ORAS Changes to the Hoenn Pokédex?

[xxashxx]

No the National dex is the smallest dex in each game. Then I realized after a few posters that Regigigas has not been in the National dex. Took awhile to sink in. I never go by the National dex. Only the full dex XD. That was all I was saying XD. I go by the national dex because the regional dex messes me over every time. I tried with the regional dex in FR/LG and it did not make sense so I only use the National dex and I go by that in every new game I get. The regional dex is very confusing.

wt...? You just contradicted yourself. First, you say you never go by the National Dex, only the "full dex" (which, in case you still didn't notice, IS the National Dex). But then, you say you go by the National Dex because the Regional Dex is confusing...
You either typed wrong what you meant to say or you're not getting any of this...

I typed wrong Man. I prefer the national dex over the regional dex. Sorry man.

 

[Bolt the Cat]

So the Hoenn Dex has been textdumped and as we all guessed, it's basically the same. Although unlike what many of us though, Regigigas isn't even in it, it's just 211 Pokemon (The original 202 + 9 cross gen evos):

http://pastebin.com/G9Xz7Kkm

I'll echo this sentiment again: this was a stupid decision. It makes the game a lot more repetitive having to rely on those same 200 again and the rosters suffer from not having enough variety. I don't understand why they didn't bother updating it, they fixed Sinnoh's dex in Platinum when it had similar problems, why not Hoenn?

 

[Scattered mind]

So the Hoenn Dex has been textdumped and as we all guessed, it's basically the same. Although unlike what many of us though, Regigigas isn't even in it, it's just 211 Pokemon (The original 202 + 9 cross gen evos):

http://pastebin.com/G9Xz7Kkm

I'll echo this sentiment again: this was a stupid decision. It makes the game a lot more repetitive having to rely on those same 200 again and the rosters suffer from not having enough variety. I don't understand why they didn't bother updating it, they fixed Sinnoh's dex in Platinum when it had similar problems, why not Hoenn?

I kind of understand why they did this in order to keep it like the original. Still they could add new Pokemon in post game. I hope we could have at least the cross gen evolution items during the story.

 

[Bolt the Cat]

So the Hoenn Dex has been textdumped and as we all guessed, it's basically the same. Although unlike what many of us though, Regigigas isn't even in it, it's just 211 Pokemon (The original 202 + 9 cross gen evos):

http://pastebin.com/G9Xz7Kkm

I'll echo this sentiment again: this was a stupid decision. It makes the game a lot more repetitive having to rely on those same 200 again and the rosters suffer from not having enough variety. I don't understand why they didn't bother updating it, they fixed Sinnoh's dex in Platinum when it had similar problems, why not Hoenn?

I kind of understand why they did this in order to keep it like the original. Still they could add new Pokemon in post game. I hope we could have at least the cross gen evolution items during the story.

I don't think this is something that needed to be kept the same, having more Pokemon doesn't ruin the nostalgic experience if done right. As long as they don't overload the game with them to the point where we get a 6th gen situation, they only enhance the game giving the player more options, adding extra challenge to the trainer rosters, and making things less repetitive in general.

There's already confirmation of tons of post game Pokemon, so you don't need to worry about that. But as far as the main game goes, that doesn't help things at all, having them relegated to post game prevents them from being used earlier on when they'd be more useful. That's the real issue behind wanting a dex expansion, the game is repetitive as hell because of too few options in the original Hoenn Dex and they've done absolutely nothing to change that even when they have twice as many Pokemon as the originals.

 

[Scattered mind]

I kind of understand why they did this in order to keep it like the original. Still they could add new Pokemon in post game. I hope we could have at least the cross gen evolution items during the story.

I don't think this is something that needed to be kept the same, having more Pokemon doesn't ruin the nostalgic experience if done right. As long as they don't overload the game with them to the point where we get a 6th gen situation, they only enhance the game giving the player more options, adding extra challenge to the trainer rosters, and making things less repetitive in general.

