Cinccino and Zoroark will have a major effect on the Meta Game

NJPokeDad

NJPokeDad

Aspiring Trainer
Member
So, after my pre-release draft I finally was able to build my long awaited Cinccino and Zoroark deck.

Here is what I found. Zoroark is the perfect counter to any Gengar deck. He has psychic resistance and the ability to use Gengar's shadow room. Using shadow room to knock out a Gengar as we know circumvents feinting spell and rescue energy. Plus with DCE he easily slips into any deck.

Cinccino is the ultimate SP counter. For a DCE you can knock out any Garchomp, Ampibom and Dragonite. Also, he can easily be set up to do 100 damage every time. With an expert belt or Crobat, he can take out Luxray as well. Again utilizing Colorless energy this little guy slips into any deck.

These two are heavy hitters that can be set up on one turn with DCE and BTS. Using a 1-1 line of either in any deck seems like a strong possibility. They will both definitely have an immediate effect on the meta game and I look forward to finding new ways to use both.
 
I have to disagree slightly
Zoaroark won't be played right now b/c the new rules but next year doing any attack and KOing things is great and besides if i wanted to KO gengar w/ shadow room Ditto does the job much better as it is a basic, granted it takes a psychic energy, but he also has more hp and still gets resistance to psychic.

Cinccino is not the ultimate SP counter as Promocroak and Lucario GL and Garchomp C LV.X+flash bite laugh at it, 90 HP isn't enough, however next year i see him as being a very good deck and you hinted to it being an edge in a Garchomp war, what about this for mirror Cinccino
Cinccino v. Bouffalant, you could play 4-4 and 4 bouffalant and your whole mirror game would be trading prizes like that, just saying that could happen next year.
 
Promocroak says hello!
Zoroark can be a good counter to Gengar.
But Cinccino agaisnst SP?
Promocroak/D Rush+Flash bite
 
Zoroark might not be the BEST gengar counter, but its also super flexible. Since you don't need the right energy it can copy attacks more easily than ditto. I really want to copy dragon beat :)
 
Good comments. Here is my take.

Dragon Rush and flash bite that works against almost everything.

If I am running Vilegar/Gyarados/Scizor/Donphan I can easily tech in a 1-1 or 2-2 line of Cinccino.

If you bring up a Garchomp and Garchomp X for a dragon rush, I drop a Cinccino and a DCE for the easy KO. If you come back with Promocroak for the KO it would be much easier to knock that out then a Lux X or Chomp X with whatever else I may be using.

Saying there are ways for SP to knock it out doesn't say much. SP has ways of doing a lot of things. This is just a very good counter that will present a few new problems for an SP deck especially in the mirror.

As far as Zoroark/ditto. I agree Ditto is a great Gengar counter. However, Zoroark can be used in a lot of situations whereas Ditto cannot. Zoroark is a great Gengar counter that is also a great card against many other things. Even if you need to use it to Dragon Rush you can.

Oops, someone got in before me. I agree with amisheskimoninja.
 
My bro has been running cincinno for the past couple of days Ne it beats almost everything cept vilegar and scizor.
 
Well, you guys have to put into consideration that we'll most likely lose all of the SP engine, except Radar, from the rotation. What could be considered counters don't really sound much like counters when you consider that you no longer have Energy Gain to let you use that counter the turn it gets put into play. Wait until next year and Zoroark will be much more splashable.

If for some reason SP stays around (Or even if it doesn't), just run Bouffalant (the afro bull thing, too lazy to look up actual spelling). It can revenge kill for 90 damage for a Double Colorless energy, which is absolutely brilliant if you don't have access to expensive cards like Luxray GL Lv.X.
 
Best Gengar counter isn't Zoroark but Mandibuzz, it's second attack Punishment for {D}{C}{C} can do 200 damage (210 with Special Dark attached) to Gengar and that's including Weakness applied as well.

Also since Mandibuzz isn't weak to {F} like Zoroark that helps give it an edge especially against Donphan Prime and Machamp. I think the new Sawk will hurt Zoroark and Umbreon UD's playability quite a bit as well, and it might also be a decent tech against Zekrom and Galvantula.
 
Next format Umbreon UD's playability will drop without the presence of Sawk because of the fact that many cards that have Powers and Bodies will be out of the format/not played to a great extent. Umbreon was this years one hit wonder really, and that wasn't even that big of a hit.

I think that Zoroark/Cinccino as a deck wouldn't be that bad. I love both of those cards to death (along with Mandibuzz, they just can't do a single thing to Donphan which IMO will be BDIF next format).
 
Card Slinger J said:
Best Gengar counter isn't Zoroark but Mandibuzz, it's second attack Punishment for {D}{C}{C} can do 200 damage (210 with Special Dark attached) to Gengar and that's including Weakness applied as well.

