TCG Theorymon Exercises - Week 6

The Yoshi

Wumbo
Member
Hey everyone. After seeing the VG Theorymon exercises done by [member]Bippa[/member], I decided it would be interesting to see views of various members of how a certain aspect of the TCG can be improved, such as a card or a part of the TCG in general. Now we're into Week 6, and I decided to make things a bit more interesting. I'm going to provide a really good card in this format, and we're going to work on how to make it less powerful. Still good, but not as excellent as it is.

Rules:

1) Say what's on your mind, but don't troll. People can tell that advice is legit, even if they don't agree with it.

2) Say as much as you want! There's no limit on how many aspects you would like to see changed, and that shouldn't hold you back from providing multiple pieces of advice.

3) If you disagree with a member, don't flame or I will get [mod]Glaceon[/mod] in here and Ice Beam you all.

So here's the card we'll be working on.

54-mewtwo-ex.jpg


Make your changes assuming you could take the card, use Wite-Out on anything you wanted, and change it. Begin!
 
I think the only thing I would do to Mewtwo is change the energy cost.

Make X Ball cost {P}{P} and make Psydrive cost {P}{C}{C}.

That way it can't be abused in every deck, but is still fairly powerful. Psydrive would be used a bit more, and could still be used in decks that use Prism and DCE, but due to the discard couldn't be used very often.
 
Actually, if we lower the HP by 10, nobody would play Mewtwo. It removes the neccessity of a PlusPower to revenge kill, so if you drop it, it is 2 free prizes for your opponent. And with that, games will never degenerate into Mewtwo Wars.
 
Not necessarily. It wouldn't be played as much as it is now, but eviolite still makes a pp or a 5th energy necessary. Going PP and PCC for energy costs is a little far, I think, since that would really destroy every deck Mewtwo is in. PC and PCC seems more reasonable.
 
Make X-Ball only count the energy on the opponent and only with basic energy. Then it's value would decrease to something moe reasonable.
 
^The problem with that is you take away the opponent's ability to revenge it easily meaning once it sets up it's gonna stay on the board for a while.
 
Its about time this card got here XD......anyways I think:
It should do 130 for psydrive and lower its hp to 160. X ball- though i think it ruined the format- should stay but say excluding EXs. that would make Mewtwo about even as a card.
 
I think making X-Ball count basic energy only would be a great way to fix Mewtwo. Unlike some other changes which seem more "Rage I hate Mewtwo let's make it unplayable" this would still allow it to work. However, it wouldn't be able to rely on DCE and its effectiveness against many decks would go down because some decks run very little basic energy
 
I disagree. By making Mewtwo count only basic energy, decks like CMT and Eels that can power Mewtwo up in one turn with basic energy would have a huge advantage. It would be way too hard to knock out an opposing Mewtwo.

I think is Mewtwo had 160 HP, it would be played less because it would be easier to ohko other Mewtwo, but then you'd be at a risk.
 
Seeing as Mewtwo is my favorite Pokémon, I think we should give it some more HP and free Retreat. :p

Joking aside, it would be a good idea to make X-Ball require [P][P] or [P][C]. It's a Psychic Pokémon and it's kinda ridiculous you can just splash any Energy onto arguably the single best card in the Metagame.
 
... are you guys seriously making it worse? That's completely defeating the point of theorymon. I understand it's pretty much perfect as is, but come on. It's so absurdly easy to make something worse.

I think the problem here is that Mewtwo was picked for this week. It's not really a card you can make better, so really there's nothing to discuss other than how horrible we can make it. That's not very fun or discussion worthy. Stick to gimmick cards that could have a niche, like Ditto or Roserade.

If you want to make it worse, just bump the HP to 150 or something, make all of its attacks at least require one or two Psychic-type energy, and bump the retreat cost to three. Now it's not as splashable as before.
 
Theorymon is theorymon, really. As long as we're practicing it (which isn't really important at all), it doesn't really matter whether we're making it better or worse.
 
