Global Warming with Colder Temperatures

[xgengarx]

So fireblast, please explain to us what's it's like not to be able to be involved in a coherant mature conversation. Acting dumb isn't going to make you seem cooler on the forums. Quite the opposite, in fact- don't even post about these sorts of events unless you're going to make posts better than the previous two, it's a waste of people's time thinking that someone might have written something valuable.

PS: Write*

 

[Pokequaza]

Global warming is such a bunch of bull$@!# is this really all you guys have to hold on to? Its just another way to take our money, save the earth, go green, yeah i go green, for $$$$, u silly people.

And what would be the problem with going green anyway? It isn't that bad to think about the environment now and then.

Please give us an explanation why Global Warming is [insert word]. I bet you can't. As long as you aren't able to give us at least some reasons or arguements you shouldn't post in here.

i didnt even read what you said but you have to find somthin better to do than wright a speach on the pokebeach

How could you say someone has to do better if you haven't even read his post? And besides, what's wrong with writing a speech on PokeBeach? (despite the majority will not understand)

 

[Card Slinger J]

And I do think we should begin taking care of our planet, not out of fear of extinction, but by logic. The world is beautiful and it is clearly being ruined by the disgusting species that is humans. We've made animals extinct and we've thrown our crud about like it's not going to have an effect.

Well people who shop at grocery stores these days bring their own bags to try to cut wasting paper and plastic, plus we've already developed the kind of technology to clone animal DNA to bring extinct animals back to life but I wouldn't recommend the dinosaurs cause God wiped them off the face of the Earth 65 million years ago for a good reason and you've most likely seen the end result from Stephen Spielberg's Jurassic Park series.

China and India are 2 of the worlds biggest polluters not just the U.S., I don't know why they can't seem to get their acts together to clean the planet by reducing emissions and such. We also need to try to preserve the North and South Poles from melting and saving the polar bears, seals, and penguins. Deforestation is another thing I despise, we've almost lost what was left of the Amazon Rainforest. I remember watching the video for "Earth Song" by Michael Jackson and it moved me emotionally, it was an important message that everyone should learn.

I know some people don't like him but his music had a way with touching people's hearts even
"Man in the Mirror" which is one of the most inspiring songs I've ever heard. Yes I admit it, I've been a fan of MJ since I was a kid, loved his music, his dance moves, watched his videos, even used to own a poster of his BAD album as well. He may have had his problems in life, but his music and lyrics sometimes had an impact on what was going on in the world even today as well.

 

[Pokequaza]

Well people who shop at grocery stores these days bring their own bags to try to cut wasting paper and plastic, plus we've already developed the kind of technology to clone animal DNA to bring extinct animals back to life but I wouldn't recommend the dinosaurs cause God wiped them off the face of the Earth 65 million years ago for a good reason and you've most likely seen the end result from Stephen Spielberg's Jurassic Park series.

I'm pretty sure it was a catastrophic disaster, like a meteor, wiping out the dinosaurs and pretty much everything else larger than a dog.

Also it is impossible to clone a dinosaur, simply because most, if not all, of its DNA is lost. If it was possible I'm sure they would've already done it. Still this isn't a good reason why we shouldn't take care of the Earth. And no, bringing your own plastic bags to the grocery stores wouldn't help much either. At least it is a beginning...

 

[Heavenly Spoon]

China and India are 2 of the worlds biggest polluters not just the U.S., I don't know why they can't seem to get their acts together to clean the planet by reducing emissions and such. We also need to try to preserve the North and South Poles from melting and saving the polar bears, seals, and penguins. Deforestation is another thing I despise, we've almost lost what was left of the Amazon Rainforest. I remember watching the video for "Earth Song" by Michael Jackson and it moved me emotionally, it was an important message that everyone should learn.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_dioxide_emissions
2nd most polluting (CO2-wise) country after China, which has a massive population (which makes the US the 6th per capita). I don't know where you got the idea that the US is not one of the most polluting countries, at least when it comes to CO2 (which is sorta the most important human-made greenhouse gas).

Also, in response to the actual title, I think this January was the 2nd hottest on record , I'll find a source later...

 

[Ensiger]

I forgot where I heard this, it was in some article, that like, 172 scientists disagreed with Global Warming, and said that the Earth was actually cooler than it should've been, and that now it's actually warming up to the temperatures from like centuries ago. I haven't studied any of this as much as I should, but they gave pretty good evidence, and convinced me.

 

[Pokequaza]

I forgot where I heard this, it was in some article, that like, 172 scientists disagreed with Global Warming, and said that the Earth was actually cooler than it should've been, and that now it's actually warming up to the temperatures from like centuries ago. I haven't studied any of this as much as I should, but they gave pretty good evidence, and convinced me.

As long as you can't present us the 'evidence' you saw there's is no way for us to agree or disagree, neither does your ''I'm convinced'' count in this way.

