What's After EX's
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RE: What's next after EX?
I am fine with EX's really
Its just that I wouldn't mind having the "old school" mechanism of "ex's " or "LV'X's". But since the pokemon TCG has the biggest popularity ever and fans are happy with them, and the company is making huge profits (which isn't a bad thing) I am pretty sure that we will wait long enough until the games changes completely. I believe in the 8th generation.
I am fine with EX's really
Its just that I wouldn't mind having the "old school" mechanism of "ex's " or "LV'X's". But since the pokemon TCG has the biggest popularity ever and fans are happy with them, and the company is making huge profits (which isn't a bad thing) I am pretty sure that we will wait long enough until the games changes completely. I believe in the 8th generation.
RE: What's Next After EX?
I would enjoy them getting rid of EX completely. Then maybe turning reusing LVx but they could be Megas only.
I would enjoy them getting rid of EX completely. Then maybe turning reusing LVx but they could be Megas only.
RE: What's Next After EX?
I would love to take out EX for a while now. However, that's not likely to happen anytime soon.
When they introduced Mega Evolutions (a "permanent" mechanic) as Pokemon-EX, they sealed the grave for every other mechanic for as long as Mega Evolutions are still present in the games. Right now, if they go the Lv. X route, most of them would be stupidly unplayable, being Stage 2 and "3" for the most part.
I'm afraid TPCi dug a hole they can't get out from. If we're to get a different mechanic, new Mega Evolutions must stop appearing.
I would love to take out EX for a while now. However, that's not likely to happen anytime soon.
When they introduced Mega Evolutions (a "permanent" mechanic) as Pokemon-EX, they sealed the grave for every other mechanic for as long as Mega Evolutions are still present in the games. Right now, if they go the Lv. X route, most of them would be stupidly unplayable, being Stage 2 and "3" for the most part.
I'm afraid TPCi dug a hole they can't get out from. If we're to get a different mechanic, new Mega Evolutions must stop appearing.
RE: What's Next After EX?
Basically, this.
It would be nice to see the EX mechanic leave the format, but to do so would involve TPC having to backpedal past all the powerful cards we've gotten in recent times and go back to using weaker concepts, like how Lv. X is in comparison. Cards usually don't get weaker; they bring stronger things in with time. Helps sales in general, which isn't a bad thing.
The only thing I imagine that could be next is something that eclipses EXs entirely.
What I would personally like to see is just normal cards duking it out with other normal cards: No EX, no Lv.X; just Basics and Evolved Pokemon. Although there would still be some being far better than others, it's a more relaxed concept.
Luispipe8 said:
Basically, this.
It would be nice to see the EX mechanic leave the format, but to do so would involve TPC having to backpedal past all the powerful cards we've gotten in recent times and go back to using weaker concepts, like how Lv. X is in comparison. Cards usually don't get weaker; they bring stronger things in with time. Helps sales in general, which isn't a bad thing.
The only thing I imagine that could be next is something that eclipses EXs entirely.
What I would personally like to see is just normal cards duking it out with other normal cards: No EX, no Lv.X; just Basics and Evolved Pokemon. Although there would still be some being far better than others, it's a more relaxed concept.
RE: What's Next After EX?
XE cards maybe? Lv. EX?
XE cards maybe? Lv. EX?
RE: What's Next After EX?
What I'm hoping they do is make 2 formats for upcoming seasons. Like expanded and standard, there would be two formats (for either XY/LT-on) which would be with or without EX's. For example, Day 1 could be with EXs, and Day 2 could be without EXs. This limits playability of the cards without limiting the amount of products sold/events people will attend. It would also lead to some interesting decks for Day 2...which is probably more interesting then seeing Flareon variants, Night march variants, Seismitoad variants, VG, and Yveltal decks in the Top 8.
Example: Day 1- I play Toad Bats, Day 2- I play Night March
It does limit the use of Jirachi/Shaymin EX pokemon abilities, but then replaces it with actually interesting abilities of Stage 1's and 2's that never shined due to the Toad.