There's already confirmation of tons of post game Pokemon, so you don't need to worry about that. But as far as the main game goes, that doesn't help things at all, having them relegated to post game prevents them from being used earlier on when they'd be more useful. That's the real issue behind wanting a dex expansion, the game is repetitive as hell because of too few options in the original Hoenn Dex and they've done absolutely nothing to change that even when they have twice as many Pokemon as the originals.

I agree that that they could add some Pokemon and still manage to keep it nostalgic but I think it still won't feel repetitive since you have the Mega evolutions. So I still understand that decision. I think they did the same in HG/SS.
Anyway I am glad that at least the post game will be full of new Pokemon for Hoenn

 

[Bolt the Cat]

I don't think this is something that needed to be kept the same, having more Pokemon doesn't ruin the nostalgic experience if done right. As long as they don't overload the game with them to the point where we get a 6th gen situation, they only enhance the game giving the player more options, adding extra challenge to the trainer rosters, and making things less repetitive in general.

There's already confirmation of tons of post game Pokemon, so you don't need to worry about that. But as far as the main game goes, that doesn't help things at all, having them relegated to post game prevents them from being used earlier on when they'd be more useful. That's the real issue behind wanting a dex expansion, the game is repetitive as hell because of too few options in the original Hoenn Dex and they've done absolutely nothing to change that even when they have twice as many Pokemon as the originals.

I agree that that they could add some Pokemon and still manage to keep it nostalgic but I think it still won't feel repetitive since you have the Mega evolutions. So I still understand that decision. I think they did the same in HG/SS.
Anyway I am glad that at least the post game will be full of new Pokemon for Hoenn

How exactly do Megas help with that? We don't see them that often, and they don't help the wild distribution at all.

 

[Scattered mind]

We don't know yet how often we will see Megas in the new games.
As I said, HG/SS did the same thing, having only Pokemon from the original game and their evolutions from gen 4 and it is one of their best games and I can't say it felt repetitive.For me it felt more nostalgic.
Having the new Pokemon only in the post game is a great thing as you have much more things to do in the post game. This is one of the reasons why we don't feel like XY had a good post game.
In addition if we want to play the remakes with Pokemon that are unobtainable during the story we can just use the Pokebank which I think this also could be a reason to why they included only Pokemon from the originals.

 

[Bolt the Cat]

We don't know yet how often we will see Megas in the new games.

Megas aren't new Pokemon though, and they don't solve the game's problems at all.

As I said, HG/SS did the same thing, having only Pokemon from the original game and their evolutions from gen 4 and it is one of their best games and I can't say it felt repetitive.

Look again. We had Clair and Lance using 2 Dragonairs/ 3 Dragonites because of a lack of Dragon types, then we had the Ecruteak gym which only really used the Gastly line.

Having the new Pokemon only in the post game is a great thing as you have much more things to do in the post game.

Why not both though? Both the main game and post game were lacking in the originals.

This is one of the reasons why we don't feel like XY had a good post game.

In addition if we want to play the remakes with Pokemon that are unobtainable during the story we can just use the Pokebank which I think this also could be a reason to why they included only Pokemon from the originals.

Also does not solve the game's problems. Banking in Pokemon doesn't make the water routes less repetitive or give Phoebe and Glacia more Pokemon to work with.

 

[Scattered mind]

I really understand your point now but there is no surprise in that matter since again this is how game freak does remakes all the time and I never felt that their remakes are repetitive. I don't think gym leaders for example can have new Pokemon and still be nostalgic but thats just my opinion.

 

[Bolt the Cat]

I really understand your point now but there is no surprise in that matter since again this is how game freak does remakes all the time

It can be surprising depending on how you look at it. If you compare it to FRLG and HGSS, then yeah, it's not really a surprise, but when you look at some of the more recent games like Platinum, BW1, BW2, and XY, you notice that they've been open to making bigger changes and playing around with established conventions. To come back to having a remake that is so similar to the originals after games like that certainly feels like a step backwards.

and I never felt that their remakes are repetitive.