Also, 172 scientists? That number is completely useless unless you also give us the number of every single scientist on Earth (not even to question whether they're real scientists or not).

 

[Heavenly Spoon]

There has indeed been a petition signed by quite a number of scientists who are "skeptical towards the role of man in the current climate change", however, most of these are not climatologists, and the general consensus amongst climatologists is still that the recent warming trend is caused by human activity.
Things like this do seem to get quite a lot of attention on the more conservative American news outlets. Why is climate change such a political thing anyways? Is distrust in science one of the selling points of the republican party?

Also, I'm surprised I haven't posted this playlist here yet:
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=A4F0994AFB057BB8
It might not be a bad idea to take a look at this if you "deny" global warming...

 

[Card Slinger J]

Here's something interesting I found regarding Global Warming:

http://www.aolnews.com/science/article/hidden-gas-source-could-speed-global-warming/19383307

If we stop this hidden gas source that's spreading methane into our atmosphere the better chances we have at saving our planet.

 

[gamercal]

I forgot where I heard this, it was in some article, that like, 172 scientists disagreed with Global Warming, and said that the Earth was actually cooler than it should've been, and that now it's actually warming up to the temperatures from like centuries ago. I haven't studied any of this as much as I should, but they gave pretty good evidence, and convinced me.

It's true that the Earth is cooler than it should be if the only thing contributing to its temperature is greenhouse gases. But it's not, and again it's our fault for it. Allow me to explain.

CO2 and related gases are not the only thing we dump in the atmosphere that affect it. We also dump an awful lot of SO2 as well (hence the primary cause of more acidic rains compared to purely natural sources). This gas gets into the stratosphere and forms an aerosol layer that increases the planet's albedo - basically the reflectivity of the planet. What that means is that less radiation from the sun itself gets into the planet, which is not predicted just by looking at CO2/H2O/CH4 levels alone. Where the Earth should've seen a 6 or 7K rise in temperature over the time we have been measuring it, it has in fact only seen a 1-2K rise, and it's down to this.

However, I'm fairly sure that isn't QUITE what you were getting at there, having read over the quoted post. I just wanted to get that out there since it was vaguely relevant

I don't see how anyone could say the Earth was "cooler than it should've been" though. I mean, sure, say that if it was Ice Age temperatures, but beyond that it seems arbitrary to say that the Earth has to be at a set temperature at a set time. Patterns only get you so far; they can be irregular if they want, and history does not always repeat itself in a regular fashion.

Finally, I know it isn't, but if that was all the scientists that disagreed with global warming it would be a totally insignificant number on the whole. 172 out of the tens of thousands (at least, probably an order of magnitude or two higher) who study the atmosphere is a very small percentage... not saying they don't have a valid view, but the the odds of them being right against the overwhelming evidence against them is not high.

EDIT: Also Slinger I've heard of that. This is a large factor that is frightening atmospheric chemists etc. about global warming - as the temperature of the planet increases cause of our CO2 dumps, the permafrosts and such melt, releasing masses of CH4 into the atmosphere. That gas is several times more influential than CO2 in the atmosphere - basically, if all the methane trapped in the ground got into the atmosphere, you could kiss goodbye to the planet...

Tom, I guess it's so political because politicians are the ones who end up having the final say when it comes to making laws and such, and they by their nature distrust anything and everything that comes there way. It takes YEARS for stuff to happen because of them, time we cannot afford to waste given our current situation. Us scientists have to come up with really overwhelming evidence that cannot be proven wrong in any way, shape or form (such as generating a perfect model to describe and predict situations) before they will admit defeat... as to why one party is more attentive to the issue than another, I have no answer to that :S

 

[mammaluigi]

I find it hard to belive that if global warming is true,
How is the entire east coast COVERED IN A BLANKET, nay, a COMFORTER OF SNOW.
BTW, comforter= very thick blanket.

 

[gamercal]

Global Warming is a misleading title for the effect, as it doesn't solely increase temperature. More accurately it increases extreme weather conditions - hotter in the summer, colder in the winter. There was a specific name it was given in the course I took, but that was last year now and I forget silly details like that :S

 

[Heavenly Spoon]

I find it hard to belive that if global warming is true,
How is the entire east coast COVERED IN A BLANKET, nay, a COMFORTER OF SNOW.
BTW, comforter= very thick blanket.

I love how the US and Europe represent the entire world. I'm sure any Australian or South-African could at this point make the exact opposite observation.

 

[Zenith]

The US and Europe aren't the entire world?! O=

Mind = blown.

I had assumed that Australia was a myth created to scare small children, what with everything trying to kill you and all. Even the trees, man. The TREEEEEES!

