Discussion Decidueye Variants

MajoraMayhem

MajoraMayhem

Aspiring Trainer
Member
Any particular Owl varieties stand out to you guys? Obviously the big one is Decidueye/Vileplume, but I'm just not feeling the deck's performance while in testing. I remember seeing an Alakazam/Owl list that looked entertaining, and part of me wants to try pairing the old bird with Lurantis GX. Any other unique ideas? So long as we have Forest of Giant Plants the sky is the limit here.
 
Let me put it to you this way, pair him with cards that can abuse free damage. What I mean by that, is use him to get damage on board for certain numbers, I.e. Lapras with one Owl hits for 180, ohkoing ex's. Two owls ohko's stage 1 GX's. It's all about hitting magic numbers. Which is anywhere from 90-120 against EX's, or 100-130 for GX's (minimum 130 for stage 2's). The are the smaller targets like Yveltal and Volcanian where 130 and 170 are the magic numbers. So to find a good Owl partner, you have to look at the meta, and what numbers you can hit.

(Tier2) Lapras: Blizzard Burn
160 Base (Mini-EX's and Non-EX Attackers)
180 +1 Owl (all non-mega EX's ex Wailord and all Basic GX's ex Lapras and Snorlax)
200 +2 Owls (some stage 1 GX's)
220 +3 Owls (All Mega-EX's and all Non-Stage2 GX's)

(Tier 3) M-Alakazam: Just one Mega Evolution
90 Base
170 +1 Owl
250 +2 Owl
330 +3 Owl

(Tier 1) Tauros/Vileplume: Using horn attack (Rage depends on situation)
60 Base
80 +1 Owl
100 +2 Owls
120 +3 Owls

(Tier 1) Lurantis:
120 Base
140 +1 Owl
160 +2 Owl
180 +3 Owl

(Tier 1) Tapu-Lele/Lugia: Opponent with two energy
80 Base
100 +1 Owl
120 +2 Owl
140 +3 Owl

(Tier 3) Mega Houndoom
80 Base (160 w/discard)
100 +1 Owl (180 w/discard
120 +2 Owls (200 w/discard)
140 +3 Owls (220 w/discard)

Updated list with Mega-Houndoom
Updated list with tier list based off how good the variant is.
 
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TheDude133 said:
Let me put it to you this way, pair him with cards that can abuse free damage. What I mean by that, is use him to get damage on board for certain numbers, I.e. Lapras with one Owl hits for 180, ohkoing ex's. Two owls ohko's stage 1 GX's. It's all about hitting magic numbers. Which is anywhere from 90-120 against EX's, or 100-130 for GX's (minimum 130 for stage 2's). The are the smaller targets like Yveltal and Volcanian where 130 and 170 are the magic numbers. So to find a good Owl partner, you have to look at the meta, and what numbers you can hit.

Lapras: Blizzard Burn
160 Base (Mini-EX's and Non-EX Attackers)
180 +1 Owl (all non-mega EX's ex Wailord and all Basic GX's ex Lapras and Snorlax)
200 +2 Owls (some stage 1 GX's)
220 +3 Owls (All Mega-EX's and all Non-Stage2 GX's)

Alakazam: Just one Mega Evolution
100 Base
160 +1 Owl
220 +2 Owl
280 +3 Owl

Tauros/Vileplume: Using horn attack (Rage depends on situation)
60 Base
80 +1 Owl
100 +2 Owls
120 +3 Owls

Lurantis: Solar Blade
120 Base
140 +1 Owl
160 +2 Owl
180 +3 Owl

Tapu-Lele/Lugia: Opponent with two energy
80 Base
100 +1 Owl
120 +2 Owl
140 +3 Owl
Click to expand...

Fully agree with your statement about attackers.

Curious about your Alakazam numbers though. A Mega Evolution places two damage counters on the active and three on a benched mon. Two is 70 damage, so are you saying that if you Mega Evolved, Owled, and then Lysandre'd the benched target that is how you got your numbers. A more reasonable approach imo is assuming two damage counters which puts you at:
70 Base
130 +1 Owl
190 +2 Owl
250 +3 Owl
 
MajoraMayhem said:
Fully agree with your statement about attackers.

Curious about your Alakazam numbers though. A Mega Evolution places two damage counters on the active and three on a benched mon. Two is 70 damage, so are you saying that if you Mega Evolved, Owled, and then Lysandre'd the benched target that is how you got your numbers. A more reasonable approach imo is assuming two damage counters which puts you at:
70 Base
130 +1 Owl
190 +2 Owl
250 +3 Owl
Click to expand...
Apologies, I got the effect backwards, thank you for the correction.
 
TheDude133 said:
Yes in theory, no in execution.
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Lol. Really? Given the success of DeciPlume, 2 Stage 2 lines. - traditionally "thought to be a bad deck idea" - seems to work well. Why would you think M Tyranita-Decidueye (easier to setup than 2 Stage 2 lines) won't work in "execution?"

TheDude133 said:
T-tar is way too expensive to work.
Click to expand...
How so? No more costly than DeciPlume, IMO.

TheDude133 said:
I'd rather use mega houndoom, and he's expensive.
Click to expand...
M Houndoom with Decidueye GX? Please expound.
 