What I'm hoping they do is make 2 formats for upcoming seasons. Like expanded and standard, there would be two formats (for either XY/LT-on) which would be with or without EX's. For example, Day 1 could be with EXs, and Day 2 could be without EXs. This limits playability of the cards without limiting the amount of products sold/events people will attend. It would also lead to some interesting decks for Day 2...which is probably more interesting then seeing Flareon variants, Night march variants, Seismitoad variants, VG, and Yveltal decks in the Top 8.
Example: Day 1- I play Toad Bats, Day 2- I play Night March
It does limit the use of Jirachi/Shaymin EX pokemon abilities, but then replaces it with actually interesting abilities of Stage 1's and 2's that never shined due to the Toad.
RE: What's Next After EX?
Honestly, EX Cards have done nothing good for the game and I can't see how people could even see them as a good thing. I wished they would have stopped at X/Y with EX Pokemon or kept them limited to Legendary Pokemon.
I've seen way more people playing the game before EX cards came back with new game-breaking mechanics. They rendered almost every single card that came out in sets useless and made playing the game less fun. There are just so many cards out in recent sets that I look at and go "Wow, if this wasn't such an EX dominated game - this would be a fun deck" but sadly they have overstayed their welcome, and in fact - probably weren't welcome in the first place. I hope once they do away with EX Pokemon they do away with them for good and never bring back such an awful mechanic again.
They just need to make this game way more welcoming and playable for anyone, because if only the big expensive EX cards like Seismitoad, Virizion, Etc. are what everyone needs - then the game is a lost cause for people who want to enjoy the game or get back into it. Now is probably the worst time to get into the Pokemon TCG, and if they had just stopped making EX cards when X/Y came out, the game would be way more enjoyable than what it is now.
Honestly, EX Cards have done nothing good for the game and I can't see how people could even see them as a good thing. I wished they would have stopped at X/Y with EX Pokemon or kept them limited to Legendary Pokemon.
I've seen way more people playing the game before EX cards came back with new game-breaking mechanics. They rendered almost every single card that came out in sets useless and made playing the game less fun. There are just so many cards out in recent sets that I look at and go "Wow, if this wasn't such an EX dominated game - this would be a fun deck" but sadly they have overstayed their welcome, and in fact - probably weren't welcome in the first place. I hope once they do away with EX Pokemon they do away with them for good and never bring back such an awful mechanic again.
They just need to make this game way more welcoming and playable for anyone, because if only the big expensive EX cards like Seismitoad, Virizion, Etc. are what everyone needs - then the game is a lost cause for people who want to enjoy the game or get back into it. Now is probably the worst time to get into the Pokemon TCG, and if they had just stopped making EX cards when X/Y came out, the game would be way more enjoyable than what it is now.
RE: What's Next After EX?
Next after EX....probably TPCi going bankrupt lol.
Okay, maybe not bankrupt, but sales would decrease a lot. The most expensive cards of the format are EXs, and without them there's honestly not much TPCi can make money out of, except maybe for FAs.
I'm new to the TCG (when compared to other people here) so I can't really complain about them, as I have never experienced a format without EXs. Sometimes I, too, look at some cards, and go like: 'What if...there weren't EXs? What would people play? Would this be better?'
Next after EX....probably TPCi going bankrupt lol.
Okay, maybe not bankrupt, but sales would decrease a lot. The most expensive cards of the format are EXs, and without them there's honestly not much TPCi can make money out of, except maybe for FAs.
I'm new to the TCG (when compared to other people here) so I can't really complain about them, as I have never experienced a format without EXs. Sometimes I, too, look at some cards, and go like: 'What if...there weren't EXs? What would people play? Would this be better?'
RE: What's Next After EX?
