Primal Groudon EX Variants

Camoclone

Camoclone

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This thread is used for all competitive discussion on Groudon EX variants. This includes strategies, playstyles, and techs.

You may post decklists here, but only as a means to add to the discussion. If you're looking for advice on your list, post in the Deck Garage.

Articles for Primal Groudon EX

JW Kriewall's "Fighting On -- Deck Ideas for a New Format

Primal Groudon EX Skeleton List:

Pokémon: 10
  • 4 Landorus FFI
  • 3 Groudon EX
  • 3 Primal Groudon EX
Trainers: 32
  • 4 Professor Juniper
  • 4 N
  • 3 Korrina
  • 2 Lysandre
  • 1 Colress
  • 3 VS Seeker
  • 3 Switch
  • 2 Groudon Spirit Link
  • 2 Focus Sash
  • 2 Ultra Ball
  • 1 Professor's Letter
  • 1 Scramble Switch
  • 3 Scorched Earth
  • 2 Silent Lab
Energy: 12
  • 8 Fighting Energy
  • 4 Strong Energy
Open Spots: 6

Strategy:
The goal of this deck is to slowly power up a Primal Groudon EX on the bench, then bring it active and take several prizes in a row with Gaia Volcano. The Omega Barrier Ancient Trait makes it completely safe on the bench, blocking annoying Trainers such as Lysandre and Crushing Hammer. With Focus Sash, you are guaranteed to get at least 2 attacks with Primal Groudon EX. Landorus FFI can help you power up Groudons faster, especially with Scorched Earth discarding your Fighting Energy. Scramble Switch can allow you to get a full HP Primal Groudon EX instantly. The deck can run into problems with cards that can damage Primal Groudon at any point. This includes Crobat/Golbat, and Genesect EX's Red Signal. Heavy non-EX can be troublesome too. But once Primal Groudon EX is out there swinging, there's nothing that can stop it.


Good Additions:
  • Masquerain PLB or Tool Retrieval
  • Hawlucha FFI
  • Landorus EX
  • Mr. Mime
  • Bicycle
  • Fighting Stadium or Another Stadium
  • Professor Birch's Observation or Other Supporters
  • Float Stone
  • Mega Turbo
 
Last edited by a moderator:
RE: Groudon EX Variants

Has anyone tested both versions of this deck? The Masquerain and the focus on hawlucha/landorus? I'd would like to hear some results of Groudon deck testing!
 
RE: Groudon EX Variants

I've been playing around with Groudon EX nonstop for the past weeks and been trying mostly Groudon/Hawlucha/Landorus, Groudon/RoboSub and also a Groudon/ManectricEX version. Groudon/Manectric is awfully fast most of the time due to draw power with scorced earth and accelerating Groudon with Manectric. The biggest downside there is Manectrics weakness.. but with that deck, most of the time I have a fully powered MegaManectric and Primal Groudon in turn 2, which is nice! But I run that deck with only EX's, which makes it sort of vulnerable.
Also, I played this deck in a regional recently and it went good against anything untill a mirror Groudon and a Flareon-deck (that stuff wrecked me, haha).

Groudon/Hawlucha/Landorus is also good. Mainly due to my opponent not getting to take 2 prizes at every KO, haha. I also run this deck with RoboSub and Escape rope which can be nice to take cover and get out anything I want and just retreat afterwards with Hawlucha/Robo. Also, only fighting energy instead of the electric above. But this one is a little slower on the accelerating to Groudon, but I only run the deck with 2 Landorus. But Hawlucha is a great addition.

And RoboSubGroudon can be a real monster. 4-4 Groudon and Robos. Lots of switch. So turn 1 is mainly get out 2 Groudon and 2 Robos and then stall for the love of god and power up one Groudon and mega-evolove as fast as possible to avoid being Lysandred. One good thing about this deck is not having a need for Spirit links since its just to evolve while having Robo out. Instead I run focus sash (for mirror), weakness policy (for Virgen) and Hard charm (for anything else).

But overall with this deck, I find having ways to switch being really important cuz Groudon can be a sitting duck in worst case. Have not been running Float Stone cuz I don't own any, lol. Also I have not been using Scramble Switch (due to not owning it, once again) and instead Computer search, for getting a finish KO with Lysandre or a stadium. But I imagine that Scramble Switch would take away the flaw of having a dying but fully powered active Groudon and not very powered Groudon on bench. Especially to keep the Strong energys.

And about Masquerian, been trying it a bit but not that much but I think it has potential, the only flaw I feel is it being Lysandred. But perhaps that ain't much of a problem with Groudon being such a beast.
 
