Cobalion vs Beartic

[Xdog]

NOTE: This is all theorymon. You have been warned

Cobalion – Metal – HP120
Basic Pokemon

[M][C] Energy Breath: 20+ damage. This attack does 20 more damage for each Energy card attached to the Defending Pokemon.
[M][M][C] Iron Break: 80 damage. The Defending Pokemon cannot attack during your opponent’s next turn.

Weakness: Fire (x2)
Resistance: Psychic (-20)
Retreat: 2

One of the new cards revealed from Red Collection, Cobalion, has an attack very similar to the Beartic we get in our next set and is receiving lots of hype. They both prevent the Defending Pokemon from attacking during your opponent's next turn, which is a very nice disruption technique. I'm wondering which one is better, as they both have their own pros and cons.

Cobalion is a Basic and Beartic is a Stage 1, meaning Beartic has more chances to get sniped or Pokemon Catcher'd before it's evolved.

Beartic can use Feraligatr Prime and DCE for energy acceleration while Cobalion can use Skarmory UD. Beartic also requires more colorless making it much more splashable.

Beartic's attack does 50 damage while Cobalion's does 80 damage.

Cobalion can use Special Metal and Eviolite to tank, while Beartic cannot.

Beartic hits every popular fire Pokemon for weakness and there are few viable steel types to take advantage of it's weakness to steel. Cobalion is weak to the popular fire type and only really hits Beartic and the also hyped Kyurem for weakness. It has a resistance to psychic, but there are few Psychic types who attack for direct damage. It's helpful against some Mew Prime varients.

Cobalion has 2 retreat and Beartic has 3.

My question is which one will see more play and in what decks? I think they are both viable, but I'm not entirely sure if one is better than the other.

OTHER CARDS MENTIONED

Eviolite - Trainer

Pokemon Tool: Attach a Pokemon Tool to one of your Pokemon. You can only attach one Pokemon Tool per Pokemon and it stays attached to that Pokemon.

If this card is attached to a Basic Pokemon, all damage done to this Pokemon is reduced by 20 damage.

You can use any number of Trainer cards during your turn.

Kyurem - Water - HP130
Basic Pokemon

[C][C] Outrage: 20+ damage. This attack does 10 more damage times the number of damage counter on this Pokemon.
[W][W][C]: Glaciate: This attack does 30 damage to each of your opponent's Pokemon. (Don't apply Weakness and Resistance for Benched Pokemon.)

Weakness: Metal (x2)
Resistance: none
Retreat: 2

(Something else I noticed is their pictures are extremely similar. Funny coincidence )

 

[Spoink!]

I want to run a deck with one of these one they come out. I personally would choose Cobalion if I was building a whole deck around it because it's a Basic, has higher damage output and can use Eviolite.
I would use Beartic if I was trying to add a little 10-or-so card tangent to another unrelated deck. Beartic is coming to the US sooner, too, so I might use it before Cobalion comes out here.

 

[Glace]

Because of Evolite and Sp {M}, I think that Cobalion will see more play.

There is an english picture of Beartic on the front page by the way.

 

[Xdog]

Because of Evolite and Sp {M}, I think that Cobalion will see more play.

There is an english picture of Beartic on the front page by the way.

*facepalm* Fixed

I agree that Cobalion works better on it's own, maybe they could both be run in the same deck. I'm not sure how effective it would be, but having a fire weakness makes it very easy to OHKO in a ReshiBoar deck (Outrage with at least 4 damage counters, Badboar's Heat Crash with a PlusPower). Beartic would be an interesting revenge-revenge killer, if that makes sense.

 

[Zorua]

Cobalion's weakness is the only major turn-away I can see. Cobalion is so much better with the fact that it can abuse Evolite and Sp.Metal energies, making it absolutely amazing, but the weakness hinders it a bit against major decks.

Also, Cobalion has a better retreat, and is also a basic making it easier to set up, especially with Skarmory UD/COL.

 

[Glace]

Reshiboar won't be that popular with ZPS in the format.

 

[Zhaituki]

Reshiboar won't be that popular with ZPS in the format.

Oh it is alrdy, not to mention even more dangerous TyphloRam.

 

[AmishEskimoNinja]

I have to go with beartic on this one. Instead of having a crippling weakness (fire), it can take advantage of water weaknesses. Keep in mind there aren't many good metal pokemon. Along with that the extra damage cobolion has isn't that big of a deal because the point is not to get a knockout, but to keep you from getting damaged. Finally using double colorless is an awfully good advantage.

 

[Zhaituki]

I have to go with beartic on this one. Instead of having a crippling weakness (fire), it can take advantage of water weaknesses. Keep in mind there aren't many good metal pokemon. Along with that the extra damage cobolion has isn't that big of a deal because the point is not to get a knockout, but to keep you from getting damaged. Finally using double colorless is an awfully good advantage.

Indeed, scizor and steelix not all that much played due to Reshiboars and Typhlorams. Also beartic can alrdy attack after dce and water energy.

 

[Jahikoi]

Typing, Weakness, attack cost.

Beartic has better typing.
Beartic has a MUCH better weakness.
Beartic has a better attack cost.
Beartic has Feraligatr for attachment.
Beartic has 130hp.
Beartic's second attack ignores resistance.


Downsides:
Beartic is a stage 1.
Beartic can't abuse Eviolite
Beartic has 3 retreat over 2 retreat
Beartic's first attack does less damage.