Also since Mandibuzz isn't weak to {F} like Zoroark that helps give it an edge especially against Donphan Prime and Machamp. I think the new Sawk will hurt Zoroark and Umbreon UD's playability quite a bit as well, and it might also be a decent tech against Zekrom and Galvantula.
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I greatly disagree with this. Mandibuzz takes two turns to set up his attack and doesn't bypass Gengar's feinting spell and doesn't have psychic resistance.

I like Mandibuzz, but Honchkrow would be a better counter to Gengar then mandibuzz. Plus Big Daddy Krow works well against many other decks, like Gyarados. Mandibuzz is really only good against stage two decks. He may be good to use against Donphan, but will take forever to knock him out with exoskeleton.

Zoroark seems to be built to beat Gengar. Psychic resistance, and the ability to bypass Feinting Spell is just way better the mandibuzz.
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Heading into HGSS-on, I've got a few things to say about this.

Mandibuzz: Heck yeah. He's going to be a pretty big force to be reckoned with against Gengar Prime, and in general against Stage 2 decks, though he can't eat a Champ Buster (which makes me sad).

Zoroark: Brutal tech in a lot of decks, and really shores up some matchups. I think it will more or less come out everywhere, but it especially shines against hard hitters like Magnezone and Zekrom, whose drawbacks any deck can deal with once or twice.

Cinccino: I honestly don't think so. 100 damage a swing for a DCE is quite nice, but 90HP and a fighting weakness make it questionable. Blastgatr and Donphan are both going to be huge decks in the new format, and one sets up and starts erasing your bench, the other can straight end you for one energy. Tyranitar's spread isn't going to help a Cinccino deck either, as possible multi-prize antics from Darkness Howl could ensue depending on how much HP you've got back there, plus after the first 20 you have Mandibuzz snipes to worry about. All in all I think it could be a solid tech in decks like Serperior/Reuniclus that will be loading up the bench quickly, but as a deck of its own? I still don't think it's viable.
 
@ironman - i absolutely agree. It will be a rock paper scizor (pun intended) environment.

However, thats why I think these cards are game changers. They can easily be added to any deck. Not that they will be decks on their own, especially when they can't outspeed anythingwith no BTS.
 
In my opinion, Cinccino will be pretty win as long as it plays with something to counter Donphan.
 
konter_j8902 said:
Donpahn will be nothing compared to yanmega. 70 for no energy is great. It almost compares to gyarados
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Donphan Prime has 20-res to everything, not to mention it's more consistent than Yanmega. What if you don't have Copycat or Judge? What if your opponent has more cards in his/her hand than you? We won't have enough draw power OR discard power to make sure that our hand's the same size as our opponent. At least Donphan maintains a 60~90 consistently.

EDIT:
On 2nd thought, with Yanmega, just run 4 Copycats and 4 Judge? xD

---

Cincinno's okay. The HP hurts though, when you compare it with 110 HP Yanmega Prime & 120 HP Donphan Prime... Still, Cincinno will see play.
 
konter_j8902 said:
Donpahn will be nothing compared to yanmega. 70 for no energy is great. It almost compares to gyarados
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True but Zekrom will be huge next format and their is no way yanmega can takes hits from that bid guy. i think they will be good card next format. With all they need to attack is double colorless it wll get played alot in many decks
 
Donphan I still believe is better then Yanmega. Without BTS and a gimped rare candy Mega will not be faster then Donphan. Even though Yanmega can do 70 off the bat and Donphan 60, at least Donphan can get to 90.

The other big piece is Donphan will almost never get OHKO while I can see many things one shotting Mega. Even Cinccino with one plus power can knock out a Yanmega.

The moral of the story is Yanmega and Donphan will both be good, but even better with a Cinccino or Zoroark Tech in it. :)
 
I can't wait to get ahold of a Zoroark for my deck! We went to the pre-release and didn't get any of them, so I am thinking of getting the Victini Box, if I can find one.

I don't know who I will switch out right now, but it looks like Spiritomb might go, so that might be the one. Plus I am losing a bunch of Trainer cards with the rotation. But I really like the Zoroark.
 
They will be good tech there is no doubting that

NJPokeDad said:
Donphan I still believe is better then Yanmega. Without BTS and a gimped rare candy Mega will not be faster then Donphan. Even though Yanmega can do 70 off the bat and Donphan 60, at least Donphan can get to 90.

The other big piece is Donphan will almost never get OHKO while I can see many things one shotting Mega. Even Cinccino with one plus power can knock out a Yanmega.

The moral of the story is Yanmega and Donphan will both be good, but even better with a Cinccino or Zoroark Tech in it. :)
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You do realize yanmega is a stage one right its just as fast donphan also its really easy to get the same number of card as your opponent judge and copycat
 
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