Help Counter to Celebi & Venusaur-GX

[Catastrophia]

Does anyone have a good strategy to counter the Celebi & Venusaur-GX deck? I'm struggling against it with my Pikarom build.

Edit: Here is my current decklist - we're talking Standard.

The build that usually stumps me is the attacking variant, like Gonzalez's list at the Denver Regionals.

 

[snoopy369]

Which C&V deck are you running into? The attacking one, the stall one (usually with Vileplume)? Can you link to a deck list (either include it or link to limitless/etc.) that shows what you're having trouble with, and also include your deck list (as there are a lot of PikaZek variants too!)

Oh - and, Standard or Expanded?

 

[Catastrophia]

Which C&V deck are you running into? The attacking one, the stall one (usually with Vileplume)? Can you link to a deck list (either include it or link to limitless/etc.) that shows what you're having trouble with, and also include your deck list (as there are a lot of PikaZek variants too!)

Oh - and, Standard or Expanded?

Thanks! I wrote this post quickly so didn't think to include all this information...

Here is my current decklist - we're talking Standard.

The build that usually stumps me is the attacking variant, like Gonzalez's list at the Denver Regionals.

I find it hard to get that 1HKO and if I don't I usually get wrecked by the GX attack. I tried the Xurkitree to counter the DCE but that only works until they find Guzma.

Any deck change ideas welcome, as well as just general strategy tips.

 

[snoopy369]

Hmm, I'm curious about this matchup. I've only faced it maybe 2 or 3 times against a good player, but I've won it each time ... mostly by getting set up faster. But I played turbo, this was back in the early TEU days, and none of the jirachi/zapdos stuff that is played now.

I feel like that's critical - you have to get an extra attach somehow, to be hitting by turn 2, and thus outspeed them if you go first. And even if you go second, you can attach to a second PikaZek with your first attack, and thus be ready to finish things even if you do lose the first PikaZek. Or maybe use a switching effect or Zeraora to get the damaged PikaZek out, then Max Potion it or Acerola it?

 

[AuraJackle]

Tapu koko gx can easily take out one venasaur usually and other than that you are outspeeding them and can retreat out of confusion you should be winning most of the time

 

[snoopy369]

Tapu koko gx can easily take out one venasaur usually and other than that you are outspeeding them and can retreat out of confusion you should be winning most of the time

Not quite - it only does 200 damage, if they have only the 4 energies on it and nothing on the bench. (Of course, *probably* they will need another energy on the bench at which point an electropower or choice band seals the deal...)

But otherwise agree - this is a game of speed.

 

[JumpluffTCG]

Definitely go the big GX route over the Zapdos route on this one, unless your opponent misplays and benches a ton of Shaymins. I think my game plan would be to charge PikaRom #1 and Full Blitz to a PikaRom #2, and have a Zeraora GX out so that I could alternate between the two if my opponent ever uses Pollen Hazards. I think a consistent 150 damage should apply enough pressure so that Celesaur might misses a beat in their healing. When that happens, I could then burn some Electropowers to finish it off, then close out the game by knocking out a second CeleSaur with Tag Bolt + damage modifiers.

 

[Catastrophia]

Thanks for the advice, everyone! I think my mistake has been splitting my focus between Zapdos (to target the Shaymin) and PikaRom (for the CeleSaur) and not committing fulling to either strategy. I'll take these suggestions into account next time I meet this matchup.

 

[uncleyuri]

Good news is now that Reshiram/Charizard is probably the most popular deck right now, Celesaur should see a massive decline.

 

[rewster1]

I realize this isn't really a competitive idea, but solrock and lunatone out at the same time blocks all healing. Even if they guzma one of the two up you still block healing for one full turn, which is plenty for a two shot with pikarom. I play a rogue deck (eggs) but I've taken down several celesaurs which are normally an auto loss for eggs with it. Then again uncleyuri is probably right about reshizard, and koko gx can often get an ohko or close enough. But just on the off chance you are still struggling, it is technically a counter.

 

[Lord Goomy]

Thanks for the advice, everyone! I think my mistake has been splitting my focus between Zapdos (to target the Shaymin) and PikaRom (for the CeleSaur) and not committing fulling to either strategy. I'll take these suggestions into account next time I meet this matchup.

Good news is now that Reshiram/Charizard is probably the most popular deck right now, Celesaur should see a massive decline.

More good news, even if it doesn’t decline, they lose Max Potion.

 

[CrownAxe]

More good news, even if it doesn’t decline, they lose Max Potion.

CeleSaur doesn’t run max potion

 

[NaganadelIsBeast]

More good news, even if it doesn’t decline, they lose Max Potion.

As @CrownAxe said, CeleSaur never runs Max Potion. Like Ever. The only thing CeleSaur is losing (or now has lost) is it’s weakness being irrelevant.

 

[Lord Goomy]

As @CrownAxe said, CeleSaur never runs Max Potion. Like Ever. The only thing CeleSaur is losing (or now has lost) is it’s weakness being irrelevant.

CeleSaur doesn’t run max potion

I played against one who did (it was stall).

 

[NaganadelIsBeast]

I played against one who did (it was stall).

See post #3, 3rd paragraph.

 

[Catastrophia]

Good news is now that Reshiram/Charizard is probably the most popular deck right now, Celesaur should see a massive decline.

Good news from one perspective, although every tournament will now be dominated by the busted ReshiZard (unless you drop £150 getting a few copies).

On that note, I've been thinking of dropping in an Alolan Ninetails (BUS #28) as a temporary counter to the Reshiram & Charizard-GX, along with a rainbow just to prevent getting into a no-win situation against the behemoth deck when it becomes legal in 2 weeks time...

At least until the Keldeo-GX comes out in Unified Minds.

Thoughts?

 

[Braiden1235]

Good news from one perspective, although every tournament will now be dominated by the busted ReshiZard (unless you drop £150 getting a few copies).

On that note, I've been thinking of dropping in an Alolan Ninetails (BUS #28) as a temporary counter to the Reshiram & Charizard-GX, along with a rainbow just to prevent getting into a no-win situation against the behemoth deck when it becomes legal in 2 weeks time...

At least until the Keldeo-GX comes out in Unified Minds.

Thoughts?

PikaRom can keep up in speed with Reshizard you just need a very speedy build with dedenee marshadow always going for that t1 full blitz and limiting your opponent to 4 + draw.

 

[JMT]

CeleSaur stall might run a couple max potions, but the Gonzalez list is built to function without it, making it so you can heal without losing all your energies.

 

[NoaWithoutaH]

I would say Reshizard is a good counter, if you can't buy those 40$ cards like me, play baby blacephalon.