Toro googleo said:
All very good points about Keldeo which is great and something I can understand. However, there are certain factors that you and Churd need to understand.
1) Garbodor is going to be everywhere. In light of Lucario EX and Seismitoad EX, you will see a lot of decks incorporating Garbodor after this rotation for BCR-FUF. I do agree that Keldeo is a welcome addition but for me, it'll be worth more to use an Item then Dousing Machine for that item instead. Also, a lot of players using Garbodor will either make sure they keep one Float Stone for Garbodor when you've scrapped their first or make sure Keldeo goes down. Which would you prefer?
Yes, Garbodor will be everywhere, and yes it presents a fundamental threat to many of the things this deck archetype is trying to do, however I feel that having your Keldeo-EX's ability shut off is the least of your worries at that point, and is something that you would just naturally play around should it happen. (On a side note: I would like to say that it is delightfully ironic when you can get a turn two item lock going, which prevents your opponent from attaching the pokemon tool they need to activate their Garbodor's ability.)
Toro googleo said:
2) You will lose your Float Stone regardless. Either through knockout or by Startling Megaphone. Simple. You can argue that you save one additional tool by having Keldeo but in this case and given above, I'd be more safer if I put in an additional switching card to do so.
The version of the deck I have been playing lately runs 4 Float Stone and 2 Escape Rope, in addition to Dowsing Machine and Keldeo-EX.
Toro googleo said:
3) Not necessarily. Some of the better players will be able to run alternative strategies to get around your deck. That's the point of the TCG, thinking steps ahead of the opponent. So assuming this, I wouldn't send Keldeo out as that's practically a misplay there. The opponent could easily Lysandre/Catcher your Trevenant out and bam. Alternatively, kill Donphan. That is the reason why I'm thinking more towards an Item rather than Keldeo which will take up a slot that you cannot afford to.
Using Keldo-EX as a tank is VERY risky, I agree. But as a player I would not attempt to do so unless A) I had no other choice or B) It was a sure bet. I also play a single Max Potion in the deck such that if I do attempt to tank with the Keldeo-EX , I can heal it up right away.
Moving on to the real discussion here, what does Lysandre do for my opponent?
1) Breaks the item lock for a single turn.
I usually see this move out of desperation. My opponent wants to play their trainers so bad, they Lysandre my Trevenant away just to play the trainers in their hand. Sometimes its the Tool they needed to activate Garbodor, sometimes its just a flurry of items such as Ultra Balls, Bicycles, Hypnotoxic Lazers, Startling Megaphones, etc. Not too much lost here, resume the lock next turn and keep attacking while patching any holes they tried to put in your strategy.
2) Targets down one of my benched pokemon
It should go without saying that the deck cannot "function" without a Donphan in play. Not having a Donphan in play will prevent you from making progress towards winning the game, certainly, but will not immediately cause you to lose the game. I've been in situations where my opponent did manage to snipe my only Donphan and I was forced to stall the game behind a Suicune/Trevenent for two turns while I got Donphan back online.
Going further, when playing this deck, you just have to know that your opponent is eventually going Lysandre out your Donphan. Its just something that is going to happen. On average, I would assume that my opponent is playing two Lysandres in their deck with an optional third if they are playing Dowsing Machine. In most games I am comfortably able to get two Donphans on the board, so, losing one of them is not a tragedy. Should I lose a Donphan, a Korrina for a Phanphy and an Evo Soda or Ultra Ball will get you another backup Donphan a turn later.
When playing against Genesect's Red Signal, however, the threat of losing all your Donphan is much more real. Should they be able to use Red Signal two or three times in a very short window, they can really do some damage,
especially if they play Beartic FRF. This is essentially a dream scenario for your opponent and is a match you were probably not destined to win. Ideally versus a VirGen player you would hope that the item lock prevents them from finding their precious Plasma Energy fast enough to do any real damage, and bide enough time to build up redundant answers to Genesect.
(On a side note: I've seen some plasma decks be MUCH more concerned that I had Suicune on the field and actively targeted it down instead.)
3) The worst of all, doing 1) and 2) at the same time....
Again, whatever damage they do with their "catcher-like" effect, getting out of the lock or killing a Donphan, its all about how you plan on dealing with the disaster recovery, which I feel that this deck is already prepared to do. If you cant recover, your game is over, if you can, lets do this!
