Discussion Tier List for Standard

pine_ddog

pine_ddog

Chaotic Neuteral
Member
Tier 1:

Buzzwole-GX/Lycanroc-GX
Gardevoir-GX/Zoroark-GX
Golisopod-GX/Zoroark-GX
Lycanroc-GX/Zoroark-GX

Tier 2:

Buzzwole-GX/Garbodor
Decidueye-GX/Zoroark-GX
Dusk Mane Necrozma-GX/Magnezone
Espeon-GX/Garbodor
Gardevoir-GX
Gardevoir-GX/Garbodor
Glaceon-GX
Greninja BREAK
Leafeon-GX
Tapu Bulu-GX/Vikavolt
Volcanion-EX
Weavile/Zoroark-GX

Tier 3:

Alolan Ninetales-GX/Zoroark-GX
Drampa-GX/Garbodor
Empoleon
Gallade/Zoroark-GX
Garchomp/Lucario
Ho-oh-GX/Turtonator-GX
Silvally-GX
Sylveon-GX
Wishiwashi & Walls
Xerneas BREAK

Tier 4:

http://www.pokebeach.com/forums/thr...unity-a-list-of-standard-budget-decks.143924/ (Good link for budget decks)
Others
 
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Necrozma/Magnezone is tier 2.
Glaceon-GX is tier 1.
I do think that Leafeon-GX/Decidueye is better than Necrozma/Magnezone, but I don't see it as tier 1 though.
 
I actually don't see Glaceon being terribly amazing.
It has too low of a damage output for the meta at the moment, abilities on GX's and EX's aren't too terribly huge (excluding Trade, Wonder Tag and Bloodthirsty Eyes, and even then, you can just Guzma around it).
Turn 1 Ability lock just seems like a minor inconvenience for the opponent, I have played a lot of games where I don't even end up needing Brigette if it has been prized.
All the Glaceon decks that I have personally seen run Alolan Ninetales and Zoroark, and to be completely honest, running 3 different Stage 1's just seems too clunky to me?? It seems way too overhyped in my opinion. It's good, but it's nothing special.

As for Leafeon GX/Decidueye, it falls under the category of being too slow and too clunky as well. You need that turn 1 Brigette and Grand Bloom GX, and then when you can't get it off, the average 3-3 or 3-2 line just makes the deck clunky.

I definitely agree with Dusk Mane/Magnezone being Tier 1. It sets up quickly and it's consistent. I think a possible addition to Tier 3 is Alolan Dugtrio/Starmie, doing 180 damage with 0 energy is pretty funny and it's also pretty good. I have personally beat Dusk Mane/Magnezone and Leafeon with it. It's not bad.
 
Zoroark Decidueye is at least definitely tier 2. It can beat pretty much anything if you play it correctly.

SYLVEON IS COMING BACK.

JUST WAIT.
 
I’ve had many a coversation with Jake on the Pokebeach dicord, who has helped re-inform my Greninja placement. ULP gives it cynthia, a huge consistency boost, so i’d rate it teir 2 at least, even based on that card alone.
 
Buzzwole isn't tier 1, the only deck it has a decent matchup against is Zoroark. It does too little damage against the other archetypes for them to care about it.
 
Perfect_Shot said:
Buzzwole isn't tier 1, the only deck it has a decent matchup against is Zoroark. It does too little damage against the other archetypes for them to care about it.
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That's assuming that Jet Punch is its only usable attack, which it isn't. With Max Elixirs, Buzzwole can get its other attacks running more quickly.
 
TSA123 said:
I actually don't see Glaceon being terribly amazing.
It has too low of a damage output for the meta at the moment, abilities on GX's and EX's aren't too terribly huge (excluding Trade, Wonder Tag and Bloodthirsty Eyes, and even then, you can just Guzma around it).
Turn 1 Ability lock just seems like a minor inconvenience for the opponent, I have played a lot of games where I don't even end up needing Brigette if it has been prized.
All the Glaceon decks that I have personally seen run Alolan Ninetales and Zoroark, and to be completely honest, running 3 different Stage 1's just seems too clunky to me?? It seems way too overhyped in my opinion. It's good, but it's nothing special.

As for Leafeon GX/Decidueye, it falls under the category of being too slow and too clunky as well. You need that turn 1 Brigette and Grand Bloom GX, and then when you can't get it off, the average 3-3 or 3-2 line just makes the deck clunky.

I definitely agree with Dusk Mane/Magnezone being Tier 1. It sets up quickly and it's consistent. I think a possible addition to Tier 3 is Alolan Dugtrio/Starmie, doing 180 damage with 0 energy is pretty funny and it's also pretty good. I have personally beat Dusk Mane/Magnezone and Leafeon with it. It's not bad.
Click to expand...
Glaceon may see little play if people manage to play against it, but it has consistent 2HKO and 1 big knockout you can use after only one frost bullet.
I can't agree with Dusk Mane though. It seems like a more inconsistent Tapu Bulu and Tapu Bulu itself has never been a Tier 1 deck.
 
