Pokemon Pokémon vs Pocket Monsters

[Leaf_Ranger]

As you may (and should) know, the term "Pokémon" is a shorter version of "Pocket Monsters", which comes from the original concept of "Capsule Monsters".

Despite this, the fact is that Pokémon are now viewed as "creatures" and not so much as "monsters".

The anime was more kind in portraying Pokémon as living creatures with personalities but the anime came after the games and was created because of it, and looking at the games, we had a lot of stuff that is rarely seen nowadays. Just look at the Rocket grunts and the Tamers, both of them wielding a whip, and while the Rocket's whip was gone after Gen.I, in LeafGreen/FireRed the Tamer's whip was still present, along with a candy (some may say that Lavender Tower is a proof that even back then there were some that viewed Pokémon as more than monsters but as far as I remember that didn't went beyond the concept of pets).
Not only that, but some Pokémon were predators of other Pokémon (not to mention humans being the predators...who doesn't remember the infamous episode about the S.S. Anne where James tried to eat Magikarp and the "Cinnabar burgers" that are mentioned in the players kitchen in HG/SS? (Rapidash/Ponyt meat perhaps? ).

From Spearow's Blue entry (used in LG and Y):

Eats bugs in grassy areas. It has to flap its short wings at high speed to stay airborne.

From Omastar's Gold entry:

Apparently, it cracked Shellder's shell with its sharp fangs and sucked out the insides.

The anime is more serious now in regards to some episodes (the Espurr episode sure is proof of that even if it's a drop in an ocean) and while it isn't compared to the Ghost of Maiden's Peak and the Ninetales' episodes, it can be a hope.

Nintendo sure knows it's demographics for the WiiU, and hence it might know who plays the Pokémon games (the demographics for the portable consoles might and will be different but I don't think that the percentage of young adults shifts for the children!)
( http://mynintendonews.com/2014/08/28/nintendo-reveals-demographics-of-wii-u-eshop-users-males-account-for-93-and-females-only-7/ ), so it's isn't too much to ask for less childish stories, more so that those like me that were children back in gen.I are now young adults and still watching and playing Pokémon. The main thing that comes to mind is the capturing of Pokémon and poaching, mostly after having Hunter J in the anime and Team Plasma in the games, namely the poaching, that is seriously lacking in games and is only covered by Team Rocket, but there is other aspects and themes that can be introduced and that is what I'd like to know, if you would like to see a return to more of the "Pocket Monsters" era, and if so, your opinions and suggestions on what can be changed, or stay as it is with "Pokémon".

PS: I'd also like to know if you prefer to have or see the Pokémon following the player/trainer of if inside their Pkballs.

 

[My Little Keldeo]

First of all, it wasn't Cinnbar Burgers, it was Volcano Bakemeat, for Mother.

On topic, I like how the Pokemon are now given more humanistic mannerisms and personalities. It makes them feel more like characters in their own right rather than extensions of the human characters. At the same time, a distinction is made between human and Pokemon. In the Sinnoh games, a book in the Canalave library confirms that humans do indeed use Pokemon for food.

Despite this, if anything the Pokemon games have touched on more mature themes in recent games. X/Y was a bit of a setback, but had a darker plot than Gen1. The Unova series however, have without a doubt the most complex storyline in the main series, and I think it was great that it was spanned across two games (four if you count both versions) to flesh it out even more. Team Plasma is a credible threat, and drives the plot more heavily than beating the Gym Leaders and Elite Four. Its members are given much more characterization and personality than other villanous teams, from Ghetsis who attempts to not defeat, but murder the player character in Black and White 2, to the symphathic anti-villain N, one of my favorite characters in the entire franchise. That aside, listen to Lysandre's philosophy in X and Y about the planet not being able to support modern socieity. True, he's a madman and his plan is hardly a solution, but he's got a valid point. Compare this to Giovanni, who had little character to him other than being the leader of Team Rocket and a former Gym Leader. Even in HG/SS, where a few details of his backstory are brought up, nothing is given about his personality and motives.

