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Cassius' Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Magnezone)

Pipotchi

Aspiring Trainer
Member
Pokemon (13):

  • 4 Dragonite EX (Rising Fist)
    2 Virizion EX
    2 Magnemite
    2 Magnezone (Dual Brains)
    1 Jirachi EX
    2 Ho-oh EX
Trainers/Supporters/Stadiums (32):

  • 2 Rare Candy
    1 Dowsing Machine
    3 Muscle Band
    2 Startling Megaphone
    1 Professor's Letter
    4 Ultra Ball
    2 Switch
    4 Cassius
    3 Sycamore
    3 Skyla
    4 N
    2 Lysandre
    1 Pal Pad
Energy (15):

  • 10 Grass
    5 Lightning

Strategy:
Hi again :) So my aim for this deck was to create a deck that allows me to recycle dragonite EXs ability several times, and this result was the most interesting one for me. Though it started as a fun deck, I am interested to hear if it can become competitively viable with changes! I'm quite new to the metagame so I might say some illogical things so just correct me if I do!

So Dragonite has the ability "Bust In", which means that when it is played it can instantly move to the active position and have any amount of energy moved to it. With a good 180hp and not being weak to dragon (haha screw you druddigon) it can hopefully manage to take a hit, and allow me to retreat it to safety with another dragonite! This dragonite grabs all the energy off the last and is fresh to attack next turn. The saved dragonite can then be picked off the bench with cyclone scoop up or cassius, allowing a new Bust In next turn and avoiding any issue of filling up bench space. I also have 2 max potions if necessary to keep my bench as full, as these dragonites will have taken damage but be energyless due to Bust In.
To quickly power up Dragonite I have Virizion EX, who can give it 2 grass energy with emerald slash. It also helps dragonite by keeping its hp at a number which is hard to ohko by making it unable to be poisoned. This helps conserve my energy.
This is the main strategy of the deck.

I also added in a 2-2 magnezone line here. This is quite important because it allows me to use a cassius and also a good supporter on the same turn. For instance I can cassius, then skyla for an ultra ball and get the Dragonite back. Or I can cassius and use a sycamore on the same turn. I can also skyla for a sycamore which means that my deck will be very consistent once a magnezone comes out, with good draw power throughout. Jirachi pairs well with Cassius and also with magnezone, being able to grab me that extra supporter I need in my hand. I can then get it off the bench with cyclone or cassius and use it again later.
Magnezone also provides some interesting effects as an attacker. Virizion and Dragonite both can't deal with pyroar, or safeguard pokemon. Magnezone has the nice benefit of being able to ohko both the safeguard pokemon with a muscle band, as well as having the good effect of gyro ball which means that anything it doesn't knock out (eg. pyroar) gets pushed to the bench while I can switch in a Dragonite to start hitting their switch-in. This makes Magnezone a very safe attacker since it can power up from the bench, come in and hit their roadblock and switch out before taking damage again. The icing on the cake is that powering up Magnezone isn't going to slow down the deck much at all; Dragonite can use the great ability Bust In to take all that energy off of Magnezone once its job is done and starting punching other pokemon with it.

All the rest of the cards don't really require too much explanation, I run 3 muscle bands in order to hit harder with dragonite and aim for one hit kos. This lets him ohko regular xerneas by discarding an energy as well as aromatisse without needing to discard an energy. And 1 lysandre in order to make sure I can drag out Aromatisse in fairy decks which will be the most effective vs Dragonite I believe. I'm only running 2 switch because dragonite will be switching in almost every turn just through its ability, but it is important to be able to switch out into abomasnow if a pyroar or safeguard pokemon switches in. Also Magnezone has the decent attack Gyro Ball which means it can act as an escape rope and is less scared of being stuck in the active position unlike other supporter cards. I can always save any of my pokemon from getting stuck in the active through cassius and cyclone too (tldr use cassius for everything)

And just to repeat my decks aim: use virizion to power up a long stream of dragonites. Avoid losing prizes by using dragonite's ability to switch into the active, take the energy and then use cassius/scoop up in order to pick up the weakened dragonite (effectively healing it from damage, and preparing it to use its ability next turn again). Win by "outhealing" any deck that can't ohko your dragonites. Lots of supporting cards such as magnezone, virizion, and lysandre etc to counter various playstyles that might hamper dragonite's cycle.

