Discussion Mienshao FFI 57 Hit and Run

Duane Fouche

Duane Fouche

Aspiring Trainer
Member
Hi All,

I played Pokemon a long time ago in the past and never really got competitive with it but I recently picked up playing again online and don't have too many cards at my disposal, so I'm looking for a powerful strategy that's easy to obtain the cards for. At least so I have a decent deck until I can start earning the rarer cards.

When browsing through the theme decks one strategy did seem to be decent, and that's using 2x Mienshao's as your main attacker. As they return themselves to your hand after attacking you can basically just cycle between 2 of them over and over again, essentially making them un-killable except by 1-hit KO. The only other way to deal with them is by inflicting a crippling status ailment that can stop the attack long enough to finish them. Alternatively, they have to be killed on the bench.

One other obvious flaw is the low damage output, as Aero Turn can only do 40 damage. This can be offset quite well though by using "Strong Energy", "Muscle Band" and "Machamp (Furious Fists 46)". After a few buffs you can up your damage to 100 a turn. The "Fighting Stadium" stadium card can further increase this to 120 against EX pokemon. That's up to 120 potential damage... for 1 energy.
It may be worth noting that Mienshao returns all cards attached to to your hand it as well, so tools do work pretty well with the combo. I'm not really worried about resistance, as I can win any damage race if they can't 1-hit KO me.

The reason I picked this strategy is because many of the cards I need can be found in the "Dark Hammer" them deck, so it's easy to start building.

Some notable cards that could be useful in the deck:
-Wally = Allows you to begin attacking on turn 1, but note that you will have to put a mienfoo as your active pokemon after an aero turn rather than an already fully evolved mienshao (so easier to KO).
-Evo Soda = Can find Mienshao if you have Mienfoo on the board already.
-Korrina = Probably the best all-round trainer card for this deck. Can search for your pieces as well as some extra utility.
-Strong Energy, Muscle band, Fighting Stadium = Offsets the low damage output of Aero Turn
-Training Center = Make's it harder to 1-hit KO your Mienshao
-Mountain Ring = Protection against bench damage.
-Machamp (Furious Fists 46) = Extra damage for Mienshao, and a good pokemon all-round as well.
-Hitmonlee (Furious Fists 47) = Let's you get their back row if they've been switching for very little energy. Also benefits from the power boosts.

Pro's:
-Can Start attacking early
-Difficult to kill
-"Auto-Win" against decks that don't have a way to deal with you

Con's:
-Low Damage Output by default
-Vulnerable to 1-hit KOs
-Once the combo has started you're giving up your energy play for your turns.

I'm not in the loop on the current competitive decks however, so I would appreciate some constructive criticism on the idea. Please if you can see any glaring problems, or have any suggestions on how to build up from the basic idea I would love to hear it.
 
I have a deck like this (I call it the kicking deck) and it's fun to play with. Korrina makes it ridiculously easy to get Machamp into play, or get more 'shaos going, or search out whatever tool you like... it's very easy to get your damage up very quickly. The 90HP is a problem, but Training Center helps with that too.

One thing that might be worth considering it to run some Focus Sash. If you think the opponent can 1-shot your follow-up shao (or if you're not ready yet and you need to promote a foo), focus sash can soak a hit as long as you're not hurt yet. If they destroy the sash, you can then go ahead and plop a muscle band down in its place, recycle the whole thing with your kicks (well, Aero Turns) and keep the wheel turning. Repeat Ball might be a worthwhile card too, since Korrina can search it out and turn it into yet another Pokemon.

The deck is really vulnerable to disruption though. Catcher/Lysander can pick off your benched meinfoo, messing up your rhythm. And if the opponent plays an N, it's devastating. You need backup kickers in play already in case they blow away your hand. And lasers make Focus Sash useless. Those are all really common threats, so the deck isn't as difficult to kill as it sounds.
 
And that is why I wanted some opinions, thank you kind sir for your insight.

Was actually looking for a card exactly like Focus sash, didn't realize they made it in the TCG too.

N is definitely going to hurt, but it isn't as devastating as you say. As long as I have a single Mienshao out I can continue the assault.
The deck doesn't actually need 2x Mienshao, just 1 works fine - but I do need 2x Mienfoo.
I didn't realize Lysander and Pokemon catcher where actually played cards (they looked like theme deck level cards to my untrained eyes, so I overlooked them. Pokemon Catcher especially due to the coin toss nature).

By "Laser" do you mean "Hypnotoxic Laser"?
... Yeah, that is a thing. Definitely a threat, but the sleep isn't always guaranteed so at least I can attack in if they can't finish the job somehow.

