDN'T LIKE
Ah yes because I wouldn't just say that to him in scumchat if we were buddies
Really scummy wifom here.
Looking at that post a second time (Lele's), it does seem kind of off to me as well.
Backpedal after you got called out.
If bolding were less of a hassle on my phone I'd vote Lele. As is I'll do it tomorrow 9.9
Bolding is easy; tap the B to turn it on, tap it again to take it off. This is a flimsy excuse to not vote your scum pal.
AND NOW THE CASE ON BBNINJAS
Regarding Tapu Lele, I don't this role-fishing indicates that he's mafian. Lele seems to have thought through exactly what information he wanted to achieve (and how he wanted to use that to scumhunt), and so I think he had innocent intentions for asking for a semi-claim.
Tapu Lele made a huge blunder by blatantly role fishing, so bbninjas goes into damage control mode...
Also, do you think you should share anything related to the reward you won from the Certamen? And before people jump on me for role-fishing, I'm asking because I didn't have the time or motivation spare to look up any answers (and even guess them), but if the rewards are particularly powerful, we should all be putting in the effort as to keep the prizes out of mafian hands.
... but bbninjas role fishes here like a pro in the same exact post. Note that he goes into damage control before anyone even calls him out - gotta make sure you look town 100% of the time.
Well, why would you want a sneak peak? Why would you want T_E to divulge the answer? I would also assume that you would only ask such a question if you thought that it was a good idea; if you asked the question and thought it was a bad idea, then that's a bit scummy.
bbninjas grills jplap for asking T_E about his certamen reward, conveniently forgetting he did the same thing earlier that day.
On a different note, I'm not getting good vibes from scattered at all. The problem is, I haven't seen enough for him to decipher between what may be just a bad first impression, and an actual lead. He just seems to be going after Lele for all of the wrong reasons. Thoughts?
More damage control. He is defending Tapu Lele hard.
Celever, what's the difference between your earlier position regarding Tapu Lele, and your later position regarding T_E? Both theories suggested that said player was being helped via the scumchat, but you decided that Lele's was unsubstantiated, whereas T_E's was substantiated. You additionally concluded that T_E's claim had to be an alibi, even though the scenario was highly WIFOMy, and you didn't give any evidence as to why one way or the other.*
Before anyone says that I'm trying to abuse hindsight, in light of TE's flip,
I had already voiced something along these lines (second last paragraph).
Emphasis mine; this is bbninjas's first post in day two, after Tapu Lele was revealed to be scum. Note again how bbninjas is trying hard to make himself appear town by answering questions no one has asked yet and defending himself against accusations no one has levied against him. It's a massively scummy way of thinking and he has gone out of his way to discredit the idea that Tapu Lele is scum.
His vote for Tapu Lele is a formality at this point because he knows there's realistically no way Tapu Lele is getting out of today alive, so he votes just so he can say that he was one of the first people on the wagon.
This means that the mafians will be trying to mislead, get the wrong people lynched, direct attention to other people, causing disturbances / interruptions in the discussion and whatever other means it takes to avoid getting lynched.
The irony here is palpable.
You made an defense (by questioning) very early in the game that basically echoed the type of question that I would ask. I then explain why this would be the case - I gave you this advice in Mafia 50. The odd thing is that you then claimed to have found this argument by looking at guides, and then checked multiple past games, discovering that I used this line of reasoning often. That's just a very convoluted explanation on your part. The problem? I don't see why you would give such a convoluted explanation as either alignment.
Distancing was the entire discussion topic of Gekki's posts, so it's still pretty fresh in my mind
Do you mean the distancing topic that was discussing back in early Day 1?? That was 5+ days ago, I have no idea why that would still be pretty fresh in your mind.
Yeah I see you're point, but I'm still learning, and these things leave an impression on me, you know?
There is no way this exchange between Tapu Lele and bbninjas wasn't orchestrated in the scum chat beforehand.
Why do you think there should be FoS on Cel if or because Lele flips scum? What about defending a mafian Lele actually indicates that Celever is a scumbuddy? In this situation, when its been publicly revealed that a scumbuddy is a mafian, scumbuddies generally won't defend them and try get someone lynched - most mafians would just cut their losses and go along with it.
This is WIFOM of the highest and most sacred order and you know it. That said, I also have to thank you for confirming Celever is your scum partner here. How do I know this? Because you're going out of your way to explain yourself to dos, who doesn't need you to explain basic mafia strategy to him. He's been in plenty of games and hosted at least once.
If not you, who do you think should be lynched today? I'm very specific about saying "who should be lynched" instead of "who do you think is scummy", by the way - I'm of the mind that you should absolutely and definitely be lynched at this point, even if I'm feeling increasingly uncertain about what you will flip.
Emphasis mine. bb asks Tapu Lele who should be lynched, if not him, despite thinking he should "absolutely and definitely be lynched at this point."
RE: whether or not the Lele flip is fake; I think there's a decent possibility simply because Lele has been defending really quite well, honestly, especially for their experience. Eitherway, here's the scenarios that I've thought of, none of which I would consider particularly bastard, as it would serve as something of balance, especially if this game is high-information:
Uh oh, deadline's approaching and everyone still wants Tapu Lele dead. bbninjas then lists off reason after reason to doubt Tapu Lele's lynch (but remains firmly seated on his wagon so he won't look like he was buddying
too hard), even going so far as to suggest that NP and Vracken are bastard mods because that is the last flimsy line of defense the scum team has at this point.
Then bb goes into a list of do's and don'ts:
- DO claim your role if you're about be lynched or if you've caught a likely / confo-scum
- DO only ever claim the parts of your role that need to be claimed in that context.
- DO claim fully ONLY if you're about to be lynched, and if doing so helps the town make a better decision.
- DO be vague when specifics are not needed. Telling the town that your Ability relates to the Certamen should not trigger mechanics. Telling the town that you have an investigative role should not trigger mechanics. Apart from being utterly absurd, basically everyone will have vagued their role by Day 3 / 4, which would make such a mechanic far too abusable (and I trust that our hosts will not make this game broken).
- DO tell half-truths when claiming information. i.e. If you're a seer, you could claim being a dreamer, or that you got that information from someone else
- DO NOT claim your role name unless necessary
- DO NOT claim your role unless doing so gives significant information that directly improves the scumhunt
- DO NOT be specific or obvious about any hints that you give to the thread about your role. OR, don't hint at all.
Emphasis mine. He is trying insanely hard to appear pro-town and helpful here, but his behavior over the past two days has been the opposite. Remember that he got on jplap's case about asking T_E to clarify his certamen reward.
As for the bolded, bb, how are you going to trust the mods to make a balanced game but still have bastard mechanics? After all, having a mod say that as scum role belongs to someone who is not scum is awfully bastard. You can't have it both ways; either they're bastard mods or they aren't.
And then after this Tapu Lele goes of and makes a needlessly gigantic post about his reads, which we are real close to finding out are complete bullshit. It's a farce. Him, bbninjas, and Celever are all wasting the town's time and this hammer needs to happen ASAP.
When Tapu Lele flips scum, bbninjas dies day 3. He is 100% scum alongside Tapu Lele. Celever can die day 4.
Also reminder that someone apparently tried to kill dos. That's going to be something that's conveniently forgot later, I bet.
Also
@Luxinity what is your opinion on the game? As a mod-confirmed town, your opinions actually hold weight.
