Discussion Counters to Glaceon GX (ULP)
- Thread starter FrostBiter12
- Start date
Agreed, I think that Mawile (CRI) can deal some damage and search for basics with "Call for Family". Just starting with it is the hard part.
Super soft counter that is unlikely to work. They can just snipe around it. Also, the ability doesn't work...
My deck as a decent solution to the problem in expanded.
Combine the power of Ninja Boy and incorporate 2 great counters in Wobbuffet and Magearna-Ex.
Combine the power of Ninja Boy and incorporate 2 great counters in Wobbuffet and Magearna-Ex.
Sure it does glaceon only blocks gx and ex abilities
Except for hitting for weakness, which you could just instead play a Metal deck and/or again CIN Mawile for, what does Magearna do that really makes it a counter to glaceon?
On the contrary, Hoopa (SHL) does slow down my opponent quite a bit. As @AuraJackle mentioned, Hoopa's ability isn't shut off since it isn't a GX/EX, so I would stand by Hoopa has an efficient counter. Even if your opponent can snipe around it, I would prefer that they only deal 30 damage to the bench per turn as it would give me enough time to set up almost any deck.
For future reference, I will post a link in the original post and here to the page where Glaceon GX is translated. Hope this helps!
Outside of the Metal deck, Magearna-Ex is the best pokémon to use. It OHKO Glaceon-Ex with 2 energy attachment requirement. Every other Metal pokémon would need 3 energy attachment. CIN Mawile hits for 60 dmg. Unlikely to deal with Glaceon-Gx at all.
My deck plays Rainbow and Prism energy and this makes it easy to include a Magearna and OHKO Glaceon-Gx.
Could you post your projected Prism list for your deck @FrostBiter12 ? It is hard to advise without seeing it.
Just as a general rule of thumb, I expect it is a bad idea to heavily tech for this one specific match-up, especially before we've even seen how it takes shape itself. As a previous commenter said, for all we know the amount of Metal support landing could make Solgaleo BDIF and Glaceon decks may be few and far between. And a quad Glaceon deck would have to be teched for differently compared to a Glaceon+ friends deck.
Regardless of the rest of their deck, T1 for the Glaceon player is to put an Eevee up front and try attach a water energy. But to leave their bench completely empty is a dangerous gambit. And they can't set up a sole second Glaceon until the second turn. And they can't even do that (not via Energy Evolution at least) if they also want to attack. So I do think the key here is a good count of switching cards rather than diluting your own strategy. Reshape your deck but not cripple it - you might have to consider Nest Balls over Brigette play, that kind of thing.
I think it would be far better to strengthen your own list in a way that is applicable in many match-ups. Is your Guzma count maxed out and do you run float stones? Well then perhaps a baby Zoroark & Break line (their own snipe can leave them vulnerable to their own GX attack lol). Do you rely on Skyla for Decidueye candies, if so maybe she can equally fish for an escape rope as the card that will make the difference.
Just as a general rule of thumb, I expect it is a bad idea to heavily tech for this one specific match-up, especially before we've even seen how it takes shape itself. As a previous commenter said, for all we know the amount of Metal support landing could make Solgaleo BDIF and Glaceon decks may be few and far between. And a quad Glaceon deck would have to be teched for differently compared to a Glaceon+ friends deck.
Regardless of the rest of their deck, T1 for the Glaceon player is to put an Eevee up front and try attach a water energy. But to leave their bench completely empty is a dangerous gambit. And they can't set up a sole second Glaceon until the second turn. And they can't even do that (not via Energy Evolution at least) if they also want to attack. So I do think the key here is a good count of switching cards rather than diluting your own strategy. Reshape your deck but not cripple it - you might have to consider Nest Balls over Brigette play, that kind of thing.
I think it would be far better to strengthen your own list in a way that is applicable in many match-ups. Is your Guzma count maxed out and do you run float stones? Well then perhaps a baby Zoroark & Break line (their own snipe can leave them vulnerable to their own GX attack lol). Do you rely on Skyla for Decidueye candies, if so maybe she can equally fish for an escape rope as the card that will make the difference.
Well, I understand your point @Laurier_Ex, but I would just like to point out one thing. Here is the text for Magearna EX's ability... Ability — Mystic Heart
Prevent all effects of your opponent's attacks, except damage, done to each of your Pokemon that has any Metal Energy attached to it. (Existing effects are not removed.)... Magearna EX's ability only blocks the effects of attacks, so technically, it doesn't block Glaceon GX since the ability lock is through Glaceon GX's ability. The only case in which Magearna EX blocks ability lock is against Greninja's Shadow Stitching attack if Magearna EX has a [M] attach to it before the attack is used (if it doesn't, Shadow Stitching shuts off Magerna EX's ability itself). Also, I would like to mention that this article is mainly meant for Standard as Glaceon GX isn't necessary in Expanded where Hex Maniac is used, so cards like Prism Energy aren't available. The main reason I like Mawile (CRI) is due to both attacks (I can use call for Family if I can't use Tapu Lele GX to grab Brigette) being able to help against Glaceon GX (Crunch can deal up to 120 damage with a Choice Band while having the potential to halt my opponent from attacking if I flip heads to discard an energy). Anyways, thanks for the idea, let us know if you have anymore!
Sure, if your talking about the current Zoroark GX/Decidueye GX list that I have (not updated with ULP cards), I'll list it in a spoiler below. If you want a specific deck related to ULP (which for me will be Leafeon GX/Decidueye GX, which has the same problem with Glaceon GX), I'll make a spoiler for that as well.