I could include a secondary line of cheap attackers into the deck via an interesting colorless basic pokemon - Miltank (Flashfire 83). Complementing it with Togekiss and a few Wally's for fast evolution could potentially let it attack in as early as turn 1 for heavy damage. It's also easy to set up with only 1 energy if my Mienshao's get removed (and I'll have access to 2 different stage 2 pokemon via Machamp and Togekiss to make sure it's active) so they can make the strategy less "all in".

Is there some way i can search for pokemon with powers currently available in standard? Going through every single card in standard is not my idea of fun for now.
 
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The thing with using Focus Sash and Training Centre is that Muscle Band and Fighting Stadium are nearly required techs for this deck to hit enough damage. Focus Sash probably could be excused (I see its good uses), and you could even tech a single Masquerian PLB to swap around Bands and Sashes, if you have enough space.

With Laser, I believe what Spiffo meant is that it messes up Focus Sash.

I don't think Mountain Ring (or Training Center) are good plays. Fighting Stadium would make more sense, as it can rack even more damage against EXs, possibly allowing you getting good 1-hit KOs.

Hawlucha FuF. This card would be great in this deck. After you Aero Turn, you could put out this for free retreat. Hawlucha is also a great EX attack, hitting EXs for 100 damage with just a Strong, Band and Fighting Stadium! Robo Subs and Safeguarders would also be good techs for the deck, as you can promote them once you attack safer and sometimes easier to block.

I'm not sure Hitmonlee is the best play. Stunfisk LT would make more sense as you can attach a Strong, Band and utilise the Fighting Stadium to hit the active, as well as attack the bench. Keep in mind all the damage modifies above will not effect damage done to the bench (as the modifiers read/have been errataed to read 'to your opponent's Active Pokemon')

I do not think adding cheap normal attackers or Togekiss! Both cards will clunk up your deck's consistency! If you want cheap basic attackers use Hawlucha, which also benefits from Korinna, while Togekiss simply is not that great, especially as most of your deck uses low energy costs. If you do for some reason run Miltank, you only want to ever be using its first attack for the heavy damage. You also do not want to be promoting your Stage 2s often, if ever, and running 2 in this format is nearly always a disaster.

In regards to your card question, I suggest you ask in The "Is There A Card That Does This?" Thread.
 
My idea with Togekiss was simply to have an incredibly powerful 1st turn. Getting a stage 2, then attaching all energies from your top 8 cards to your bench and attacking in for 80 minimum (up to 130 depending on other cards drawn) all on your 1st turn just seems really insane to me. With cards like Winona I could at least guarantee a good second turn in the worst case scenario (the pre-evolutions and Miltank are all normal). I guess that's for another deck though. I just wish there was a fighting pokemon with delta evolution I could take advantage of.

Thanks for the Hawlucha suggestion, he is very Niche though as he can't hit anything but EX's, he has lower HP than Mienshao so I would prefer in most cases to get another Mienshao out. He does hit EX's hard though (max 150) and the retreat cost is definitely a bonus - I could just sacrifice him if I need to to keep my attack going in the worst case scenario as well.

Hitmonlee is just temporary until I can find a better replacement from boosters/trades. Rather than Stunfisk, Wouldn't Landorus-EX (Boundaries Crossed 89) be a better overall choice if I can get him? He has much higher HP, does more damage and has the same retreat cost.

What about Shaymin EX (Roaring Skies) (If I can ever get him that is)? He can accomplish a similar role to the Mienshao's if I use a double colorless energy, albeit with less damage. The draw power and extra HP are nice bonuses.

I think I have an idea of what the finalized deck will contain, any suggestions on the number for the trainers and evolution lines?
ie: how many korrina, muscle bands, Mienshao's etc?
Actually, is there an artical on how to best make those kinds of decisions? I'd like to be able to judge these things myself sometime in the future.
 
Togekiss is just simply too clunky.

Trust me with the Hawlucha ;) You'll see after testing how much more useful it is, and that niche isnt bad considering that most of the Meta is EX.

Yes, Landorus-EX would be much better, but it seemed like this deck was a bit of a budget, so I assumed you didn't want to spend a lot for Lando :)

Shaymin EX RSK is also a good idea. However, I'd only play one of it despite it's attack, as you don't really want to be running DCE if you don't need to, and it's more just for the draw you could get.

I suggest a 4-3 or 3-3 of Meinshao, 3 Muscle and 3-4 Korrina. Here's a thread that had a similar question to your one: http://www.pokebeach.com/forums/threads/how-to-build-an-effective-deck.123474/
 
bbninjas said:
The thing with using Focus Sash and Training Centre is that Muscle Band and Fighting Stadium are nearly required techs for this deck to hit enough damage. Focus Sash probably could be excused (I see its good uses), and you could even tech a single Masquerian PLB to swap around Bands and Sashes, if you have enough space.