I never said that remakes are repetitive, I said that the trainer rosters and Pokemon distribution is repetitive. For instance, several of the Elite 4 use duplicates because there's not enough families for them to work with and the water routes are nothing more than Tentacool/Tentacruel and Wingull/Pelipper. A lot of these decisions are a result of a small and unbalanced Hoenn Dex, and it's unacceptable for them to not go back and fix these problems when they have almost double the number of Pokemon that they did in the originals.

I don't think gym leaders for example can have new Pokemon and still be nostalgic but thats just my opinion.

Sure they can. As long as they don't flood the game with new Pokemon and keep the emphasis on Hoenn, they only serve to enhance what the originals did. And really, it'd be no less nostalgic than some of the changes they've already made. Is Phoebe's Dusknoir nostalgic? How about Glacia's Froslass? Those weren't in the originals, should we complain about those things simply because they didn't exist back then?

 

[KiKi]

I agree with Bolt about the rosters of Gym Leaders and the Elite Four.
Dusknoir and Froslass are new additions to Phoebe and Glacia's team.
The game can certainly be nostalgic, even with the addition of new features and Pokemon.
Last time I checked, I don't remember being able to Soar in RSE on Latios and Latias.

 

[Scattered mind]

I agree with Bolt about the rosters of Gym Leaders and the Elite Four.
Dusknoir and Froslass are new additions to Phoebe and Glacia's team.
The game can certainly be nostalgic, even with the addition of new features and Pokemon.
Last time I checked, I don't remember being able to Soar in RSE on Latios and Latias.

I never talked about the new features. I actually think they are the things that should be in order to make a remake not feeling repetitive but this is slight off topic as we are talking about the Pokedex and like I said -Not adding new Pokemon to the storyline will not make the game feel repetitive or boring for most of us and the proof is HGSS ..In the same way , including new Pokemon won't hurt the nostalgic feeling of the game THAT much, but for me it will, kind of .. (I don't have any problem that Glacia will use Frosslas but I will think it is kind of weird out of place and funny if she will have Avalugg)

 

[bbninjas]

I agree with Bolt about the rosters of Gym Leaders and the Elite Four.
Dusknoir and Froslass are new additions to Phoebe and Glacia's team.
The game can certainly be nostalgic, even with the addition of new features and Pokemon.
Last time I checked, I don't remember being able to Soar in RSE on Latios and Latias.

I never talked about the new features. I actually think they are the things that should be in order to make a remake not feeling repetitive but this is slight off topic as we are talking about the Pokedex and like I said -Not adding new Pokemon to the storyline will not make the game feel repetitive or boring for most of us and the proof is HGSS ..In the same way , including new Pokemon won't hurt the nostalgic feeling of the game THAT much, but for me it will, kind of .. (I don't have any problem that Glacia will use Frosslas but I will think it is kind of weird out of place and funny if she will have Avalugg)

Wait, she as Avalugg!? That is crazy. She should just keep a Glalie and Frosslass, maybe a Delibird or something...

 

[TheBreen]

bbninjas:

No, we don't know any of the E4 rosters currently. scatteredmini and kiki are making theories about what Pokemon the E4 and the Gym Leaders could have to help improve the diversity of the Pokedex in a GenIII remake.

I think one of the easiest fixes is that in RSE, the Safari Zone was part of Story Mode...
Who knows WHAT you can find in there?
And what about these Islands Steven takes you to in the special demo? Are they really that special, or will they be part of Story mode? Can you Soar to them yourself later?

I also hold the stance that they'll do what they did with (which year was it?) 2011? Possibly allowing you to use up to 2 "Ubers"?

 

[Bolt the Cat]

bbninjas:

No, we don't know any of the E4 rosters currently. scatteredmini and kiki are making theories about what Pokemon the E4 and the Gym Leaders could have to help improve the diversity of the Pokedex in a GenIII remake.