Golisopod Garbodor is missing. It had a Regionals Win, a Top 2, a few Top 32 and I made Top 8 Senior Division with it.
 
Bulu should be higher, personally in don't like the deck, but its had really good showings as of late.
 
I'll throw in my 2 cents on the ULP archetypes:

I'd put dusk mane/magnezone at tier 2 tops...it's highly unfavored against the listed tier 1 decks if going second, because good aggro players won't let you get a magnezone out (or if they do, they'll prioritize KO'ing it, cuz that's THE engine of the deck). Personally, I've found it significantly more difficult to get magnezone out early than vikavolt because of a lack of heavy ball synergy and not being able to fit as many search cards in the list as with bulu. Maybe I need to adjust my list, but it feels like a less tanky version of the metagross-solgaleo deck I played in Memphis (though admittedly a bit less clunky...but also significantly more clunky than bulu if that makes sense).

I'd slide garchomp up to tier 2...when I've played against it I've had a hard time choosing between taking out a powered up garchomp vs a lucario on the bench. It's a lose-lose because you either let them get another 200+ damage swing against you, or leave the lucario which let's them grab whatever they need for a backup garchomp. I think it has a significant power and consistency edge over empoleon (which is super vulnerable to parallel city played on oneself, which takes benched pokemon off the board that won't be replaced AND reduces damage output of water pokemon by 20 more damage).

Glaceon should stay tier 2 on account of its seemingly good zoroark matchup...haven't tested it but blocking trade and swapping 2 shots seems like a winning strategy.

Leafeon decidueye is really good if you get an early 4-5 pokemon grand bloom and don't get paralleled...problem is, I don't think this will end up happening as often as people envision, I'd bump it down to tier 3.
 
biffthepotato said:
Zoroark GX/Decidueye GX is teir 1 or 2, trust me if played correctly you can beat ANYTHING.
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The Last Shaymin said:
Zoroark Decidueye is at least definitely tier 2. It can beat pretty much anything if you play it correctly.

SYLVEON IS COMING BACK.

JUST WAIT.
Click to expand...

Decidueye-GX/Zoroark-GX is included in the other Zoroark variants, I don't believe it to be tier one due to it's poor match-up's against Volcanion-EX and Buzzwole-GX/Lycanroc-GX and inconsistent match-up with Greninja BREAK, plus it hasn't really had a big tournament placement.

Calcab said:
Necrozma/Magnezone is tier 2.
Glaceon-GX is tier 1.
I do think that Leafeon-GX/Decidueye is better than Necrozma/Magnezone, but I don't see it as tier 1 though.
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Personally I predict Necorzma/Magnezone to be tier one due to how many people play it, and that if set up right it can be tier 1. Now it could be tier 2, I don't know, but I'd predict it to be tier 1. Also with Glaceon-GX, I can't reasonably put it at tier 1 with metal being so popular and not reliant on GX abilities.

SmiteKnight said:
I’ve had many a coversation with Jake on the Pokebeach dicord, who has helped re-inform my Greninja placement. ULP gives it cynthia, a huge consistency boost, so i’d rate it teir 2 at least, even based on that card alone.
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I agree with this and will move Greninja BREAK up to tier 2. Also Volcanion-EX is going to be popular, so it gets another advantage there.
TSA123 said:
I actually don't see Glaceon being terribly amazing.
It has too low of a damage output for the meta at the moment, abilities on GX's and EX's aren't too terribly huge (excluding Trade, Wonder Tag and Bloodthirsty Eyes, and even then, you can just Guzma around it).
Turn 1 Ability lock just seems like a minor inconvenience for the opponent, I have played a lot of games where I don't even end up needing Brigette if it has been prized.
All the Glaceon decks that I have personally seen run Alolan Ninetales and Zoroark, and to be completely honest, running 3 different Stage 1's just seems too clunky to me?? It seems way too overhyped in my opinion. It's good, but it's nothing special.

As for Leafeon GX/Decidueye, it falls under the category of being too slow and too clunky as well. You need that turn 1 Brigette and Grand Bloom GX, and then when you can't get it off, the average 3-3 or 3-2 line just makes the deck clunky.

I definitely agree with Dusk Mane/Magnezone being Tier 1. It sets up quickly and it's consistent. I think a possible addition to Tier 3 is Alolan Dugtrio/Starmie, doing 180 damage with 0 energy is pretty funny and it's also pretty good. I have personally beat Dusk Mane/Magnezone and Leafeon with it. It's not bad.
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I'll add Alolan Dugtrio/Starmie to tier 4. I agree with you on Dusk Mane Necrozma, I believe it will be the most popular deck.

