Gengar EX Variants

[Mr.Muffin]

RE: Gengar EX Competitive?

Gengar EX is going to be the next incarnation of the Hit and Run tactic. First it was Accelgor(The best) then it was Donphan, and now it will be Gengar EX. It is a good investment because you can use it for the next format along with this one.

 

[Camoclone]

RE: Gengar EX Competitive?

The biggest problem with Gengar EX is that it gets completely destroyed by Yveltal decks which are extremely popular right now. Yveltal hitting for weakness really kills the deck. The occasional Gengar deck makes top cut (at cities) but it's very rare.

 

[GadgetJax]

RE: Gengar EX Competitive?

Gengar EX is going to be the next incarnation of the Hit and Run tactic. First it was Accelgor(The best) then it was Donphan, and now it will be Gengar EX. It is a good investment because you can use it for the next format along with this one.

Agreed. Once Donphan rotates, it will defenitely replace it. Being a Basic allows it to make use of Stage 1's for walling (ie Trevenant) and you still have enough room left over to make use of Wobbuffet, Wailord-EX, and more. However, if Flygon doesn't end up doing as good as I think it will, then that means that Mienshao could still fit the bill as a worse Donphan replacement.

 

[Wookiee Scholar]

RE: Gengar EX Competitive?

Yes I see it every once in a while at tournaments
The problem is that I wouldn't recommend playing Toad or Garbodor with it. All of the versions I've seen do well have played M Gengar, Wobbuffet, Dragalge, Robo Subs, trevanent (or sigilyph), and the occasional Aegislash EX

I would have thought Wobbuffet and Trevanent would be too weak to really "wall" well for Gengar EX. I guess the upside would be they are providing some sort of lock (tools or abilities) while only providing one prize card? Thanks for the ideas, I will certainly try some of these variants!

Gengar EX is going to be the next incarnation of the Hit and Run tactic. First it was Accelgor(The best) then it was Donphan, and now it will be Gengar EX. It is a good investment because you can use it for the next format along with this one.

As I am new to the competitive scene, let me make sure I understand. When you say "next format", you are referring to next years (2016) set of tournament legal cards, right? And Gengar will be the next, because the expectation is that Donphan is going to get cut, right?

The biggest problem with Gengar EX is that it gets completely destroyed by Yveltal decks which are extremely popular right now. Yveltal hitting for weakness really kills the deck. The occasional Gengar deck makes top cut (at cities) but it's very rare.

I hate to sound so ignorant, but are Yveltal (and is this "baby" Yveltal or Yveltal EX) decks popular in Cities now? In our local meta, this doesn't seem to be the case, but it could just be us for some reason. Thanks for the "big picture" view of what is going on in the Pokemon Tournament universe. I appreciate it!!!

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Agreed. Once Donphan rotates, it will defenitely replace it. Being a Basic allows it to make use of Stage 1's for walling (ie Trevenant) and you still have enough room left over to make use of Wobbuffet, Wailord-EX, and more. However, if Flygon doesn't end up doing as good as I think it will, then that means that Mienshao could still fit the bill as a worse Donphan replacement.

I am pretty excited at the thought of Wailord-EX as "The Wall"...a 250 HP wall, with an ability for removing special conditions? Yes please!

 

[bbninjas]

I would have thought Wobbuffet and Trevanent would be too weak to really "wall" well for Gengar EX. I guess the upside would be they are providing some sort of lock (tools or abilities) while only providing one prize card? Thanks for the ideas, I will certainly try some of these variants!

As I am new to the competitive scene, let me make sure I understand. When you say "next format", you are referring to next years (2016) set of tournament legal cards, right? And Gengar will be the next, because the expectation is that Donphan is going to get cut, right?

I hate to sound so ignorant, but are Yveltal (and is this "baby" Yveltal or Yveltal EX) decks popular in Cities now? In our local meta, this doesn't seem to be the case, but it could just be us for some reason. Thanks for the "big picture" view of what is going on in the Pokemon Tournament universe. I appreciate it!!!

Both Wobbuffet and Trevanent wall it 3 main ways. They stop your opponent from doing some action, are a bit harder to kill (especially by Mewtwo or Yveltal) and technically protect you attackers from being damaged.

