Discussion The return of Fliptini

2

21times

Aspiring Trainer
Member
Hello fellow Beach Bums,

So I need someone to help me out here, I have been going over the new SUM2 Pokemon that will drop at the beginning of May, and I noticed that Victini is back with his "Victory Star" ability.

So this ability works after attacks only, but my question is: does it work after both your attack and your opponent's attack? Meaning, if your opponent uses an attack on you that involves a coin flip, do you get the option of flipping again if you have Victini on your bench?

Thanks, I haven't been playing long enough to know exactly how Fliptini works, I just remember hearing about him. Also, this card in SUM2 is NOT an exact reprint of previous cards, so old versions you have of Victini will not be standard legal. The ability is the same but the attack is different.
 
This one actually makes me wonder. The effect of the ability reads "Once during your turn, after you flip any coins for an attack, you may ignore all effects of those coin flips and begin flipping those coins again. You can’t use more than 1 Victory Star Ability each turn."

It says that after you flip coins for an attack, it doesn't specify wether it's yours or your opponent's. I've come to think that yes, you will have the option of flipping again after an effect of any attack.

I hope this helps! :)
 
Yeah I was a little confused as well - I'm just not familiar with this card - but it is the exact same wording as the previous card, so I was hoping some Pokemon veterans could shed some light on how it worked in the past.
 
The card says "Once during your turn" which limits it to your turn only. This is similarly worded to other "Once during your turn" like Octillary. You aren't allowed to draw up to five on your opponents turn, which could be a thing if you get hit with N or something.

Also, just in case anyone is curious here are the FAQs from the compendium. It is interesting if YOUR attack causes your opponent to flip, you can make them reflip. There isn't anything that indicates that an opponents attack is open to a re-flip though.

Victory Star
Q. Can I use Victini's "Victory Star" ability to reflip just the tails flips from an attack?
A. No. You must reflip all of the flips for an attack if you use Victory Star. (Noble Victories FAQ; Nov 17, 2011 PUI Rules Team)

Q. Can I use Victini's "Victory Star" ability to reflip the flips from a trainer such as Xtransceiver or ability like Carracosta's Solid Rock?
A. No. Victory Star applies only to flips from attacks. (Noble Victories FAQ; Nov 17, 2011 PUI Rules Team)

Q. Can I use Victini's "Victory Star" ability to reflip for a failed Confusion check?
A. No, Victory Star only applies to flips that are done as part of the attack. You cannot use it for checking status effects. (Noble Victories FAQ; Nov 17, 2011 PUI Rules Team)

Q. If I use Grumpig's "Bench Manipulation" attack to have my opponent flip a coin for each of his or her Benched Pokemon, can I use Victini's "Victory Star" ability to force my opponent to re-flip those coins?
A. Yes, you can. If your opponent flips a coin as part of your Pokemon's attack, you can use "Victory Star" to force them to re-flip those coins. (Jan 12, 2012 TPCi Rules Team)

Q. If my opponent used Scyther's "Afterimage Strike" last turn, and on my turn I use an attack like "Double Slap" to flip two coins and do 30x the number of heads, if the opponent gets heads on "Afterimage Strike" to prevent the damage, can I use Victini's "Victory Star" Ability to reflip my coins for "Double Slap" and start the process all over again?
A. No, you cannot. Victory Star must be invoked prior to determining the amount of damage being done, which in turn is prior to the opponent performing the flip for Afterimage Strike. (Jan 12, 2012 TPCi Rules Team)

Q. How and when would you use Victini's "Victory Star" Ability to reflip coins when using Mamoswine's "Ramming Strike" attack?
A. Anytime during the course of Ramming Strike, you can use Victory Star once to start the attack over from the beginning. Any damage counters placed on Mamoswine during the course of the attack would be erased, even if it is enough for Mamoswine to be KO'd, and Mamoswine basically gets one more chance at using the Ramming Strike attack. (Dec 15, 2011 PUI Rules Team)

Q. Say I have Liepard active and Raikou-EX and Victini on my bench. I attack with Liepard's "Assist", flip heads and choose to copy Raikou-EX's "Thunder Fang" attack but flip tails for "Thunder Fang's" paralysis part. If I then use Victini's "Victory Star" Ability to re-flip the coins, assuming I get heads for "Assist" could I choose a different benched Pokemon's attack or would I have to choose "Thunder Fang" again?
A. Since Victory Star rewound all the coin flips it's as if the Assist attack never happened. So yes, you could choose a different benched Pokemon's attack, if you flip heads for Assist of course. (Jan 31, 2013 TPCi Rules Team)

Link in case anyone wants to read the whole thing: http://compendium.pokegym.net/compendium-bw.html
 
Ah thanks for the clarification Guardian. In hindsight that's perfectly clear. Could be a good card to tech into some of these fire decks with burn effects.
 
21times said:
Ah thanks for the clarification Guardian. In hindsight that's perfectly clear. Could be a good card to tech into some of these fire decks with burn effects.
Click to expand...

I always liked using it on the cards that have the "block all damage and effects done to this pokemon by attacks" on them in expanded. I primarily used it in a deck featuring Sceptile EX (the promo variant) + Serperior as a flippy "stall until paralyzed" attack. 75% chance to stall barring switch effects is pretty solid early. Still not the most useful or competitive deck, but I think it will have a far better run in standard than it ever had in expanded.
 
TheGuardian118 said:
Q. If I use Grumpig's "Bench Manipulation" attack to have my opponent flip a coin for each of his or her Benched Pokemon, can I use Victini's "Victory Star" ability to force my opponent to re-flip those coins?
A. Yes, you can. If your opponent flips a coin as part of your Pokemon's attack, you can use "Victory Star" to force them to re-flip those coins. (Jan 12, 2012 TPCi Rules Team)
Click to expand...

This ruling seems quite strange. The ability states among other things "... after you flip any coins for an attack...", which seems to indicate that you, the one using the ability, actually have to flip a coin for it to be able to apply. In case only your opponent flips a coin, it should not apply. The ruling seems to actually expand quite a bit what the card says, no? Or am I missing something?

Granted (English is not my native language so I might be wrong), "you" could refer to you as in "both/all players" but is that really consistent with how "you" is used on other cards, rules and rulings?
 
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