(1) Placeholder for Kyurem Forme Found in 'Black' and 'White' Coding [2/2]

[Xous]

Not to seem like a Debbie Downer here, seeing as I think the prospect of a new forme as awesome, but isn't the kind of news story that would tick Nintendo off? I remember the fiasco with the BW sprites/names before the games came out. The threat of site shut down was ominous at best. Releasing info from the game coding like this seems like it would get on the bad side of their legal department again.

In my opinion, I'd think they'd be more upset (or at least equally as upset) with the sprites of Genesect floating around the web than posting in-code information of a future forme of a Pokémon we already officially know about - in this case, it's likely / possible Kyurem's new forme will be revealed sometime this year to go along with the new film, but Genesect most likely / possibly won't be revealed until 2014. As far as secrets go, I'd think they'd be more concerned about people spoiling the ones meant for the end of the line.

However, since the games have gone public they don't seem to care that all of the "hidden" Pokémon within the 'Dex are there for anyone to see. So why should this information be any different?

 

[Tash]

http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4005434&postcount=2769

This was actually discovered quite a while ago. This is the only mention of it I could find with a quick Google search, but it's been circulating longer.

 

[Garceus]

Most likely two alternates: Kyurem Yin Forme and Kyurem Yang Forme.

Though the names will probably change when translated just like Reshiram and Zekrom's species names.

And of course I could be completely wrong. But it's my guess.

 

[Chariblaze]

http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4005434&postcount=2769

This was actually discovered quite a while ago. This is the only mention of it I could find with a quick Google search, but it's been circulating longer.

Kyurem specifically was discovered already. But what about the previous references in DP? That's what I find most interesting.

 

[Mitja]

Does that mean that every C-Gear skin has already been made and put into the Black/White game cards? (Does that also mean we can get that Purrloin C-Gear skin drawn by that woman hosting Pokémon Sunday?)

There is no set C-gear background.
Its a single combination of coloured pixels in the save file at a time.
So, unless someone manages to find a way to edit that part of the save-file by unofficial means, to change it to literally whatever you want, no.

 

[EeveeLv99]

I keep saying that it cannot be.
C-Gear and events are not new data, they are adjustment of the save file. Its like saying you can make a new pokemon appear in the ROM (read only memory) just by using AR cheats.

Why can't the game be patched? R/S was patched with the berry glitch, and it was the ROM was patched. The ROM might be read only for users, but that doesn't mean the developers can't change anything. It could even be a WiFi distribution applying the patch. But even then: D/P had placeholders for Rotom, Giratina, and Shaymin and those didn't get patched; A third version came with the alternate formes being [at the time] exclusive to Platinum. But who knows? Patches may have been previously tested and not brought to public due to glitches. Maybe such techniques have been perfected over time and we won't have to buy another game to see Kyurem's alternate forme (Or formes for all we know... I'm betting on two; One Fire based one Electric based)

Who knows though. We will only find out when the game comes out.

 

[Water Pokémon Master]

http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4005434&postcount=2769

This was actually discovered quite a while ago. This is the only mention of it I could find with a quick Google search, but it's been circulating longer.

Yes, MeroMero is the one who notified us of the data he posted there before he posted it there. He and Jade have been looking into it for a while.

 

[ArchedThunder]

Why can't the game be patched? R/S was patched with the berry glitch, and it was the ROM was patched. The ROM might be read only for users, but that doesn't mean the developers can't change anything. It could even be a WiFi distribution applying the patch. But even then: D/P had placeholders for Rotom, Giratina, and Shaymin and those didn't get patched; A third version came with the alternate formes being [at the time] exclusive to Platinum. But who knows? Patches may have been previously tested and not brought to public due to glitches. Maybe such techniques have been perfected over time and we won't have to buy another game to see Kyurem's alternate forme (Or formes for all we know... I'm betting on two; One Fire based one Electric based)

Who knows though. We will only find out when the game comes out.

DS games don't support patches, neither did GBA games for that matter.

 

[DNA]

DS games don't support patches, neither did GBA games for that matter.

Ruby and Sapphire were capable of gaining a patch to fix the Berry Glitch, provided you used a Link Cable to connect it with a FRLGE game and input a special code.

So yeah. GBA games can be patched. It's not a stretch to say that DS games can as well.

 

[Mitja]

I highly doubt the berry glitch fix actually did anything to the ROM itself.
Sadly I cannot seem to find any proper info about it

My guess would be that there was an additional different timer code already in from start, and the patch simply changed a prepared bit of the save file that tells the game to switch to a "failsafe timer".


If roms could be patched over simple link cables, there'd be tons of possibilities for hacking and other funny stuff lol.
They're called roms for a reason.