RE: Groudon EX Variants

Groudon will see more play with the total dominance of toad this past weekend. It needs a way to consistently beat Flareon however.
 
RE: Groudon EX Variants

Megalobster said:
I've been playing around with Groudon EX nonstop for the past weeks and been trying mostly Groudon/Hawlucha/Landorus, Groudon/RoboSub and also a Groudon/ManectricEX version. Groudon/Manectric is awfully fast most of the time due to draw power with scorced earth and accelerating Groudon with Manectric. The biggest downside there is Manectrics weakness.. but with that deck, most of the time I have a fully powered MegaManectric and Primal Groudon in turn 2, which is nice! But I run that deck with only EX's, which makes it sort of vulnerable.
Also, I played this deck in a regional recently and it went good against anything untill a mirror Groudon and a Flareon-deck (that stuff wrecked me, haha).

Groudon/Hawlucha/Landorus is also good. Mainly due to my opponent not getting to take 2 prizes at every KO, haha. I also run this deck with RoboSub and Escape rope which can be nice to take cover and get out anything I want and just retreat afterwards with Hawlucha/Robo. Also, only fighting energy instead of the electric above. But this one is a little slower on the accelerating to Groudon, but I only run the deck with 2 Landorus. But Hawlucha is a great addition.

And RoboSubGroudon can be a real monster. 4-4 Groudon and Robos. Lots of switch. So turn 1 is mainly get out 2 Groudon and 2 Robos and then stall for the love of god and power up one Groudon and mega-evolove as fast as possible to avoid being Lysandred. One good thing about this deck is not having a need for Spirit links since its just to evolve while having Robo out. Instead I run focus sash (for mirror), weakness policy (for Virgen) and Hard charm (for anything else).

But overall with this deck, I find having ways to switch being really important cuz Groudon can be a sitting duck in worst case. Have not been running Float Stone cuz I don't own any, lol. Also I have not been using Scramble Switch (due to not owning it, once again) and instead Computer search, for getting a finish KO with Lysandre or a stadium. But I imagine that Scramble Switch would take away the flaw of having a dying but fully powered active Groudon and not very powered Groudon on bench. Especially to keep the Strong energys.

And about Masquerian, been trying it a bit but not that much but I think it has potential, the only flaw I feel is it being Lysandred. But perhaps that ain't much of a problem with Groudon being such a beast.
Click to expand...

I don't see how it is possible to get a fully powered P-Groudon by end of T2. The fastest I can see it working is-

T1. Manually attach to Manectric
T2. Manually attach to Manectric, evolve to M-Manectric and Turbo Bolt to attach 2 to P-Groudon
T3. Manually attach to something else, turbo bolt to attach to P-Groudon

Which I think means he is ready start of T4.

Also, with Landorus FFI, you can go (if you start second)

T1. Manually attach to Landorus and Shout of Power to attach 1 to Groudon
T2. Manually attach to P-Groudon and shout of power to attach to Groudon
T3. Manually attach to P-Groudon, retreat Landorus and smash stuff!

It is worth pointing out that the M-Manectric version also requires an extra spirit link attachment and attachment of two different types of energy. The extra setup ought to make it clunkier and less reliable, meaning you will hit your best case scenario less often than you will with Landorus.

I may have missed something, in which case apologies. But Manectric setup looks slower and less consisent.
 
Wow this thread has gotten like no love

Scramble Switch lets you steal Landorus's energy if you have, say, another Groudon you want to try and power up. Turn three is the earliest this deck can get going, and it's almost a guaranteed win if you can pull it off. There's not much they can do about a 240-hp behemoth swinging for 200+ that they can't laser or hammer.

My build uses Hawlucha and Landorus with a Terrakion NVI tech to help against non-EX decks. I like Hawlucha for a few reasons. First, free retreat. It's basically Escape Rope insurance. Primal Groudon can't get Lysandred, but if you only have him on the Bench, he can get gusted up by Escape Rope. Hawlucha lets me continue attaching energy to Groudon without wasting one on Landorus (even if I can just shout one from the discard). Second, adding Hawlucha to the deck increases my chances of not starting with Groudon. I can always Korrina for Landorus, drop him, and retreat (for free). And lastly, Flying Press isn't that terrible of an attack. If Fighting Stadium is in play, Hawlucha@Strong 2hkos every non-mega out there.

I don't personally run Fighting Stadium, but I don't think it'd be bad as a one-of if you're fighting, say, virgen. Just ignore Groudon and 2HKO everyone with Hawlucha.
 
I think if you play Hawlucha a single fighting stadium is a good idea- with Hawlucha it is helpful to be hitting in the 2HKO range, and you often need fighting stadium for that.