Thanks for reading and all feedback is appreciated!


edits: removed a few things (such as super scoop ups) and put in a couple of cassius instead. Increased my search power with another ultra ball to try and compensate. removed the virbank and lasers in order to just bulk out the deck with more necessities.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite / Virizion EX / Abomasnow)

I don't think Raichu is the play.

I would suggest adding escape rope, another max potion, and a couple of more energy...you don't want to chance any turns without being able to play an energy card since there won't be much energy acceleration other than virizion, an easy kill for two prizes. Not worth the risk.

Oh, Cassius would be better than super scoop, even if you have to search for Dragonite again. Flips are too risky.

Best of luck. I will be interested to know how it works.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite / Virizion EX / Abomasnow)

Hi,
Yea I actually immediately removed the raichu after posting the thread since it was just a waste of cards. In its place I added another switch, and 2 lasers and 2 virbank to hit some ohkos if it becomes necessary.

I will change 1 switch for an escape rope. I am also interested in replacing a couple of super scoop ups with cassius. If I increase my search power then this will hopefully not be too much of a problem. I think adding a jirachi ex could also be effective since cyclone scoop up means I can play it twice, and it means I can pick out the supporters that I will need. I will make some changes because I agree the deck is cutting it too low on energy too, especially with dragonite discarding a lot.


so:
- 1 switch
- 2 super scoop up
- 1 lysandre
- 2 virbank
- 2 hypnotoxic laser
(-9 cards)

+ 3 grass energy
+ 1 escape rope
+ 2 cassius
+ 1 jirachi EX
+ 1 ultra ball

I think this balances out my deck a bit more. However I think 1 counter-stadium could be useful here. Nothing really jumps out as being effective at supporting dragonite though.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Abomasnow)

This sounds really interesting. A friend was talking about pairing Dragonite with Flygon.

-2 Super Rod; it's being rotated.
-1 Professor's Letters

+ 2 Colress
+1 Sycamore

Cause Supporters.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Abomasnow)

Since Super Rod is rotating out, you will want some way to recover energies you might discard with Sonic Jet and Sycamore.
Also, your energy count is low (not low for a competitive deck, but low for longer fights, do not increase it but find ways to make it more usable), you can't rely on Letters in the late game or if the opponent manage to KO 2 fully energized Dragonites.
I would add 2 Energy Retrieval or maybe Superior Energy Retrieval.

Superior isn't mandatory in your case because you will hardly have more than 3 energies to recover and you rely a lot in your hand to be able to discard 2 for 4 energy, but it depends on how you play.

Also, try to get rid of the Coin Flip Scoop Ups, they are unreliable and you might waste a Skyla for one and have it backfire. Try more Cassius, maybe Max Potions with Superior Energy Retrieval or, If you haven't dried your Grass Energies out of your deck, swing with virizion.

I can foresee some problems, since Dragonite doesn't hit much for a EX, it is possible that most competitive games will last too long and you will end up with no Energies to hit. Far too much decks can OHKO him before we can 2HKO something. Another bunch of them can retreat and / or heal faster than you kill, specially with you get Megaphoned or/and are lacking Muscle Bands.

Oh, and obviously, Xerneas + Aromatisse is your doom.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Abomasnow)

I was thinking of adding the following +20 dmg lines to further increase to potency of Dragonite-EX'es damage build-up.

+2-2 or +3-3 Altaria BCR line
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Abomasnow)

Yea I dont know if there is even any point trying to add techs for this that beat aromatisse xerneas, since nothing really will. My main strategy vs that deck would be to build up energy elsewhere and try and surprise them with a lysandre + bust in, being able to ohko aromatisse or regular xerneas. I am hoping that aromatisse will die down somewhat due to prism energy going away next rotation. I will think about getting rid of the super scoop ups. But the effects of hitting heads for my deck is absolutely huge because it means a free switch, a free heal, and a free 3 energy switches at the same time. Its also far better than cassius because it will put the dragonite (and muscle band or whatever I'm using) straight into my hand instead of shuffling them away. Plus, adding more cassius is kinda painful because I ideally don't want to be using it as my supporter every turn unless I need to. If I could rely on something like a delphox or electrode for draw power every turn then perhaps this would be okay.

A 2-2 altaria line sounds interesting. Not having to discard to get ohkos would be nice, and hitting for potentially 180 with everything in play is the magic number, so its somewhat relevant. Also having a different weakness to altaria is good. I am worried about altaria's incredibly low hp in a world of genesects and lysandres but I will have a think about i I can fit it in!
I will also consider the energy retrievals to replace the super rods.