 

[EeveeLv99]

I highly doubt the berry glitch fix actually did anything to the ROM itself.
Sadly I cannot seem to find any proper info about it

My guess would be that there was an additional different timer code already in from start, and the patch simply changed a prepared bit of the save file that tells the game to switch to a "failsafe timer".


If roms could be patched over simple link cables, there'd be tons of possibilities for hacking and other funny stuff lol.
They're called roms for a reason.

No, it was a definitely ROM patch. By your logic, the glitch would appear after resetting the save file. However, doing so does not bring back the glitch, and unpatched cartridges are pretty rare now. It would be dumb for any developer to not be able to access and modify ROM code in case of such glitches. Otherwise, they would go the method of recalling each and every cartridge, replacing the cartridge, and sending users back fixed cartridges with all save data erased. There isn't really anything stopping them from just 'having fun' with it, either. It's "Read Only" to the common user, but the right people with the right equipment can modify anything.

 

[Water Pokémon Master]

Yeah, I'm sure they had their own way into the ROM, which allowed them to fix the problem.

 

[Mitja]

No, it was a definitely ROM patch. By your logic, the glitch would appear after resetting the save file. However, doing so does not bring back the glitch, and unpatched cartridges are pretty rare now. It would be dumb for any developer to not be able to access and modify ROM code in case of such glitches. Otherwise, they would go the method of recalling each and every cartridge, replacing the cartridge, and sending users back fixed cartridges with all save data erased. There isn't really anything stopping them from just 'having fun' with it, either. It's "Read Only" to the common user, but the right people with the right equipment can modify anything.

Sending data over link cable is hardly special rom hacking equipment.

There was never an option to reset the save file, you can just overwrite it with a new one, but even if you could, why would they make it delete the complete save file if its unecessary? Or rewrite every single bit of it everytime you save? That would just make glitches and errors more common. If you make a portable game that saves progress, wouldn't you want it to only rewrite whats necessary?

If anyone has actual knowledge on how it works on a technical level Id love to have this cleared up.

My initial point was that new game data, like pokemon or formes, cannot be added to sold games.

 

[Gr8Ampharos]

That's quite a shame that Keldeo could not have a sky forme much like Shaymins, I'd like to see it become a pegasus, making it a flying fighting type, if that can't happen then I'd at least want them to put team plasma leaders in the game and even a battle frontier with different mechanics. The fact that Kyurem was getting a new forme didn't shock me much but I was happy that the community was able to come together and find out more about an unsolved mystery

 

[Ophie]

I get the feeling that Kyurem will remain looking the way it does in Black/White, just as with Giratina, Shaymin, and Rotom having a limited amount of forms in Diamond/Pearl. I really don't mind though. Not like I really use Kyurem for anything.

One thing that should bring to mind is the Maka Wuhu glitch shortcut in Mario Kart 7. If there is anything in desperate need of a patch that Nintendo has made, it's this. You see, Maka Wuhu is unlike previous Mario Kart courses in that instead of doing three laps around a circuit, you're doing one big lap divided into three sections. At the end of the first section, you can fall into the water at a certain point to have Lakitu fish you out and put you at the end of the second section--in other words, you skip a third of the race. Needless to say, it's gotten to where large amounts of people online are picking Maka Wuhu repeatedly just to do this shortcut again and again for some quick wins.

If Nintendo doesn't patch something like this, it's not going to patch a new Kyurem form.

 

[Mitja]

Good point.
If they could patch anything they want easily, they would have done it in the past every now and then for all kinds of things.

 

[SuperMatt142]

In my opinion, I'd think they'd be more upset (or at least equally as upset) with the sprites of Genesect floating around the web than posting in-code information of a future forme of a Pokémon we already officially know about - in this case, it's likely / possible Kyurem's new forme will be revealed sometime this year to go along with the new film, but Genesect most likely / possibly won't be revealed until 2014. As far as secrets go, I'd think they'd be more concerned about people spoiling the ones meant for the end of the line.

However, since the games have gone public they don't seem to care that all of the "hidden" Pokémon within the 'Dex are there for anyone to see. So why should this information be any different?

That's fair Xous, I understand your point about the Genesect issue.

It's not against the law to mine information from a publicly released game. And who cares if Nintendo gets ticked off? They can't sensor information that anyone can access.

Also not to tick you WPM, but I was just asking a question. My main point wasn't really that you have the info... more along the lines of how the information was gained. Wasn't it taken from ROM code and aren't ROM's illegal? Again, just asking... not trying to gain hate here. I'm trying to learn. I have a blog and I'm just trying to learn what is and isn't cool to talk about legally.