I have been toying with a really consistent build- just P-Groudon, 4 Landorus, some Acro bikes for extra draw. Not even too mnay items. Mostly focused on just setting up P-Groudon consistently. It seems to work quite well. It would need a bit more teching for competition though.
 
My current build of the deck runs RoboSub, Hawlucha, and Terrakion. I had Lucario EX in there for awhile, but I found that Lucario EX was pretty pointless and overall just not a good addition for the deck. I currently run 1 Hawlucha, but I'm actually thinking of adding another. Hawlucha is VERY good with this deck. With escape rope you can manipulate your field very well, and when you're main attack has a 4 retreat cost, that's something you want. Mew EX was another thing I was considering... in my mind I thought that with 1 rainbow and 1 Mew EX tech'd in, I could take advantage of MegaMan decks, but that isn't really that big of a threat to deserve a risk like a 120hp EX being put on the bench. I can't wait for the next format switch. Mega Turbo and no Virgen or Plasma Leafeon? Yes please.

Has anyone though of a Garbo variant for this deck? With bats being so popular in so many decks, it might be with a 2-2 line, but I haven't really tested it at all.
 
Why are these tier 3? It posesses strong matchups against basically any EX-based deck in the format aside from VirGen, which is like 50/50 if played properly. Night March and Flareon aren't the best matchups, but it's very positive against Yveltal and it absolutely destroys Seismitoad - 2 of the most powerful AND popular decks in this format.

On a side note, What's the matchup against Exeggutor like? Legitimately curious because it seems like the low damage output is exactly what Groudon wants since it has 90 days to set up, but then no use of Korrina so... I was just legitimately curious to see if anybody knew this matchup.
 
DevinTheWelf said:
My current build of the deck runs RoboSub, Hawlucha, and Terrakion. I had Lucario EX in there for awhile, but I found that Lucario EX was pretty pointless and overall just not a good addition for the deck. I currently run 1 Hawlucha, but I'm actually thinking of adding another. Hawlucha is VERY good with this deck. With escape rope you can manipulate your field very well, and when you're main attack has a 4 retreat cost, that's something you want. Mew EX was another thing I was considering... in my mind I thought that with 1 rainbow and 1 Mew EX tech'd in, I could take advantage of MegaMan decks, but that isn't really that big of a threat to deserve a risk like a 120hp EX being put on the bench. I can't wait for the next format switch. Mega Turbo and no Virgen or Plasma Leafeon? Yes please.

Has anyone though of a Garbo variant for this deck? With bats being so popular in so many decks, it might be with a 2-2 line, but I haven't really tested it at all.
Click to expand...

I don't like any other EX in the deck, just Groudon. It's a kind of prize denial. If someone is going to take 2 prizes they are going to have to KO a Groudon. And the strategy of Lysandring up a weak EX for two prizes doesn't work if the only Pokemon on your board worth 2 prizes is Primal Groudon.

I have mixed feelings about Terrakion but have dropped it from my current builds. One of the reasons I like it in other fighting decks is that it is weak to grass so gives you some diversity. But with this deck you have grass weakness alplenty already. Terrakion also has a hefty retreat cost- I like the deck having free retreat or low retreat, or Groudon. I believe that the opponent can Lysandre up Terrakion when you have P-Groudon active (as it not targeting Groudon), which means that this could really disrupt you. Obviously you run quite a lot of switching cards but it's better if you can just brush this off- which is what would happen if your only other cards where Hawlucha and a Landorus with an energy.
 
One Approved said:
Why are these tier 3? It posesses strong matchups against basically any EX-based deck in the format aside from VirGen, which is like 50/50 if played properly. Night March and Flareon aren't the best matchups, but it's very positive against Yveltal and it absolutely destroys Seismitoad - 2 of the most powerful AND popular decks in this format.

On a side note, What's the matchup against Exeggutor like? Legitimately curious because it seems like the low damage output is exactly what Groudon wants since it has 90 days to set up, but then no use of Korrina so... I was just legitimately curious to see if anybody knew this matchup.
Click to expand...

The deck has a bad Night March, Flareon, Exeggutor, and Donphan matchup. While it has quite a few good matchups a deck really can't afford to take losses to that many decks (with the current tournament structure). Tournament result wise it is sitting at the bottom of tier 2 / the top of tier 3 (13th in power rankings). Personally I don't feel like the 13th best deck deserves Tier 2 even when the format is this diverse.

The Exeggutor matchup depends on a lot of factors. If they play Genesect then they can just Red Signal Groudon up. If not then they can power up an Exeggutor or two so they can use Stomp. The matchup isn't good but like any Exeggutor matchup you can win if you get a godlike turn 1 or draw incredibly well.
 