A rotation does mean the next set of Standard (tournament) legal cards. It will be very unlikely if Donphan doesn't get cut, and if it does Gengar may be the next best thing.

A Yveltal deck often consists of Yveltal-EX, Basic Yveltal and Darkrai at the very least. Yveltal decks are some of the most popular and best peforming decks in format (particularly in Cities), along with Donphan, Virizion/Genesect and Seismitoad/Garbodor

 

[TuxedoBlack]

I have built and play-tested a variation of this deck and found that:

• Inclusion of 2 Manectric EXs is a great counter to L-weak, D Poke (e.g., Yveltal EX);
• Sigilyph and Trevenant seem to be the most effective "walls," IMO, for several reasons;
• Robo Substitutes are really not that effective, IMO, and were quickly replaced by other Poke and tech cards; and
• Trevenant is a solid attacker and can be used effectively.

My current Poke list consists of:

• 
  3 Gengar EX
  2 Manectric EX
  3 Phantump
  1 Reshiram (Outrage)
  2 Sigilyph
  2 Trevenant
  1 Zekrom (Outrage)

 

[Gengar master]

I have a similar list TuxedoBlack (as you know) but I also have Wobbuffet (Helps a decent amount against Pyroar)

Thing I love about Gengar EX decks is you can even attack with Trev/Sigilyph/Wobbuffet when needed. I use LaserBank in my deck because, even though Dark Corrider poisons, LaserBank helps when using other attackers (^Mentioned above^).

Key formula: Manectric EX (Assault Laser) + Muscle Band + Laser = OHKO Yveltal EXs / Assault Laser when a Muscle Band/Hard Charm is attached to Yveltal EX.

You can also Overrun to set up the OHKOs if you don't want to play Lasers.

 

[thedemonbarber]

I've been thinking about doing it with wailord ex, max potion, virbank city, and garbodor. How does that sound to you?

 

[totodile_it_down]

I have built and play-tested a variation of this deck and found that:

• Inclusion of 2 Manectric EXs is a great counter to L-weak, D Poke (e.g., Yveltal EX);
• Sigilyph and Trevenant seem to be the most effective "walls," IMO, for several reasons;
• Robo Substitutes are really not that effective, IMO, and were quickly replaced by other Poke and tech cards; and
• Trevenant is a solid attacker and can be used effectively.

My current Poke list consists of:

• 
  3 Gengar EX
  2 Manectric EX
  3 Phantump
  1 Reshiram (Outrage)
  2 Sigilyph
  2 Trevenant
  1 Zekrom (Outrage)

What kind of Energy line do you run in this build? Any consideration for Silent Lab now that PRC has hit? It's a bit counter-intuitive with Sigilyph and Wobbuffet, but being able to poison VirGen seems good.

 

[Bungeegum]

Has anybody come with a effective counter to Yveltal Ex? Weakness policy? Raichu xy? Now i'm testing a Gengar/Trevenant/Raichu(1-1) but i still have problems dealing with the dark guys.

Anyway, I think now with the possibility of turn one lock thanks to Wally, Gengar may see some play, especially in this format so item depending.

What do you think?

 

[Ramonsoft]

How much Wobuffets must be included in the deck? With the Shaymin EX RSK in the format, i think 4, a 3-3 trevenant line. The same with the robots, i think that 2 is reasonable, cause is more effective (from my point of view) do the item lock and attack with trevenant. And my last doubt is about wally, one or two?

 

[Gengar master]

How much Wobuffets must be included in the deck? With the Shaymin EX RSK in the format, i think 4, a 3-3 trevenant line. The same with the robots, i think that 2 is reasonable, cause is more effective (from my point of view) do the item lock and attack with trevenant. And my last doubt is about wally, one or two?

I would personally choose to go with a Gengar deck with Trevenant (4-4) as my main wall using a couple Shaymin EX and a Jirachi EX to get the T1 Item lock. You could also go 4 Wobbuffets with other walls like Robo, Sigilyph, Outragers, etc.