TPCi Doesn't make money off singles sales, though there was full-arts and those were definitely highly sought after and still are...
a format without EXs is way more balanced. I mean if I recall even though we had the Tao Trio cards and Gothitelle - there was still many ways around them or ways to meet them equally. I saw a lot of deck variety after BW before Next Destinies happened and EX Pokemon ran rampant. There would still be cards to hunt for, but the difference is that a lot of cards would go up in value. If we didn't have EX Pokemon, a lot of $1-$2 cards would be at least $5 or higher. So money-wise, it wouldn't change too much. I think there would be a lot more people playing the game or continuing to play the game if they had some kind of non-EX format.
Vom said:
TPCi Doesn't make money off singles sales, though there was full-arts and those were definitely highly sought after and still are...
a format without EXs is way more balanced. I mean if I recall even though we had the Tao Trio cards and Gothitelle - there was still many ways around them or ways to meet them equally. I saw a lot of deck variety after BW before Next Destinies happened and EX Pokemon ran rampant. There would still be cards to hunt for, but the difference is that a lot of cards would go up in value. If we didn't have EX Pokemon, a lot of $1-$2 cards would be at least $5 or higher. So money-wise, it wouldn't change too much. I think there would be a lot more people playing the game or continuing to play the game if they had some kind of non-EX format.
RE: What's Next After EX?
EX's are inherently bad for the game because they provide powerful attacks and high HP on an easy-to-access basic, meaning that players can often win games riding on the back of their extremely overpowered EX rather than through their own skill or meticulous deck strategy (I'm looking at you, Seismitoad and Yveltal).
But even aside from that, I'm sort of sick of EX's. When I first started playing, EX's had just been introduced, and it was kind of a cool mechanic because it was new and fresh and fun. But the fact that it started in NXD and is STILL going makes it just feel...stale. I'm a huge fan of new mechanics (I thought Flare tools and ancient traits were both awesome ideas) so I'd really like to see some big new mechanic introduced (or re-introduced, like Lvl X).
EX's are inherently bad for the game because they provide powerful attacks and high HP on an easy-to-access basic, meaning that players can often win games riding on the back of their extremely overpowered EX rather than through their own skill or meticulous deck strategy (I'm looking at you, Seismitoad and Yveltal).
But even aside from that, I'm sort of sick of EX's. When I first started playing, EX's had just been introduced, and it was kind of a cool mechanic because it was new and fresh and fun. But the fact that it started in NXD and is STILL going makes it just feel...stale. I'm a huge fan of new mechanics (I thought Flare tools and ancient traits were both awesome ideas) so I'd really like to see some big new mechanic introduced (or re-introduced, like Lvl X).
RE: What's Next After EX?
I ran out of likes. Again.
I have to agree with Blah. EXs were cool, but I would love to see more strategy in PTCG. Anyone who wants to get into the competitive game has to spend waaaaaay to much on big EXs. I actually had to design a few EXless rogues to stick into my budget. The newer EXs are also getting... less powerful or useable? Groudon is apparently the only particularly competitive deck that came out of PRC. If PCL are designing weaker cards, why don't they give us more powerful stage 1s and stages 2s instead of dulling the powerful basics?
I really liked the Flare tools myself, and wish they continued them. Targeting just the EXs are really neat, too.
I ran out of likes. Again.
I have to agree with Blah. EXs were cool, but I would love to see more strategy in PTCG. Anyone who wants to get into the competitive game has to spend waaaaaay to much on big EXs. I actually had to design a few EXless rogues to stick into my budget. The newer EXs are also getting... less powerful or useable? Groudon is apparently the only particularly competitive deck that came out of PRC. If PCL are designing weaker cards, why don't they give us more powerful stage 1s and stages 2s instead of dulling the powerful basics?
I really liked the Flare tools myself, and wish they continued them. Targeting just the EXs are really neat, too.
RE: What's Next After EX?
I'll echo myself again. Stage 1s and 2s are powerful there's just no support for them anymore. I can still remember when Empoleon NDEX was a great deck. Wow. Roaring Skies will allow you to evolve on your first turn or when you first put a Pokemon in play. Dragonite (Ancient Trait) and Salamence from the upcoming set Roaring Skies look powerful. If they're not I don't know what is.