Focus sash would not be optimal since the only thing doing 240 is either a Megaton slam, Megalo Cannon with a muscle band or a massive evil ball. Remember G-Boosters, Lasers, and Bats do not activate this. So while in theory it seems good you'd probably be better off with a hard charm or a muscle band.
 
Aviste said:
Focus sash would not be optimal since the only thing doing 240 is either a Megaton slam, Megalo Cannon with a muscle band or a massive evil ball. Remember G-Boosters, Lasers, and Bats do not activate this. So while in theory it seems good you'd probably be better off with a hard charm or a muscle band.
Click to expand...

G-Booster actually does not go through Focus Sash. If a Genesect was to G-Booster a damage free Groudon then the Groudon would survive. Remember Leafeon can also do 240 damage to Primal Groudon.
 
Aviste said:
Focus sash would not be optimal since the only thing doing 240 is either a Megaton slam, Megalo Cannon with a muscle band or a massive evil ball. Remember G-Boosters, Lasers, and Bats do not activate this. So while in theory it seems good you'd probably be better off with a hard charm or a muscle band.
Click to expand...

Megalo Cannon and G-Booster are precisely why Focus Sash is in the deck. Without it, VirGen would be an extremely bad matchup. With it, though, Groudon can survive any attack, and Hawlucha will do a LOT of damage with the ability to survive any hit.

What's your guys' opinion on Silver Mirror as a tech against Flareon/Leafeon in this deck? Also legitimately curious since I don't really play the deck. On paper it seems good but I know that experience can be very different than on paper, so I just figured I'd ask.
 
One Approved said:
Aviste said:
Focus sash would not be optimal since the only thing doing 240 is either a Megaton slam, Megalo Cannon with a muscle band or a massive evil ball. Remember G-Boosters, Lasers, and Bats do not activate this. So while in theory it seems good you'd probably be better off with a hard charm or a muscle band.
Click to expand...

Megalo Cannon and G-Booster are precisely why Focus Sash is in the deck. Without it, VirGen would be an extremely bad matchup. With it, though, Groudon can survive any attack, and Hawlucha will do a LOT of damage with the ability to survive any hit.

What's your guys' opinion on Silver Mirror as a tech against Flareon/Leafeon in this deck? Also legitimately curious since I don't really play the deck. On paper it seems good but I know that experience can be very different than on paper, so I just figured I'd ask.
Click to expand...

Too impracticable since you can't always rely on drawing it and if you do, it's pretty useless against other match ups except Plasma but since that deck archetype's dying, it's not worth it.
 
Aviste said:
Focus sash would not be optimal since the only thing doing 240 is either a Megaton slam, Megalo Cannon with a muscle band or a massive evil ball. Remember G-Boosters, Lasers, and Bats do not activate this. So while in theory it seems good you'd probably be better off with a hard charm or a muscle band.
Click to expand...

Focus sash is also really helpful in the Night March matchup. You can keep a Hawlucha or a Landorus alive for an extra turn. On Hawlucha that can mean a KO of Mew EX. With Landorus it can mean a KO of a Joltik (since shouted of power 1HKOs Joltik). The Landorus KO of the Joltik can be huge- it is the Night Marcher with the cheaper attack cost which means it is the one Mew will copy or the one they will want to attack with if Mew is not to hand. Getting an extra shout of power and taking out a Joltik with a DCE is the kind of thing that can turn the match.
 
Really, I was certain that G-booster would go through that. But ok. Will this deck go up a tier when Mega Turbo is released? Also how would this deck be rebuilt when it is available. I believe that the robo sub version will be a lot better when this comes out. Landorous is no longer needed to the extent it is now. It could be a 1 or 2 of but I don't think anymore.
 
Aviste said:
Really, I was certain that G-booster would go through that. But ok. Will this deck go up a tier when Mega Turbo is released? Also how would this deck be rebuilt when it is available. I believe that the robo sub version will be a lot better when this comes out. Landorous is no longer needed to the extent it is now. It could be a 1 or 2 of but I don't think anymore.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure about this. My first thought was my build would be 3-3 Groudon, 2 Landorus, 2 Hawlucha. But actually I really like Landorus as a starter. And I don't think Hawlucha is quite so strong in this deck, because its main strength is decks with lots of EX and Toad, but the matchup against those is great anyway.

Normally I'd just cut the Pokemon a bit to squeeze in the items, but the number of Pokemon would already be rock bottom.
 
Mega Turbo will be useful in this deck since Korrina can search for it. I would still run four Landorus though.
 
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