I recommend choosing one way or the other because in the Trevenant build, always having the Item lock is more effective than sometimes having the Item lock. (Always switch into Trevenant)

 

[TuxedoBlack]

What kind of Energy line do you run in this build?

@totodile_it_down Although my response is a bit late (ok, ok a lot late. Apologies. Btw, I just recently discovered that one can now "tag" a member in a post and he/she will receive a notification regarding that post next time he/she signs onto Pokebeach - very cool feature.)

As I have been preparing (completely different regimen) for Nats for the last few weeks, my Gengar-Trevenant deck is still one of my top 3 decks currently. This deck also still incorporates Manectric EX as an alternate attacker when appropriate. Manectric EX is still a very effective attacker and now used most recently as a "hard counter" (i.e., has 1HKO capability) to such Poke like C Rayquaza EX and Shaymin EX. It still remains a hard counter to Yveltal EXs and Bats too. So, the response to your question regarding the energy line consists of: 3 L, 4 Mystery (amazing) and 5 P.

Any consideration for Silent Lab now that PRC has hit? It's a bit counter-intuitive with Sigilyph and Wobbuffet, but being able to poison VirGen seems good.

After testing Dimension Valley a lot (and some others), I prefer this particular Stadium most of all. I've found DV provides lots of versatility for this deck, more so than any other.

 

[Talkingcat]

I have been testing this online a bit, and my favourite version has 3 Gengar, 4 Wobbafet, 2 Sigilyph, 4 robosubs and laserbank. With only basic Pokemon it is super-consistent. Lasers sounds weird, but it allows you to stack damage and make the opponent miss turns while Wobbafet or a sub is active. Getting decent damage on makes Wobbafet a very strong secondary atttacker.

I think after rotation I would put in a couple of Deoxys, dimension valley and divide the remaining free slots between consistency cards and something tricky.

 

[exxtrooper]

How would you make this deck for post totation?

 

[Bungeegum]

How would you make this deck for post totation?

The biggest loss post-rotation is Float Stone. I been playing this deck since the release of PHF and I personally think it will not be more viable, replacing it with switch or escape rope, harm their consistency, the same replacing it with mystery energys because they cannot work with trevenant and loosing one attachment to retreat a pokemon is a bad exchange.

Posible solutions? Playing Trevenant alone, or Gengar with Dragalge and walls, or Gengar Wobbufet and valley, or even Gengar/Vileplume/Beautifly but it will not be the same ): I hope they reprint floatstone soon.

 

[Ms Hugo]

I can't see Gengar/Trevenant going very far post-rotation unless you're willing to waste a Mystery Energy. Gengar/Beautifly may very well be viable, as Beautifly has free retreat and you'll counter a good portion of the metagame with her. Maybe even tech in a 1-1 or 2-2 Dragalge line for the lock.

 

[Talkingcat]

I can't see Gengar/Trevenant going very far post-rotation unless you're willing to waste a Mystery Energy. Gengar/Beautifly may very well be viable, as Beautifly has free retreat and you'll counter a good portion of the metagame with her. Maybe even tech in a 1-1 or 2-2 Dragalge line for the lock.

Gengar-Beautifly is interesting. With Broken Vine-Space, beautifully could come out pretty quickly.

 

[Ms Hugo]

Gengar-Beautifly is interesting. With Broken Vine-Space, beautifully could come out pretty quickly.

The issue is that BVS (nice name) could clash with Dimension Valley, which lets Gengar attack for only 2 Energy. I think this deck has some potential though, especially with Wobbuffet being so good against Shaymin, too.

 

[Talkingcat]

The issue is that BVS (nice name) could clash with Dimension Valley, which lets Gengar attack for only 2 Energy. I think this deck has some potential though, especially with Wobbuffet being so good against Shaymin, too.

Credit for "Broken Vine-Space" goes to Eric Nance on http://google.com/. Wish I had thought of it

I find Dimension Valley doesn't help Gengar quite as much as I thought it would. It's still two attachments, and you frequently get that anyway with a DCE. Dimension Valley really shines when it enables you to attack off a single attachment, like with Wobbafet or Mew in Night March (when you have Joltik down).