With Laser, I believe what Spiffo meant is that it messes up Focus Sash.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I like Focus Sash because if the math right now says "I'll Aero Turn this guy, but then she's going to kill the Meinshao I promote", then you attach a sash and whoops, now they're not. Plus, if sash activates it gets discarded, so you can still put a Muscle Band down when it's your turn again.

Agreed on Hawlucha and Robosubs (both are searchable with Korrina, too!)
 
@bbninjas
Not so much "Budget" as "Free". The Hitmonlee's, Stunfisk, Miltanks etc. are only temporary fixes until I improve upon them with better substitutes and I will eventually get a few EX pokemon. I currently only play online, so it's just a matter of finding the cards or someone willing to trade them. The reason I chose to start with this type of deck is because I can get all the cards I need to start straight from 2x Dark Hammer theme decks, and most of the supporting pokemon all come from the same booster set (furious fists) - so it's easy to get started, and once I have a good base I can start improving on it.
I play MTG in physical card form, so don't have the cash to support a second game at the moment - so for now Pokemon can stay digital for me.

Alright, thanks for all the responses. I think I have an idea for what to aim for for the final deck now. I'll probably only put Focus Sash as a one-of in the deck though, I'm going to focus more on offense (It can be searched by Korrina anyway, so I can get it whenever I need it).

I might post a deck list if I get time, but I've been having difficulties getting enough of it lately (time, that is).
 
I can say from experience that Hitmonlee is a poor choice and should be replaced immediately, even with non-pokemon. His one-energy attack only hits the bench and not the active slot, so it doesn't benefit from any of your boosters (stadium, muscle band, strong energy, machamp), and the two-energy attack is weak and slow enough to not be worth it. Hitmonlee is worse than nothing. Run another foo/shao if you don't have any replacements for him.
 
This could be paired well with Trevenant, now that I think about it. It is basically donphan that auto heals
 
If you go the Trevenant route, I suggest adding a Wally or 2, especially if you get a turn one Item Lock :)
 
I'm probably a bad player for saying this, but I don't really like Trevenant, I get that he can block items but getting 3 energies before he can attack is a bit much (it is an admittedly good attack however). This coupled with his high retreat cost - I'm worried he'll get knocked out before I can get an attack in.
Unless he slows them down far more than I'm giving credit for.

I am going to experiment with adding a second color, and Psychic is definitely an option as I noticed a few cards that might work well, such as Sigilyph and Mr Mime, since Trevenant follows along the same suit, and I can swap into him once he's ready to attack it could be a viable option.

EDIT - Realized Mew-Ex rotated out of Standard... damn. Would have liked him here.

I'm thinking that near the final stages of the deck, I may have to remove the Machop-Machoke-Machamp line to fit in some of the other pieces. I'll lose some damage, but I think I'll live.
 
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You don't attack with Trevenant... you use float stone or Keldeo EX + float stone to rush in/retreat each turn. The tough thing about focus sash and float stone is they are denied by Seismitoad EX (which is the most popular meta deck), hence the suggestions above for Hawlucha. Just look at any list for Donphan, which is a very similar concept to your deck, for some proven ideas.
 
Ah, ok. Watched a few vids so I see what you mean now.

That Donfan deck is almost exactly the way I want to make this deck, just replacing the Donfan with Mienshao.
I do prefer Mienshao, returning it to your hand makes it harder to kill in my opinion and Lysandre can't mess us around like it can with Donfan. Seismitoad EX for instance cannot kill it without resorting to using "Grenade hammer", and I can kill it in 3 hits with a Fighting Stadium or Strong energy out. If they get lucky on the coin toss with Crushing hammers and Lasers... well nothing I can do about that (except Trevenant of course).

I do feel as though Sigilyph is a worthwhile pokemon to include as well, due to Safeguard allowing him to switch safely into EX's.
 
tbh, Donphan is extremely similar to a Mienshao deck, or any hit and run deck tbh.

A single Sigilyph should be good.
 
http://www.pokebeach.com/forums/threads/mienshao-machamp.120144/

This is a link to a Mienshoa deck which ive used loads and even won a few tournaments with. A personal favourite of mine.
It has hanged a fair bit since the post mainly the addition of a safeguard siglyph with float stone. And the trainer line has adjustments. Also added DCE as it allows Mienshoa to use his second attack so I dont HAVE to return to hand. Come in great use with focus sash.
 
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