Discussion Shaymin-EX vs Lillie

Nemesis1125

Aspiring Trainer
Member
Question for everyone...

With sun and moon releasing today and becoming tournament legal on the 17th...

What would you rather have in your deck... Lillie or Shaymin-EX or would you do a mixture of both? Also wouldn't the question also bring in that you run thru your deck too fast and potentially deck out before finishing the game?
 
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Shaymin is always going to win out. Supporters can only be played once per turn, plus Shaymin is very searchable with Ultra Ball or Hoopa EX.
 
Shaymin is always going to win out. Supporters can only be played once per turn, plus Shaymin is very searchable with Ultra Ball or Hoopa EX.
but at the same time.... Lillie is reusable with Seeker, plus the "on first turn effect", it can't get sniped for 2 Prizes, and lastly people use AZ to scoop up shaymin in Expanded sometimes anyway...
 
I love the fact that it can't be sniped, and more room on the bench without sky field. Plus the first turn effect is so sick.

but on the other hand. It feels sooooo weird to not play with at least 1 shaymin-ex :eek:
 
Yes shaymin has been part of the game it seems like forever now. Lillie is great because of that reason she can't be benched sniped and it doesn't take up room on the bench. I am partial to both so I decided to run both in my deck for now.
 
Shaymin-EX (ROS), unless I am expressly trying to run a deck without it (or any Pokémon-EX). @Vitiel is correct; the point of Shaymin-EX is to use it in addition to your Supporter for the turn, possibly alongside a second copy of itself. Yes Shaymin-EX still has drawbacks; that is the price you pay for faking a second (and sometimes a third) Supporter in a single turn. Plus if we bring up everything that can help a Supporter, it is only fair to look at what helps a Pokémon: Ultra Ball, Hoopa-EX, etc.

It is important to compare like with like in Pokémon; just because both cards have "Draw until..." effects does not make them similar. Lillie isn't an alternative to Shaymin-EX, she is the slightly improved version of Bianca. Bianca has rarely (if ever) seen successful competitive play. Unless your hand has more than six cards in it, you cannot use her (or Lillie, barring your first turn). A five card hand means a measly 1 card draw. A four card hand means you've got a Bill (who stopped being used when he was reprinted as a Supporter). A three card hand means we are on par with the draw yield from a Cheren, Tienro, or Hau. Two cards in hand means you get a four card draw; still not great, but better. You really need to be down to one or no cards in hand for Bianca or Lillie (again, barring first turn usage) to give a worthwhile yield.

Even first turn, the numbers aren't that great unless you (again) can get your hand down in size. If you run Lillie heavily in order to improve your odds of using her first turn, you're taking away space from other valuable Supporters and will have to use her (or run short) the rest of the game, because this card you only really want to use first turn, you've maxed out. XP If you run a single, good luck getting it first turn. The same people worrying about Shaymin-EX being an easy two Prizes better not suggest Jirachi-EX. ;)
 
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