While some things have undoubtedly changed since Pokemon's beginnings, I'm fond of the direction in which things are going, with a focus on emotion and moral dilemmas over just catching 'em all. It makes it feel more like an actual world other than a game with a simple objective.

 

[Leaf_Ranger]

First of all, it wasn't Cinnbar Burgers, it was Volcano Bakemeat, for Mother.

On topic, I like how the Pokemon are now given more humanistic mannerisms and personalities. It makes them feel more like characters in their own right rather than extensions of the human characters. At the same time, a distinction is made between human and Pokemon. In the Sinnoh games, a book in the Canalave library confirms that humans do indeed use Pokemon for food.

Despite this, if anything the Pokemon games have touched on more mature themes in recent games. X/Y was a bit of a setback, but had a darker plot than Gen1. The Unova series however, have without a doubt the most complex storyline in the main series, and I think it was great that it was spanned across two games (four if you count both versions) to flesh it out even more. Team Plasma is a credible threat, and drives the plot more heavily than beating the Gym Leaders and Elite Four. Its members are given much more characterization and personality than other villanous teams, from Ghetsis who attempts to not defeat, but murder the player character in Black and White 2, to the symphathic anti-villain N, one of my favorite characters in the entire franchise. That aside, listen to Lysandre's philosophy in X and Y about the planet not being able to support modern socieity. True, he's a madman and his plan is hardly a solution, but he's got a valid point. Compare this to Giovanni, who had little character to him other than being the leader of Team Rocket and a former Gym Leader. Even in HG/SS, where a few details of his backstory are brought up, nothing is given about his personality and motives.

While some things have undoubtedly changed since Pokemon's beginnings, I'm fond of the direction in which things are going, with a focus on emotion and moral dilemmas over just catching 'em all. It makes it feel more like an actual world other than a game with a simple objective.

I forgot about the Canalave's library stories which, as far as games go, aren't that old. With this in mind and taking into account what you've said, the truth is that evil and bad actions only comes from evil teams. First of all, we all know by now that weird dressing people will be part of some team that is always evil while at least in Gen.I/II and LG/FR, Tamers still used a whip, so we could question their methods, but since then, all evil and questionable stuff comes from said evil teams. Even Bikers, Cue Balls and Hooligans look mean and tough but their actions are very difficult to question. I think one of them in LG/FR said that Team Rocket rules but that might be a nod to the Bridge gang of the anime of which Jessie and James were part of, when another even said that he liked cute Pokémon and that they throw trash but at the end of the day they'll pick it up.
Like I've said in a thread about monarchies, every settlement in the Pokémon world (ingame mostly despite sometimes seeing this in the anime but again, more in the Kanto season) is well ruled and seems to be democratic, without any mean leader, president, mayor or whatever. I sure would love to watch Drayden being indeed a "Spartan Mayor" and keeping his people tight and in order, with some abuse from him, usign his Dragon Pokémon.
Oh, when I talk about evil stuff is not only agaisnt humanity but also Pokémon. I remember that in B/W, one of the grunts (I think) sayd that N's castle was built with Pokémon labour work but that isn't expanded and it's just there, we don't actually see Pokémon in chains in some obscure part of the castle or even a ghost of a Pokémon or some skeleton remains from those that might have died during construction.

AS/OR seems to again be taking a B/W philosophy, with Aqua now wanting more space for Pokémon and Magma more space for humans. I don't even see these original two teams being evil, just very misguided and blinded in their means, but even if they now reveal to be (more) evil, it'll still come from the expected evil teams.

As for Pokémon, I went looking and Karrablast's White entry does say that it targets Shelmet while Y's entry says both evolve when the first is attacking the second but in a now more friendly Pokémon world, those references may go unnoticed, namely since that didn't happened in the anime, like we could see with Seviper and Zangoose.

Btw, about Ghetsis trying to murder the player, I don't know if it's that way...he said that he would freeze the player so it could watch as he took over Unova, meaning that perhaps Kyurem attack wouldn't kill, just freeze and trap the player.

 

[SotS]

Old thread, but it's still one of the most recently posted in.