But you picked such an easy concept that requires little to no thinking. It's so absurdly easy to make something worse, but actually improving upon a concept requires actually thinking. With improvement you have to ask yourself a lot of questions, such as is it too broken, will it be played often, etc. It's not that you're not using theorymon, it's just on what level you are using it. The level of thinking here makes this more of a game of tic-tac-toe than a Rubix's cube, really.

I'm simply trying to point out here that the entire concept of deprovement is so easy that a monkey could do it.
 
I wanted to try something different this week so people wouldn't get bored of doing the same thing every week. I agree I could have picked a different card; I just wanted to test it out and see how it worked. Guess it isn't working too well.
 
Glaceon said:
I disagree. By making Mewtwo count only basic energy, decks like CMT and Eels that can power Mewtwo up in one turn with basic energy would have a huge advantage. It would be way too hard to knock out an opposing Mewtwo.

Without being able to use DCE Mewtwo's damage output would fall dramatically. Also, with the large reliance on DCE in this format, its fairly easy to get around my version of Mewtwo with no problems at all. For example, if Zekrom EX discards the 2 lightning energy after attacking and has a DCE to pay for the rest of the cost Mewtwo is now almost completely useless against it. It wouldn't be able to do anything to a Tornadus EP with DCE+Basic energy, etc. etc. Toolbox decks also run lots of Rainbow and Prism Energy so Mewtwo wouldn't be used as a way to hit infinite damage against The Truth (or if it was it wouldn't be nearly as good at it). It seems like the only suggestion so far that leaves Mewtwo actually playable yet not OP. 160 HP means Zekrom EX and Reshiram EX can OHKO it with a Pluspower, and since it can't OHKO back reliably, its really bad. Magnezone can take it out with 3 energy + Pluspower, which is unbelievably helpful, Tornadus and Thundurus 2HKO it, etc. etc. Mewtwo really wouldn't be useful if it had 160 hp.
 
TDL said:
I'm simply trying to point out here that the entire concept of deprovement is so easy that a monkey could do it.

I don't think you understand the concept of theorcrafting in general. Making something worse doesn't have to be mindless. You can devalue something and make it have a positive effect on the game. Balancing a game is a very fine mechanic that takes a ton of skill. You don't just always make things better, all that does is cause a power-creep, which isn't healthy for the game at all.

Making X-ball only count basic energies, or only energies on him, change the entire usage of Mewtwo and would generally make it better than it is in the areas that it could and would be used. It wouldn't be as splashable anymore, but countering it would be much harder. Changing the energy cost to PC or even PCC for X-ball would make it more understandable, since it forces prism/psychics to be run and not every list can do that. It would also make getting a clutch Mewtwo drop harder, so it would take more planning/skill to play Mewtwo effectively, or at the very least more sparingly.

Dropping its health down to 160 (like people have said) would help, and makes eviolite almost a necessity making it even harder to splash. But you can't just think about the Mewtwo war. 160 is just too easy for Zek/Resh EX to hit, so dropping its health that far really breaks it against the rest of the meta, and bumps it down from maybe a 10/10 to a 6-7/10 or so, since it won't be able to get KOs as easily anymore once it gets up, and it can be countered easier anyways. Since the issue is just the Mewtwo war and its health is balanced against the rest of the meta, making an ability that only effects that part would be a better change then just lowering its health.

It's weakness is also a huge reason that there is an issue with the card, or even a Mewtwo war in general. So if you changed it to Darkness (since that makes sense and Psychic isn't actually weak to itself), you could have more room to play. An extremely basic idea is something like increasing damage done to Mewtwo by other Mewtwo by 40. It would allow its second attack to be used as an effective Mewtwo counter with a PP, or at the very least not make every energy not worth 40 damage with X-Ball, which is just ridiculous.