 

[Pokequaza]

Do you believe in Australia? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EbcS234hvQc

Anyway, also fun how people base their opinions on ONE winter. If you can count, that are 3 months. And I'm pretty sure climate is the temperature, humidity, atmospheric pressure, wind, rainfall etc measured over a period of 30 years. So, repeat your 3-month-count for another 119 times and give a look at the results then. =)

 

[+Life Shaymin]

Here is some surprising data that may change your outlook on this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOOc5yiIWkg

 

[Enlyten]

^ Thats definitely something to think about.....

However, he was still besides the point that our efforts to "Go Green", are helping a little.

 

[Heavenly Spoon]

Here is some surprising data that may change your outlook on this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOOc5yiIWkg

I looked him up, found out he's dead, my condolences to his family, but this wasn't funny...

But about the content of the vid. He's basically advocating we don't care, we'll all die pretty soon anyway. But who honestly gains anything from an attitude like that?
What we do will indeed barely affect the planet as a whole, but the animals, and more specifically us, are already greatly affected by our actions. He mentioned extinctions, we are the cause of the latest massive extinction, species do just disappear, but because of us, they do so at an incredibly fast rate. The changes in the Earth's climate are pretty much proven to be caused by human activity. Our little ball of life is more fragile than he makes it seem.
"We don't have to save the world, the world's big enough to look after itself, what we have to be concerned about is whether or not the world we live in will be capable of sustaining us in it" ~Douglas Adams

I'm guessing nihilism is part of his humour, and shouldn't be taken too seriously, but that's a very selfish and arrogant attitude...

BTW, I'd rather we discuss the validity of anthropogenic climate change than we discuss the point of bothering to do anything about it, "life sucks any way". Discussing the point of doing anything about it is much more pointless than doing something about it.

 

[+Life Shaymin]

I looked him up, found out he's dead, my condolences to his family, but this wasn't funny...

But about the content of the vid. He's basically advocating we don't care, we'll all die pretty soon anyway. But who honestly gains anything from an attitude like that?
What we do will indeed barely affect the planet as a whole, but the animals, and more specifically us, are already greatly affected by our actions. He mentioned extinctions, we are the cause of the latest massive extinction, species do just disappear, but because of us, they do so at an incredibly fast rate. The changes in the Earth's climate are pretty much proven to be caused by human activity. Our little ball of life is more fragile than he makes it seem.
"We don't have to save the world, the world's big enough to look after itself, what we have to be concerned about is whether or not the world we live in will be capable of sustaining us in it" ~Douglas Adams

I'm guessing nihilism is part of his humour, and shouldn't be taken too seriously, but that's a very selfish and arrogant attitude...

BTW, I'd rather we discuss the validity of anthropogenic climate change than we discuss the point of bothering to do anything about it, "life sucks any way". Discussing the point of doing anything about it is much more pointless than doing something about it.

I see what you are saying. The way George Carlin was speaking was in a way of respect and understanding for our planet. Earth is fine, it goes through natural heating and cooling cycles, ice ages and other global warming. We've meddled so much that there is not much we can really do to stop it all. We became the dominant species due to are intelligence. We won't be around for ever, after we go extinct, other creatures will evolve and take our place.

I hate to break it to you, many of those graphs are exaggerated and manipulated. There is plenty of clever tricks that they do when presenting them to seem more dramatic. Furthermore, most of the temperature gauges are located in cities! What they are doing is measuring urban warming and nor global warming. I want to see where the measurements where takin, how they where takin, who took them, and what they got out of it. Many people forget to leave out that our magnetic field is on the verge of a shift, I wonder if something like that might have something to do with it.....

I can't remember the name of the island, but I've heard it referenced a lot, they say that "The sea level is rising". What they don't say is that it is sitting on a pocket of magma that can change the height of the landmass itself when measuring data. It is shoddy scientific work, the only reason it is so big right now is because there is money to be made. I bet you if there was some way to profit off of stopping homelessness, those guys would be off of the streets.

 

[Heavenly Spoon]

There's as much money to be made, if not more, in the oil industry. I doubt the solar and wind energy industry bribed almost all major climatologists...

1st of all, do you really think climatologists are unaware of the faults of their own measurements?
I don't have the time at the moment to look anything up about this, but feel free to link me to stuff about the methods used to calculate the global temperature.

2nd of all, I'm fully aware of exaggeration of graphs (on both sides of the discussion), Al Gore having to use an elevator to read the top of his graph in An Inconvenient Truth being one of them, but that's not the scientific research. Many different methods of calculating temperature have been used to establish a correlation between historically high CO2 levels/solar activity and an increase of the surface's temperature at the time. There's no reason to reject the data on the basis of "exaggeration of graphs", data is data, no matter what tricks you use to exaggerate the graphs. However, I do disagree with the notion that we'd have to suddenly be afraid of global warming; something has to be done, but fear really isn't necessary. Greenland and half of Antarctica aren't going to melt anytime soon like Al Gore seemed to be implying.

3rd of all, I doubt there's a correlation between historical warming and cooling and geomagnetic reversal, but feel free to show me some evidence to convince me otherwise.