I think one of the easiest fixes is that in RSE, the Safari Zone was part of Story Mode...
Who knows WHAT you can find in there?
And what about these Islands Steven takes you to in the special demo? Are they really that special, or will they be part of Story mode? Can you Soar to them yourself later?

I also hold the stance that they'll do what they did with (which year was it?) 2011? Possibly allowing you to use up to 2 "Ubers"?

We already know the answers to most of these questions, the game's code was leaked about 2 weeks ago. If you'd like to see the Elite 4 and Safari Zone rosters, try here:

Trainer Rosters
Pokemon Distribution

As for the islands, based on their appearance in the Pokemon distribution code it seems like you can Soar to them as soon as you unlock the ability.

 

[Mitja]

So yeah, the thread is pointless now if it's just about the hoenndex (as we already know it's the same + 9 evolutions and nothing else).

But non-hoenndex pokemon distributions is interesting enough.

Huge spoiler: here is a work in progress list of non-hoenndex pokemon that will be obtainable via pokeradar (or some similar method) in the postgame

Spoiler

beginning route (101): Lillipup/Zorua/Sewaddle
route towars Petalburg (102): Lillipup/Gothita/Tympole (second complements Ralts nicely)
north of oldale (103): Lillipup/Chatot/Shellos-1 (no idea which Shellos that is)
route before Petalburg Woods: Pidove/Sewaddle/Chatot
typical sea route: Frillish/Clauncher/Krabby
route above Slateport: Trubbish/Chatot/Shellos-1
desert: Sandile/Dwebble/Gible
routes around Mt.Chimney: Ponyta/Sawk/Tyrogue
ash route: Scraggy/Klefki/Bouffalant
north of Metero Falls: Skorupi/Misdreavus/Tympole
surf-accessed area beyond meteorfalls: Pidove/Misdreavus/Clefairy
route east of Rustburo: Pidove/Joltik/Eevee
fields west of Mauville: Rattata/Deerling/Tympole
east of Mauville: Raticate/Luxio/Aipom
in front of safari: Elgyem/Hypno/Aipom
eastern surfing routes: Frillish/Finneon/Alomomola
meteor falls: Deino/Druddigon/Clefairy
granite cave: Timburr/Axew/Onix
Petalburg woods: Cottonee/Paras/Phantump
mt.chimney: Ponyta/Mankey/Tyrogue
fiery path: Roggenrola/Diglett/Tyrogue
mt.pyre: Elygem/Bronzor/Growlithe
shoal cave: Cubchoo/Delibird/Dewgong
safari-zone: Kakuna/Pidgeotto/Buneary

 

[Bolt the Cat]

So yeah, the thread is pointless now if it's just about the hoenndex (as we already know it's the same + 9 evolutions and nothing else).

But non-hoenndex pokemon distributions is interesting enough.

Huge spoiler: here is a work in progress list of non-hoenndex pokemon that will be obtainable via pokeradar (or some similar method) in the postgame

Spoiler

beginning route (101): Lillipup/Zorua/Sewaddle
route towars Petalburg (102): Lillipup/Gothita/Tympole (second complements Ralts nicely)
north of oldale (103): Lillipup/Chatot/Shellos-1 (no idea which Shellos that is)
route before Petalburg Woods: Pidove/Sewaddle/Chatot
...
will add more later

Let me finish that for you:

Spoiler

Rt. 101: Lilllipup Lv. 2, Zorua Lv. 2, Sewaddle Lv. 2
Rt. 102: Lillipup Lv. 3, Gothita Lv. 3 (probably version exclusive with Solosis), Tympole Lv. 3
Rt. 103: Lillipup Lv. 3, Chatot Lv. 3, Shellos-1 Lv. 3(as far as which form, I'm guessing since West Sea was in XY, it could be East Sea)
Rt. 104: Pidove Lv. 7, Sewaddle Lv. 7, Chatot Lv. 7
Petalburg Woods: Cottonee Lv. 6 (not version exclusive since Petilil can be found in a Mirage Spot/post game island you access by Soaring), Paras Lv. 6, Phantump Lv. 6
Rt. 116: Pidove Lv. 8, Joltik Lv. 8, Eevee Lv. 8
Rt. 105-109: Frillish Lv. 25, Clauncher Lv. 25 (could possibly be version exclusive with Skrelp), Krabby Lv. 25
Granite Cave: Timburr Lv. 12, Axew Lv. 12, Onix Lv. 12
Rt. 110: Trubbish Lv. 13, Chatot Lv. 13, Shellos-1 Lv. 13
Rt. 117: Rattata Lv. 14, Deerling Lv. 14 (no idea how Deerling's forms are handled), Tympole Lv. 14
Rt. 111: Sandile Lv. 23, Dwebble Lv. 23, Gible Lv. 23
Rt. 112: Ponyta Lv. 16, Sawk Lv. 16 (probably version exclusive with Throh), Tyrogue Lv. 16
Fiery Path: Roggenrola Lv. 15, Diglett Lv. 15, Tyrogue Lv. 15
Rt. 113: Scraggy Lv. 18, Klefki Lv. 18, Bouffalant Lv. 18
Rt. 114: Skorupi Lv. 19, Misdreavus Lv. 19, Tympole Lv. 19
Meteor Falls 1F: Deino Lv. 19, Druddigon Lv. 19, Clefairy Lv. 19
Meteor Falls 2F & B1F: Deino Lv. 40, Druddigon Lv. 40, Clefairy Lv. 40
Rt. 115: Pidove Lv. 20, Misdreavus Lv. 20, Clefairy Lv. 20
Jagged Pass: Ponyta Lv. 21, Mankey Lv. 21, Tyrogue Lv. 21
Rt. 118: Raticate Lv. 24, Luxio Lv. 24, Aipom Lv. 24
Rt. 121: Elgyem Lv. 30, Hypno Lv. 30, Aipom Lv. 30
Safari Zone: Kakuna Lv. 30, Pidgeotto Lv. 30, Buneary Lv. 30
Rt. 122: Frillish Lv. 25, Finneon Lv. 25, Alomomola Lv. 25
Mt. Pyre: Elgyem Lv. 31, Bronzor Lv. 31, Growlithe Lv. 31
Rt. 124: Frillish Lv. 30, Finneon Lv. 30, Alomomola Lv. 30
Rt. 125: Frillish Lv. 30, Finneon Lv. 30, Seel Lv. 30
Rt. 126-134: Frillish Lv. 30, Finneon Lv. 30, Alomomola Lv. 30
Shoal Cave: Cubchoo Lv. 34, Delibird Lv. 34, Dewgong Lv. 34

Really wish we'd have seen a similar distribution in the main game, these Pokemon would've been wonderful additions to their respective areas (well a couple of Pokemon in the early game like Zorua and Eevee do make me raise an eyebrow). Shame that they're so dead set on recreating the game to improve the game where it counts.

 

[Kangaflora]

^In that case, then, whom on this forum has the guts to give us a full PREDICTION of what All New Hoenn Dex will look like in terms of Pokémon? I know I don't have the guts to make that prediction!

 

[MegaBeedrill]

Pretty sure we already know it's no different than it was in the originals along with some crossgen evolutions like magnezone.

 

[Mitja]

^In that case, then, whom on this forum has the guts to give us a full PREDICTION of what All New Hoenn Dex will look like in terms of Pokémon? I know I don't have the guts to make that prediction!

Those are post-game encounters through a new method.

We already know the Hoenndex is identical, +7 evolutions (Gallade, Probopass, Magnezone, Roserade, Dusknoir, Rhyperior, Froslass) and +2 babies (Budew, Chingling), nothing else.