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TuxedoBlack said:
Lol. Really? Given the success of DeciPlume, 2 Stage 2 lines. - traditionally "thought to be a bad deck idea - seems to work well. Why would you think M Tyranita-Decidueye (easier to setup than 2 Stage 2 lines) won't work in "execution?"


How so? No more costly than DeciPlume, IMO.

M Houndoom with Decidueye GX? Please expound.
Click to expand...

Ok, couple things.

1. Forest of Giant Plants is what makes DeciPlume work, not to mention level ball. And a lot of lists only play 4 DCE as their energy and play Tauros/Lugia as their Attackers.

2. My "Expensive" comment was about the energy costs. None of the other variants have an expensive cost, except Lapras, but that one has Max Elixer and Collect to compensate. T-Tar is two darks and a DCE for it's cost, which is three turns off energy attach MAYBE two with Mega Turbo.

3. Consistency is where the execution falls off. You need the mega line (4/3 with 4 spirit link) and Mega Turbo to get the mega built up. The reason Alakazam and Houndoom don't suffer from this problem AS much, is because of the two energy cost they have. Houndoom even has Blaze Energy to keep some of his energy on board. T-Tar needs too many things to attack turn two, and it's too hard to get multiple ones built quickly without dumping consistency cards in the deck list for more energy. Long story short: (2 Energy>4 Energy)

4. Mega Houndoom
80 Base (160 w/discard)
100 +1 Owl (180 w/discard
120 +2 Owls (200 w/discard)
140 +3 Owls (220 w/discard)
 
A quick comment about the numbers on Alakazam, the original damage doesn't just go away so you can add that to the damage total for one turn.
Base: 90 (20 from Kenesis +70 from Zen Force)
1 Owl: 170 (20+20+130)
2 Owls: 250 (20+20+20+190)
3 Owls: 330, note that even without original Kenesis damage, 60 damage counters originally is enough to one shot the entire metagame with the exception of Solgaleo due to resistance, but a two shot isn't so bad I guess
 
Magmarco said:
A quick comment about the numbers on Alakazam, the original damage doesn't just go away so you can add that to the damage total for one turn.
Base: 90 (20 from Kenesis +70 from Zen Force)
1 Owl: 170 (20+20+130)
2 Owls: 250 (20+20+20+190)
3 Owls: 330, note that even without original Kenesis damage, 60 damage counters originally is enough to one shot the entire metagame with the exception of Solgaleo due to resistance, but a two shot isn't so bad I guess
Click to expand...
Also true, M-Alakazam has a lot of variables. Will update my list.
 
TheDude133 said:
Ok, couple things.

1. Forest of Giant Plants is what makes DeciPlume work, not to mention level ball. And a lot of lists only play 4 DCE as their energy and play Tauros/Lugia as their Attackers.

2. My "Expensive" comment was about the energy costs. None of the other variants have an expensive cost, except Lapras, but that one has Max Elixer and Collect to compensate. T-Tar is two darks and a DCE for it's cost, which is three turns off energy attach MAYBE two with Mega Turbo.

3. Consistency is where the execution falls off. You need the mega line (4/3 with 4 spirit link) and Mega Turbo to get the mega built up. The reason Alakazam and Houndoom don't suffer from this problem AS much, is because of the two energy cost they have. Houndoom even has Blaze Energy to keep some of his energy on board. T-Tar needs too many things to attack turn two, and it's too hard to get multiple ones built quickly without dumping consistency cards in the deck list for more energy. Long story short: (2 Energy>4 Energy)

4. Mega Houndoom
80 Base (160 w/discard)
100 +1 Owl (180 w/discard
120 +2 Owls (200 w/discard)
140 +3 Owls (220 w/discard)
Click to expand...
Thanks for your feedback. Much appreciated.

Of your 4 points, #3 is perhaps the most challenging, but getting the first M Ttar setup (usually by T2 - if not Item-locked) is not difficult. And from that point on, I'm usually taking prizes (1HKOs) from that point on while setting up other M Ttars. You're right too about the 2 energy > 4 energy, but I'd favor 1HKOs vs. 2HKOs whenever possible.

Thanks again for your clarifications.
 
Speaking of decidueye, as a stage two, and while using espeon gx and or alakazam to drop damage counters on decidueye then following with espeon ex miraculous shine to devolve decidueye to Rowlett for crippling knockouts. How playable would that strategy be. I've got a tournament where I plan on seeing decidueye variants. Also with espeon gx entering meta for mewtwo match ups is it worth playing wellness policy and losing a turn to mega evolve mewtwo
 
CarolinaDyrty said:
Speaking of decidueye, as a stage two, and while using espeon gx and or alakazam to drop damage counters on decidueye then following with espeon ex miraculous shine to devolve decidueye to Rowlett for crippling knockouts. How playable would that strategy be. I've got a tournament where I plan on seeing decidueye variants. Also with espeon gx entering meta for mewtwo match ups is it worth playing wellness policy and losing a turn to mega evolve mewtwo
Click to expand...
Dunno what Mewtwo has to do with this, but no it is not. Espeon GX is a pretty hard tech, and its a bad idea to try to tech your deck for your opponent's techs. With Mewtwo especially just try to make your list as consistent as possible. The deck's raw power will handle the rest.
 
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