See here's what I don't understand from y'all. Why not have powerful EXs AND powerful evolutions? WHy can't the two exist toegether? I think that'll make the game more interesting. People who want big basics with powerful attacks can use EXs but they give up 2 prizes when KO'd. People who are smart enough to wait patiently to evolve and setup get the reward of only giving up 1 prize when KO'd (none if they run Life Dew)!
I don't think EXs should disappear at least not anytime soon.
bbninjas said:
I'll echo myself again. Stage 1s and 2s are powerful there's just no support for them anymore. I can still remember when Empoleon NDEX was a great deck. Wow. Roaring Skies will allow you to evolve on your first turn or when you first put a Pokemon in play. Dragonite (Ancient Trait) and Salamence from the upcoming set Roaring Skies look powerful. If they're not I don't know what is.
See here's what I don't understand from y'all. Why not have powerful EXs AND powerful evolutions? WHy can't the two exist toegether? I think that'll make the game more interesting. People who want big basics with powerful attacks can use EXs but they give up 2 prizes when KO'd. People who are smart enough to wait patiently to evolve and setup get the reward of only giving up 1 prize when KO'd (none if they run Life Dew)!
I don't think EXs should disappear at least not anytime soon.
RE: What's Next After EX?
I think the solution to EXs are cards like the Flare Tools which target EXs specifically, as well as high damage basics and stage 1s (or Stage 2s w/ Delta Evolution). From what I can learn from my research on the SP-era formats, most of the solutions to SP decks were either cards like Gyarados, which provide for high damage on a stage 1 (which has somewhat of delta evolution due to BTS) or cards like Machamp, which are anti-basic (therefore, anti-SP).
SP cards seem like the best parallel which we have available to us to draw upon (High HP Basics with good attacks). If Seismitoad-EX weren't warping the format right now, I believe we would see a lot of battles between things like Yveltal/Darkrai, Fighting, Fairy, Kyogre, and Groudon vs. Night March, Flareon, Donphan, and Medicham.
I think the solution to EXs are cards like the Flare Tools which target EXs specifically, as well as high damage basics and stage 1s (or Stage 2s w/ Delta Evolution). From what I can learn from my research on the SP-era formats, most of the solutions to SP decks were either cards like Gyarados, which provide for high damage on a stage 1 (which has somewhat of delta evolution due to BTS) or cards like Machamp, which are anti-basic (therefore, anti-SP).
SP cards seem like the best parallel which we have available to us to draw upon (High HP Basics with good attacks). If Seismitoad-EX weren't warping the format right now, I believe we would see a lot of battles between things like Yveltal/Darkrai, Fighting, Fairy, Kyogre, and Groudon vs. Night March, Flareon, Donphan, and Medicham.
RE: What's Next After EX?
Because as long as things like Toad (that inherently punish people for using Stage 2 decks) exist, there can't be a medium. Salamence and Dragonite will never hit the field before the Toad player has its opponent at an sizable disadvantage. Yveltal EX also takes them both out effortlessly.
EX just simply outclass evolved Pokes, and as TokenDuelist said above, turns a lot of cards that would be good (like Salamence you mentioned) and makes them unplayable because it's too easy for EX to capitalize on how much it takes to fully evolve something.
Something has to change. There has to be a happy medium.
asdjklghty said:
Because as long as things like Toad (that inherently punish people for using Stage 2 decks) exist, there can't be a medium. Salamence and Dragonite will never hit the field before the Toad player has its opponent at an sizable disadvantage. Yveltal EX also takes them both out effortlessly.
EX just simply outclass evolved Pokes, and as TokenDuelist said above, turns a lot of cards that would be good (like Salamence you mentioned) and makes them unplayable because it's too easy for EX to capitalize on how much it takes to fully evolve something.
Something has to change. There has to be a happy medium.
RE: What's Next After EX?