Edit: so in total I think these are the cards that I could remove if i absolutely HAD to:

- 2 super rod (these have to go anyway)
-1 snover
-1 abomasnow (this is weakening my answer to pyroar :S)
-1 jirachi EX (this is a shame because it pairs well with scoop up cyclone)
-1 dragonite EX (just because 3 is enough for your opponent to take 6 prizes so more could be considered too much)
-1 sycamore
-1 grass energy

So at max I could have 8 cards changed. But they would need to hopefully solve the problems that are created by taking away these cards- I need to be able to beat 4-4 pyroar decks still and i need to make up for the energy loss. And I always need to be able to find a new dragonite every turn. I think +2 energy retrieval is obviously the first step to replace the super rods.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Abomasnow)

Actually, with your main strategy, Dragonite NEED to be in full numbers. You need to have at least one in your hand each and every turn and, if your Scoop-ups fail, you will want to be able to fetch some from your deck or draw one by using a Sycamore.

Also, giving you will rely too much in Dragonite and Snover to cover the threats, you might want to add Pokemon Fan Club, fetching you 2 basics from the deck into your hand... this can assure you will have a Dragonite most of the time, specially if you create momentum using one Cassius before, hit with Virizion to get 2 [G] and, in the next turn, use Pokemon Fan Club.

Altaria seems to be a good option, but you will need to search for it more often than not. If you are aiming to get 3 or 4 of them in the bench, you will have 2 problems: You will need more Evosodas (at least one) and will run out of Bench slots for Virizion, Abomasnow and another Dragonites rather quickly. Do not expect to have more than 2 in your bench by any time or will won't be able to rotate your Dragonites effectively.

EDIT: For drawing Dragonites or Ultra Ball fodder, Great Ball might be an option to item based pokemon fetch, although it is not as reliable as Ultras or FanClub.
Also, about electrodes or Bicycle, this deck plays a lot with your hand, you will hold to Scoop-Ups, Cassius, Energy and Dragonites for the whole game, you will hardly have less than 4 card with you, provided your current draw engines give you what you want.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Abomasnow)

Okay so I was thinking about my deck a little more seriously and I think I can improve it a lot by switching out my Abomasnow line for a Magnezone line. Magnezone with the ability dual brains has a few useful traits- firstly, it allows me to go for 4 cassius because I don't need to worry about my draw power since I can play another supporter the same turn. This lets me use cassius followed by a sycamore, or even followed by a skyla for an ultra ball to get the dragonite back. This strengthens my dragonite cycle a lot. Secondly it actually is ok at dealing with pyroar and other roadblock pokemon due to its attack gyro ball which is basically an escape rope, meaning it can attack and push the roadblock pokemon to the bench, meaning that even if I can't necessarily ohko it I can always push it to the bench at least temporarily. From then on I can perhaps get another attack with dragonite before it gets the right cards to come back into the active position. I don't mind having a stage 2 line in the deck also considering I am running EXs for all my other attackers, which are fast to set up and don't even necessarily need Magnezone to start hitting people. This lead to a whole slew of changes- due to magnezone having a built-in escape rope, I replaced my escape rope for another switch. I also added another lightning energy instead of the evosoda for abomasnow. Using 4 cassius means I can fully retire the super scoop ups. I will also run 2 energy retrieval instead of super rod.

- 3 snover
- 3 abomasnow
- 2 super scoop up
- 1 evosoda
- 2 super rod
- 1 escape rope

+ 2 magnemite
+ 2 magnezone
+ 2 rare candy
+ 2 cassius
+ 1 lightning
+ 2 energy retrieval
+ 1 switch

I'm just asking opinions before I actually put these changes in :) Magnezone isnt as good as abomasnow at dealing with pyroar, sigilyph and suicune but it does the job and it has a good supportive ability and its attack has some utility. I'm not too afraid of wasting time powering up a magnezone either considering its energy can be taken by a dragonite EX at any point with Bust In.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Abomasnow)

Hey, I liked where you are heade with this Magnezone, it might actually work! Nice job!

If you play test this new build, I would like to know how it went.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Magnezone)

Garbodor's Garbotoxin ability is still a thing... a few startling Megaphones, 2 or 3 total would be nice but I don't know what you could replace them with. If need be,1 Plasma Chatot (not the best option).

pure power alone can only get you so far if you can't use all your assets.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Magnezone)

Since there is a fair bit of positive about Magnezone, time for a little constructive criticism.