Pokémon*22
Zorua*3 SHL
Zoroark GX*3 SHL
Zoroark *1 BKT
Rowlet*4 SUM
Dartrix*2 SUM
Decidueye GX*4 SUM
Tapu Lele GX*2 GRI
Tapu Koko*1 PR
Latios*1 SHL
Espeon EX*1 BKP
Trainer*32
Professor Sycamore*4 BKP
N*3 FCO
Guzma*2 BUS
Brigette*2 BKT
Mallow*1 GRI
Ultra Ball*4 SUM
Puzzle of Time*4 BKP
Rare Candy*3 SUM
Field Blower*2 GRI
Max Potion*2 GRI
Rescue Stretcher*1 GRI
Choice Band*3 GRI
Float Stone*1 BKT
Energy*6
Grass Energy*2 SUM
Double Colorless Energy*4 SUM
(Cynthias will replace Sycamores when released)
Zorua*3 SHL
Zoroark GX*3 SHL
Zoroark *1 BKT
Rowlet*4 SUM
Dartrix*2 SUM
Decidueye GX*4 SUM
Tapu Lele GX*2 GRI
Tapu Koko*1 PR
Latios*1 SHL
Espeon EX*1 BKP
Trainer*32
Professor Sycamore*4 BKP
N*3 FCO
Guzma*2 BUS
Brigette*2 BKT
Mallow*1 GRI
Ultra Ball*4 SUM
Puzzle of Time*4 BKP
Rare Candy*3 SUM
Field Blower*2 GRI
Max Potion*2 GRI
Rescue Stretcher*1 GRI
Choice Band*3 GRI
Float Stone*1 BKT
Energy*6
Grass Energy*2 SUM
Double Colorless Energy*4 SUM
(Cynthias will replace Sycamores when released)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pokémon*21
Eevee*3 SUM
Leafeon GX*3 USUM
Rowlet*4 SUM
Dartrix*4 SUM
Decidueye GX*4 SUM
Tapu Lele GX*2 GRI
Espeon EX*1 BKP
Trainer*27
Hala*4 GRI
N*4 FCO
Guzma*2 BUS
Brigette*2 BKT
Ultra Ball*4 SUM
Field Blower*2 GRI
Rescue Stretcher*1 GRI
Choice Band*3 GRI
Float Stone*3 BKT
Energy*12
Grass Energy*8 SUM
Double Colorless Energy*4 SUM
(Potential thinking of including a 1-1 Cherrim {ULP} to remove weakness if Fire gets popular)
Eevee*3 SUM
Leafeon GX*3 USUM
Rowlet*4 SUM
Dartrix*4 SUM
Decidueye GX*4 SUM
Tapu Lele GX*2 GRI
Espeon EX*1 BKP
Trainer*27
Hala*4 GRI
N*4 FCO
Guzma*2 BUS
Brigette*2 BKT
Ultra Ball*4 SUM
Field Blower*2 GRI
Rescue Stretcher*1 GRI
Choice Band*3 GRI
Float Stone*3 BKT
Energy*12
Grass Energy*8 SUM
Double Colorless Energy*4 SUM
(Potential thinking of including a 1-1 Cherrim {ULP} to remove weakness if Fire gets popular)
I definitely agree about overteching, don't worry though, the cards mentioned above are meant to be just one-ofs if you do include them (one tech per deck usually, not all of them). Even if Metal is popular, I think that the disruption that Glaceon GX causes on Tapu Lele GX (in a format where most decks rely on turn 1 Brigette ) can halt Metal decks long enough for Frozen Bullet to start dealing damage. Then again, it may not (hopefully) so we'll just have to wait and see what happens.
Personally, I don't think that getting turn 1 Glaceon GX along with a Brigette is too hard if you build you list correctly (I mean, Leafeon GX/Decidueye GX has to do the same thing), so switching Glaceon GX out of the active spot manually may not be as good of an option (especially if your opponent isn't able to get another benched Pokémon down as you mentioned since you have nothing to switch your opponent out of). I think the best option is to force your opponent to move Glaceon GX out of the active slot (with cards like Hoopa) as that means your opponent doesn't have anything they can do. I like the Nest Ball idea, but in that case I'd rather play another Brigette in that slot since if I'm relying on drawing into Nest Ball, it might as well be a Brigette instead. Definitely agree with just altering the deck though, everyone had to do the same thing with Garbodor (GRI), guess we'll have to do the same thing now. Hopefully we'll be able to find something (doesn't have to be a tech I guess, but just overall gameplay like using non-GX abilities such as Octillery for draw support).
My deck is a little different than most other Zoroark GX/Decidueye GX in that it runs Puzzle of Time instead of Evosoda (which has been working very well recently). Zoroark (BKT) is mainly a tech spot, most of the time I'd rather evolve into a Zoroark GX, so adding in more Zoroark (BKT and the Breaks) will probably not be ideal (since it would probably mess with consistency which would strengthen Glaceon GX even more). I honestly don't have the room to max out on Guzmas, though I can always use Hollow Hunt GX or Puzzles of Time to retrieve them if needed (same with Float Stone). Instead of Skyla, I'd play Mallow to take advantage of Trade (drawing any two cards I want) so I use it for almost any situation. The best tech that I could throw in here (in my opinion) would be Hoopa (SHL) as I can also add Rainbow Energy instead of Grass Energy to attack while forcing my opponent to not have Glaceon GX in the active spot (since they can't attack Hoopa). Edits to the list in the near future would most likely be...
-1 Tapu Koko or Latios: I can't decide which one to remove, Tapu Koko hits everybody on the field to help with Espeon EX while Latios is my counter to Buzzwole GX (which has the advantage over this deck).
-2 Grass Energy: Just for the Rainbow Energy.
+1 Hoopa: As mentioned above.
+2 Rainbow Energy: Just in case I need to attack with Hoopa.
Anyways, thanks for the suggestions, @Yog, let me know what you think. Thanks!