I don't think that EX's should be gotten rid of. I think the metagame would be fine with them. WOULD be fine if they weren't the only thing playable. The solution isn't to get rid of things. All that's gonna happen is a new terror will come up and people will complain about that. What needs to happen is more stage support. Why are stages bad? Because 90% of the time they can't get set up as quickly as EX's, so why not just speed up stages? I mean, it's obvious that stages won't be, and honestly shouldn't be as fast as EX's, because if they were then Stages would be Op and EX's would need support. There just needs to be more balance. Fact is though, there's no perfect balance, and there never will be in a game that pretty much goes how the people want. Yes, Pokemon Company puts good cards in, but Pokemon players decide what get's played. With a constantly changing metagame, there will never be a perfect balance because what was once a good balance, could become broken with the next players idea. But there could definitely be some changes to make the game a lot more stable, and closer to being as balanced as possible.
Now as for the topic of what's going to actually come after EX's, which will have to happen at some point, I think that there might just be a period of regular Pokemon. No Lvl.X's or EX's, just regular Stages and Basics. I think a metagame like that could be pretty fun.
I don't think that EX's should be gotten rid of. I think the metagame would be fine with them. WOULD be fine if they weren't the only thing playable. The solution isn't to get rid of things. All that's gonna happen is a new terror will come up and people will complain about that. What needs to happen is more stage support. Why are stages bad? Because 90% of the time they can't get set up as quickly as EX's, so why not just speed up stages? I mean, it's obvious that stages won't be, and honestly shouldn't be as fast as EX's, because if they were then Stages would be Op and EX's would need support. There just needs to be more balance. Fact is though, there's no perfect balance, and there never will be in a game that pretty much goes how the people want. Yes, Pokemon Company puts good cards in, but Pokemon players decide what get's played. With a constantly changing metagame, there will never be a perfect balance because what was once a good balance, could become broken with the next players idea. But there could definitely be some changes to make the game a lot more stable, and closer to being as balanced as possible.
Now as for the topic of what's going to actually come after EX's, which will have to happen at some point, I think that there might just be a period of regular Pokemon. No Lvl.X's or EX's, just regular Stages and Basics. I think a metagame like that could be pretty fun.
RE: What's Next After EX?
What I is becoming hopeful is the increase in Stage 1 decks, namely things like Flareon. I've also been designed many rogues that can actually beat things, but they rarely run EX attackers. These decks are increasingly becoming able to hit for high numbers, thus are difficult for EXs to deal with due to the prize trade. Maybe the drawback of 2 prizes may be starting to pay off?
What I is becoming hopeful is the increase in Stage 1 decks, namely things like Flareon. I've also been designed many rogues that can actually beat things, but they rarely run EX attackers. These decks are increasingly becoming able to hit for high numbers, thus are difficult for EXs to deal with due to the prize trade. Maybe the drawback of 2 prizes may be starting to pay off?
RE: What's Next After EX?
A reprint if BTS would be a nightmare. Bats among other things would be broken. That's not a good way to create a balanced format (balanced meaning a lot of different types of decks are good). It's not that stage 2s are bad after all. It's just that basics are better (specifically EX's). Personally I would really enjoy a shift away from EX's to something like non-SP LV. X's or something similar; however, that just doesn't seem likely in the foreseeable future,
Elbow said:
A reprint if BTS would be a nightmare. Bats among other things would be broken. That's not a good way to create a balanced format (balanced meaning a lot of different types of decks are good). It's not that stage 2s are bad after all. It's just that basics are better (specifically EX's). Personally I would really enjoy a shift away from EX's to something like non-SP LV. X's or something similar; however, that just doesn't seem likely in the foreseeable future,
RE: What's Next After EX?
It's simple as to why EXs aren't going away any time soon; basics are more consistent. Stage 2s are hard to get into play consistently and there's a lot more luck involved in drawing what you need to evolve. Wally may help alleviate the pain Stage 2s (except Crobat) are facing right now with Seismitoad EX
It's simple as to why EXs aren't going away any time soon; basics are more consistent. Stage 2s are hard to get into play consistently and there's a lot more luck involved in drawing what you need to evolve. Wally may help alleviate the pain Stage 2s (except Crobat) are facing right now with Seismitoad EX