I think Beartic is better. The reason it's getting so much hype is that it gets weakness on Donphan and Reshiram, and providing a tough fight for zekrom... and Zekrom doesn't like retreating. Cobalion, on the other hand, only hits Kyurem and Beartic for weakness, and gets absolutely mauled by zekrom and reshiram, hits into resistance against magnezone (electric resists steel)... Eviolite and Special Metals will not protect you from a 240 damage blue flare. It was the same thing with steelix.

 

[Tyranodon]

Whats the point of evolite? Sorry if I am completely wrong but isnt it just a defender that only works for basics?

 

[Futa]

While that is true, Evolite is a permanent Defender for the Basic Pokemon it is attached to (since it's a Tool).

 

[don()shinobi]

Although both have their benefits and bad sides, I wouldn't truly say that one is better than the other.

Although Cobalion has a higher damage output for the same amount of energy, Beartic can be charged up faster, since it can be used with DCE. But Beartic is a stage 1, which is bad against players using Archeops. Cobalion is a basic and is Metal, so it can spam Eviolite and Special Metal energies to take hits like a boss and heal it off with Serperior and Potion(lololololol). Beartic, however, cannot use either of those two things that Cobalion can spam, and generally has a better type.

 

[Tyranodon]

Oooops thanks. I misread the text stupid me it stays attached not discarded at the end of the turn. That is pretty nice! Hate to change the topic of the thread but do you guys think eviolite will see much play in ReshiBoar or possibly ZPS?

 

[Serperior]

I'm leaning towards Cobalion, but ReshiBoar will rip it to shreds. You have the issue of having to take three turns to set up another Cobalion, as well as get an Evolite back on Cobalion to get back in the game. On the other hand, against any other deck not named ReshiBoar, you have a decent 120 HP, can take advantage of Special Metal Energy, and can then dish out average damage while locking your opponent. You could run Vileplume UD as well in order to keep them from playing Switch and Pokemon Reversal.

Then again, Beartic owns ReshiBoar and can abuse DCE. 50 damage for three Energy is pretty bad, but if need be you can slap another Energy on Beartic and just use Icicle Crash for the KO. It's got 10 more HP, but no Resistance.

I think they're pretty close to even.

 

[don()shinobi]

Well, now that I think about it, Cobalion needs to abuse both Special Metals and Eviolite to live. You can only run 4 Special Metals. So what do you do when all of them are discarded? At that point, I'd say it's pretty much an autoloss from there unless you can pull off an intense wombo combo.

 

[Zhaituki]

Beartic can be charged up faster, since it can be used with DCE. But Beartic is a stage 1

So what if it's stage 1? They can't use fossil with vileplume around, so bye archeops. even stage 2's can be setup at T2 alrdy. evolutions are not problematic with correctly built deck.

 

[scizorlicious]

Beartic can be charged up faster, since it can be used with DCE. But Beartic is a stage 1

So what if it's stage 1? They can't use fossil with vileplume around, so bye archeops. even stage 2's can be setup at T2 alrdy. evolutions are not problematic with correctly built deck.

Vileplume's not that popular, and won't be for a bit. You can usually get fossil out more quickly than Vileplume. But you're missing the overlying problem with it being a Stage 1, which is that it takes up twice the deck space, is slower, and the basic can be brought up with Catcher and KO'd, or sniped for a KO.

 

[Zhaituki]

Beartic can be charged up faster, since it can be used with DCE. But Beartic is a stage 1

So what if it's stage 1? They can't use fossil with vileplume around, so bye archeops. even stage 2's can be setup at T2 alrdy. evolutions are not problematic with correctly built deck.

Vileplume's not that popular, and won't be for a bit. You can usually get fossil out more quickly than Vileplume. But you're missing the overlying problem with it being a Stage 1, which is that it takes up twice the deck space, is slower, and the basic can be brought up with Catcher and KO'd, or sniped for a KO.

Vileplume can be gotten out at T2 alrdy if you play good amount candies (like should as the only trainers). Foolish mistake to think that stage 2's are slower to get into play than stage 1's. Also Archeops needs that stupid mechanism fossil. Even Research record don't necessarily make you get archen from bottom of deck.

 

[Starboard Driger]

I personally believe (Miss Northern Carolina start, this means I don't know what I'm saying) they both have their strengths and downsides, but taking these into account, Beartic seems better, or will at least see more use.

Although it can't use Eviolite, it's weakness is nonexistent (compared to Cobalion's), and can give Reshiram decks (the kindalmostBDIF) some serious trouble. Stage 1 is a handicap, but if you have a Rare Candy you can cancel that out, and combined with DCE, you can get Sheer Cold ready in two turns. It's second attack, ready in three turns with DCE, while heavy on energy, is great for hitting normally hard-to-kill grass cards such as Verizion and Serperior for a solid 80. However, the three energy cost is pretty bad, so it'll be staying in until it dies (which, with the right support, could be a while).

Compared to that, Cobalion has bad typing, a pretty good first attack (normally doing 60 damage), an excellent second attack that can't use DCE, and the godlike advantage of being a basic. Eviolite is one of those advantages, which makes it live that much longer, so it's not like it'll be Catcher'd and insta-killed with it on. Reshiram OHKO's it with no Plus Powers (even with Eviolite on), so that is a massive problem. That weakness is a very bad handicap.

All in all, both of their pros outweigh their cons, Cobalion just has one colossal con that really messes it up, therefore making Beartic the better card.

But if we're all misunderstanding, and he meant one on one, than Cobalion
is the clear winner.

EDIT: pressed post too soon, updated!