I'm fine with the childish nature of Pokemon. But then, I can't say any of the games have felt particularly more OR less "sinister" than the last. Up until X/Y anyways. They've all felt the same. Generation One had whips, sure, but Generation 4 touches on a lot of things more... psychological, I guess? Cyrus' plan was messed up on a number of levels. Much more than someone whipping a Pokemon, I'd say. Generation Three felt on par with One and Two. Generation Five has a lot more going for it than One did with Ghetsis and N. They weren't cutting edge characters, but it was something new for the series, and it certainly felt more "mature" than the games before it. His actions taken in B2/W2 further this point. He was truly power-hungry. And that is much more interesting to me than someone using violence.

Generation Six is a very strange case. I hated the plot. Ooooohhh man, did I hate the plot. Truthfully, I don't even remember most of it. I just remember the FRIENDLY FRIENDS approach they took. It was like My Little friggin' Pony: Pokemon Edition(TM). But enter AZ. The short, short time spent showing this character and his past was more than enough to sate my want for something more. Once again, it touched on human nature and emotions. Something that will always interest me more than someone driving Pokemon like slaves. It's something you can look at without being in the realm of Pokemon itself. It keeps you thinking, long after the game has left your mind.

I just don't feel that Pokemon ever really can push a great story. But it really doesn't need to. Not every RPG needs to have an enthralling story to pull you in. Especially one like this. You have a wide-open world open to be explored, filled to the brim with hundreds of unique creatures. I feel that is already enough to make you feel like you're in a different world. The sheer magnitude in variety.

 

[Leaf_Ranger]

Old thread, but it's still one of the most recently posted in.

I'm fine with the childish nature of Pokemon. But then, I can't say any of the games have felt particularly more OR less "sinister" than the last. Up until X/Y anyways. They've all felt the same. Generation One had whips, sure, but Generation 4 touches on a lot of things more... psychological, I guess? Cyrus' plan was messed up on a number of levels. Much more than someone whipping a Pokemon, I'd say. Generation Three felt on par with One and Two. Generation Five has a lot more going for it than One did with Ghetsis and N. They weren't cutting edge characters, but it was something new for the series, and it certainly felt more "mature" than the games before it. His actions taken in B2/W2 further this point. He was truly power-hungry. And that is much more interesting to me than someone using violence.

Generation Six is a very strange case. I hated the plot. Ooooohhh man, did I hate the plot. Truthfully, I don't even remember most of it. I just remember the FRIENDLY FRIENDS approach they took. It was like My Little friggin' Pony: Pokemon Edition(TM). But enter AZ. The short, short time spent showing this character and his past was more than enough to sate my want for something more. Once again, it touched on human nature and emotions. Something that will always interest me more than someone driving Pokemon like slaves. It's something you can look at without being in the realm of Pokemon itself. It keeps you thinking, long after the game has left your mind.

I just don't feel that Pokemon ever really can push a great story. But it really doesn't need to. Not every RPG needs to have an enthralling story to pull you in. Especially one like this. You have a wide-open world open to be explored, filled to the brim with hundreds of unique creatures. I feel that is already enough to make you feel like you're in a different world. The sheer magnitude in variety.

Cyrus was a good character, but his story had little to do with the nature of Pokémon and their treatment as either Pokémon or Pocket Mosnters. The only thing I remember about Pokémon in his story is the fact that as a child he played with robots and machines than with children (and perhaps Pokémon). And if I recall it correctly, he even failed in his segment as he wanted to create a new world but I don't remember him acting weird or even thinking that much around the Emotion trio. There they were, the three Pokémon, jailed, and no wondering, no speech. The postgame isn't helpful for him, because I was seriously expecting to find some clues about Cyrus in the Distortion World, either left by him or by Mars.

As for Ghetsis, having only played B2, he doesn't seem such a great characer, just a power-hungry monkey that goes mad. N and Team Plasma on the other hand do make us wonder about human nature but also about Pokémon and their treatment as tools, partners and creatures. Oh yeah, Hugh's (our rival) quest to find his sister Purrloin and the postgame words of said sister about becoming again friedns with her Pokémon also gives us something to think.

I still have to play XY, so I can't coment that much about it.