FlashRayquaza said:
Golisopod Garbodor is missing. It had a Regionals Win, a Top 2, a few Top 32 and I made Top 8 Senior Division with it.
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It's included in Garbodor variants.

F4H_Jay said:
Bulu should be higher, personally in don't like the deck, but its had really good showings as of late.
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I'll move it up to tier 2, it has seen some showings and I don't know how I missed it.
KK-Swizzle said:
I'll throw in my 2 cents on the ULP archetypes:

I'd put dusk mane/magnezone at tier 2 tops...it's highly unfavored against the listed tier 1 decks if going second, because good aggro players won't let you get a magnezone out (or if they do, they'll prioritize KO'ing it, cuz that's THE engine of the deck). Personally, I've found it significantly more difficult to get magnezone out early than vikavolt because of a lack of heavy ball synergy and not being able to fit as many search cards in the list as with bulu. Maybe I need to adjust my list, but it feels like a less tanky version of the metagross-solgaleo deck I played in Memphis (though admittedly a bit less clunky...but also significantly more clunky than bulu if that makes sense).

I'd slide garchomp up to tier 2...when I've played against it I've had a hard time choosing between taking out a powered up garchomp vs a lucario on the bench. It's a lose-lose because you either let them get another 200+ damage swing against you, or leave the lucario which let's them grab whatever they need for a backup garchomp. I think it has a significant power and consistency edge over empoleon (which is super vulnerable to parallel city played on oneself, which takes benched pokemon off the board that won't be replaced AND reduces damage output of water pokemon by 20 more damage).

Glaceon should stay tier 2 on account of its seemingly good zoroark matchup...haven't tested it but blocking trade and swapping 2 shots seems like a winning strategy.

Leafeon decidueye is really good if you get an early 4-5 pokemon grand bloom and don't get paralleled...problem is, I don't think this will end up happening as often as people envision, I'd bump it down to tier 3.
Click to expand...

I have Garchomp at tier 3 just for being a stage 2 deck right now, as the format is getting decently quick, I'll put it in 2.5.
 
Going beck to Zoroak GX/Decidueye GX, I think that it should be it's own deck instead of "Zoroark Variants," because it is a deck on its own and you should make all decks in Zoro or Garb Variants be listed as there own decks because they are not all at the same tier so yeah here's tiers for the Zoro and Garb Variants.


Zoroark/Decidueye, Tier 1.5

Zoroark/Golisopod, tier 1.5

Drampa/Garbodor, Tier 2

Zoroark GX/Ninetales GX, Tier 4 or 5

Espeon GX/Garbodor, Tier 3

Tell me what you think of this list of Zoro and Garb variants and can you please add these???
 
biffthepotato said:
Going beck to Zoroak GX/Decidueye GX, I think that it should be it's own deck instead of "Zoroark Variants," because it is a deck on its own and you should make all decks in Zoro or Garb Variants be listed as there own decks because they are not all at the same tier so yeah here's tiers for the Zoro and Garb Variants.


Zoroark/Decidueye, Tier 1.5

Zoroark/Golisopod, tier 1.5

Drampa/Garbodor, Tier 2

Zoroark GX/Ninetales GX, Tier 4 or 5

Espeon GX/Garbodor, Tier 3

Tell me what you think of this list of Zoro and Garb variants and can you please add these???
Click to expand...

I'd argue that all of those are tier two decks (minus Alolan Ninetales variant,) and to avoid cluttering the list with these variants I'd rather just keep them as their own deck. Zoroark-GX/Decidueye-GX is not tier 1 or tier 1.5 as it has too many poor match-up's and can run very inconsistently. Henceforth the defenition I put for tier 1: "able to consistently place in top 8 and win major events," this deck hasn't had any of those. Tier 1.5 is for decks who don't have any major placements but are actively played, and or have the chance to be in tier 1 once there set becomes legal. That's why only Ultra Prism decks are in there, they are in between the two right now and haven't had too much testing to definitively place. If you can prove that this deck has gotten a good amount of tournament placements, I'll move it up. Also while they are different decks they all generally have the same search engine and weaknesses. Lycanroc-GX and Golisopod-GX are separated due to them being in a separate tier.
 
Ha Zoroark GX/Decidueye GX has bad machups, like what?? Volc?? When I played Volc I killed them and Greninja?? Easy. Use decidueye GX to attack and you can't lose.
 
Calcab said:
Necrozma/Magnezone is tier 2.
Glaceon-GX is tier 1.
I do think that Leafeon-GX/Decidueye is better than Necrozma/Magnezone, but I don't see it as tier 1 though.
Click to expand...
Glaceon's damage output is WAY too low to be good. Plus taking 2 attachments hurts and if you don't start with eevee in active and Water energy in-hand you lost anything Glaceon had going for it (its ability)
 
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