1. It's really gimmicky.

When it works, it's nice. But you're putting all your chips down in assumption that Magenezone will get in play fast and stay there. You did state earlier that this format is very heavy on Catcher-like effects, so if the opponent takes Magnezone out (it isn't a bulky Stage 2) the main card you have to get Dragonite off the board to re-use Bust In is a sub-par supporter that will lock out your only way to draw for that turn.

2. It isn't even remotely a Pyroar out.

The best Pyroar decks run just 4-4 Pyroar and a couple of tech Pokemon, then a slew of Catchers, Lysandres, the usual Fire support and ways to draw into them. At best, you Gyro Ball a weakened Pyroar and knock it out. At worst, you don't even get a chance to evolve to Magnezone because the Magnemite were brought active and dealt with. The mid-ground option has you Gyro Balling a Pyroar, who will simply switch off of it into a fresh Litleo or Pyroar, Blacksmithing it and bringing either Mag back out or a Virizion EX which eventually leads you to a losing situation. Even if they don't manage that, all they need to win is 1 surviving Pyroar out of 4, on top of any brought back by Sacred Ash all the while trading damage with Magnezone and hitting your switch in when possible.

3. Garbodor is still the most popular tech Pokemon.

And your deck simply loses to it. XD

Magnezone may sound really nice on paper, but in practice it really isn't that good. If you rely too much on it your deck will fall apart pretty hard in crucial situations. I agree with 4te's statement.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Magnezone)

4te- Yea thats true. Not sure what I could drop for several megaphones and idk if this deck can be made to beat pyroar well. I did say that my deck is weaker now vs pyroar than before. I could drop the max potions for megaphones but being forced to spare 10 cards every deck just to counter all the win-condition pokemon is so depressing :(


I think magnezone is still a better fit for the deck than abomasnow. It improves the main function of the deck a lot which should probably be the main focus before even thinking about techs. I know the weaknesses to magnezone but I would really appreciate some alternative suggestions if you think magnezone is not the way to go.

Also I just wanna point out that this deck will work without magnezone in play whatsoever. Just cyclone gives me 5 opportunities to use bust-in, so its not like the deck falls apart without magnezone at all. A lot of decks don't hit the bench and only run 1 lysandre in order to drag stuff out, so a bust-in can easily be enough to save a dragonite vs these sorts of decks, with or without a cassius. I'd say its an exaggeration to say that I rely heavily on getting magnezone into play. However it does pair well with Dragonites need for lightning energy and allows me to play cassius as well as another supporter if I want to.
 
RE: Scoop Up Switching Dinosaur! (Dragonite EX / Virizion EX / Magnezone)

Bumping a quite old thread but I have revisited this deck recently and given it some more playtesting. This are the changes I made:

-1 Virizion: often setting up twice with virizions is about the maximum I can get a game, so having more than 2 seemed pointless.

+2 Ho-oh: this card has great synergy with dragonite ex being able to pick up the energy off it. I heard its part of the rotation which is really lame, but I will still be using it up until that point.

-1 Scoop up cyclone: yea thats what the title is, but after playing I just couldn't really justify it now that I'm using cassius. They last me until I deck out with pal pad, and with magnezone they are easy to play without hindering myself. It just seemed silly to not use another ace spec instead of wasting it on an area thats already covered for me.

+1 dowsing machine: this is the better ace spec for the deck imo. After playtesting I found that lysandres are crucial to finishing off games, and dowsing machine can grab any of my supporters for another use- which is good synergy with magnezone again. Also saves me from a dreadful start, because I can pull an N or w/e out the discard. Also getting another startling megaphone or switch can be helpful.

-1 Professor's letter: not so necessary with virizion in the deck. but having 1 is still good

-2 energy retrieval: i replaced this with ho-oh who is a lot more dynamic and synergistic with dragonite. if he rotates, I will likely change this back.

+1 lysandre: this deck needs to be hitting benched pokemon. garbodors, aromatisses, and switching out pyroars. now I can use lysandre 4 times in the match, which usually wont be necessary but using it 3 times is now a very possible option for me.

Those are the changes. After playtesting I found it more effective, also beating another dragonite deck earlier :p tell me what you think. If ho-oh goes, I think I will try and incorporate abomasnow or beartic into the deck. Probably the latter will be stronger just due to only needing two colorless, and having enough hp to avoid a ko from two regular scorching fangs (forces a discard). And it also beats landorus.
 
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