Also, Psydrive is pretty much never used as is so fixing that while we're at it seems like a good idea. The damage is fine, but a better effect that has more synergy with X-Ball would make it better. Make it discard an energy on the Defending Pokémon would give players options if they can't get an OHKO. It could be pretty annoying against some decks, plus that doesn't hurt its ability to catcher-KO bench sitters like it does now. Also the energy cost of PPC is too high, but PCC seems more reasonable.

With all the nerfs, giving it a RC of 1 and a -20 resistance to fighting would help, but aren't entirely gamebreaking themselves.

IMO,

Mewtwo-EX - Psychic - HP170
Basic Pokémon

Ability: Inner Struggle
As long as Mewtwo-EX is your active Pokémon, all damage done to Mewtwo-EX by your opponent's Mewtwo-EX is increased by 40.

[P][C] X-Ball: Does 20 damage times the amount of Energy attached to this Pokemon and the Defending Pokémon.

[P][C][C] Psydrive: 120 damage. Discard an Energy attached to the Defending Pokémon.

When Pokemon-EX has been Knocked Out, your opponent takes 2 Prize cards.

Weakness: Darkness (x2)
Resistance: Fighting (-20)
Retreat: 1

These changes are pretty drastic, and definitely make the card more of a 8-9/10 than the 10-11/10 it is now, but it has strong attacks, a good health and still has a decent counter in itself, although constant revenge KOs are harder to string which can prevent every other game from boiling down to the Mewtwo exchange.

ps im not good at tcg theorycrafting.
 
Making the attack [P][C] or [P][P] completely destroys Mewtwo. It would become one of the worst EXs in the set. IMO I think Iisnumber12 hit the nail on the head, his changes would make Mewtwo a little worse, but still quite good.
 
The Yoshi said:
Hey everyone. After seeing the VG Theorymon exercises done by [member]Bippa[/member], I decided it would be interesting to see views of various members of how a certain aspect of the TCG can be improved, such as a card or a part of the TCG in general. Now we're into Week 6, and I decided to make things a bit more interesting. I'm going to provide a really good card in this format, and we're going to work on how to make it less powerful. Still good, but not as excellent as it is.

Rules:

1) Say what's on your mind, but don't troll. People can tell that advice is legit, even if they don't agree with it.

2) Say as much as you want! There's no limit on how many aspects you would like to see changed, and that shouldn't hold you back from providing multiple pieces of advice.

3) If you disagree with a member, don't flame or I will get [mod]Glaceon[/mod] in here and Ice Beam you all.

Make your changes assuming you could take the card, use Wite-Out on anything you wanted, and change it. Begin!

Mewtwo-EX - Psychic - HP170
Basic Pokémon

Ability: Defective DNA
You can not attach a Double Colorless Energy to Mewtwo EX from your hand, deck, discard or with Abilities, Poke-Powers, Poke-Bodies or any other effects

[C][C] X-Ball: Does 20 damage times the amount of Energy CARDS attached to this Pokemon and the Defending Pokémon.

[P][P][C] Psydrive: 120 damage. Discard an Energy attached to the Defending Pokémon.

When Pokemon-EX has been Knocked Out, your opponent takes 2 Prize cards.

Weakness: Psychic (x2)
Resistance:
Retreat: 3
 
My first post didn't hurt Mewtwo alot so this is worse :p
Mewtwo EX 160HP Psychic

Ability: Genetic Mutation
Whenever Mewtwo EX deals damage to the defending Pokemon put 1 damage counter on Mewtwo EX.

[P][C] X-Ball x30
Flip a coin for each energy card attached to this pokemon and the defending pokemon, for each heads this attack does 30 damage.

[P][P][C] Psyrive 100

EX-Rule: When this Pokemon is Knocked outyour opponent takes 2 prize crds insted of 1

Weakness: Psychic x2
Resistance:
Retreat: 2

This new X-Ball requires a bit of luck and is a bit less overpowered. This would only be played with Fliptini and would never see the light of most decks again.
Psydrive now does less and drops it's negative effect.
HP is lower to create more difficulty when played and the ability really messes it up. Badly
 
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