Expanded Help updating Donphan deck!

[Toxic]

The tl;dr is that I'm looking for new card updates for my Donphan list that is a few years old. Below I explained the deck and listed some questions/discussion points for the current Expanded format.

Pokémon - 15
* 4-4 Donphan PLS 72
* 2 Wobbuffet PHF 36
* 1 Shaymin-EX ROS 77
* 1 Hoopa SLG 55
* 1 Tapu Koko PR-SM SM31
* 1 Aegislash-EX PHF 65
* 1 Kyurem LTR 43

Trainer Cards - 34
* 4 Professor Sycamore BKP 107
* 4 N DEX 96
* 3 Korrina FFI 95
* 2 Guzma BUS 115
* 1 Colress PLS 118

* 4 Robo Substitute Team Flare Gear PHF 102
* 3 Choice Band GRI 121
* 2 VS Seeker PHF 109
* 2 Ultra Ball DEX 102
* 2 Field Blower GRI 125
* 2 Float Stone PLF 99
* 1 Computer Search BCR 137
* 1 Rescue Stretcher GRI 130
* 1 Escape Rope PLS 120

* 2 Scorched Earth PRC 138

Energy - 11
* 4 Strong Energy FFI 104
* 4 Double Colorless Energy NXD 92
* 3 Fighting Energy Energy 6

Now here's the thing. I'm returning to the Pokemon TCG (namely PTCGO) after a 2-ish year break. I want to get involved in the Standard format, but to do that I'll need to play in PTCGO expanded tournaments in order to get trade fodder for Standard cards. Donphan is my most consistent Expanded legal deck so I've decided to focus on that for now. The strategy is to build up an army of Spinning Donphans that will do hit-and-run damage for the majority of the game. One of the biggest boons to the deck is the prize trade which gets even better when you use the Robo Substitutes to soak damage and stall. Donphan also has the option to snatch Big KO turns with his second attack + stadium + Lysandre (Guzma?) to secure wins. The other Pokemon choices in the deck are there to be Donphan's punching bag when he switches out. Choices explained below.

Some things I've noticed after being back for a few days:

Hawlucha is hit or miss (even more than before lol) now that GX Pokemon are the new big thing. The same goes for the fighting stadium, though I need a stadium regardless for Donphan's second attack and it's nice to have as a counter-stadium. Are there any free retreat mons that can fill Hawlucha's role in the deck? The deck would lose a lot of its flexibility without the free retreat.

Volcanion is everywhere in Expanded PTCGO tourneys. Wobbuffet is incredible in stopping their gameplan and so long as I have the Float Stone or a timely Escape Rope it fits with the deck really well. The Outrage DCE Kyurem also helps soak hits and retaliate for weakness vs Volcs. The original list ran the Outrage Zekrom to combat Yveltal but I removed it for a second Wobbuffet. AFAIK, Yveltal is nowhere to be found in the meta and all of the dangerous water types are either weak to grass or steel. Are there any new damage soak partners I should know about?

The only other constant matchup I see is Night March which I have a pretty good record against. It's not uncommon for them to almost deck themselves out in the process of trying to take 6 prizes against Donphan and the Robo-Subs. Though I do well against it I am definitely open to tips and/or suggestions on the matchup as it's far from an auto-win. Every now and then Night March Does Its Thing™ and scraps out a win.

 

[Connor Ritter]

I'm a big fan of Donphan decks from back when they were Standard so I like what's happening here. I do have a few suggestions though:

• Drop Hawlucha. It's attack isn't going to be viable in present game with how scarce EXs are compared to GXs. If you want a free retreater, Tapu Koko promo is the best choice with its higher HP & Flying Flip for a DCE since you're already playing that.
• It's hard to recommend any damage sponges since so many Pokemon will be taking OHKOs regardless of your HP. Instead I'd look at Pokemon that can't be damaged:
  • Hoopa from Shining Legends is safe from EX & GX Pokemon.
  • Xurkitree GX or Aegislash EX are safe from Pokemon with special energy.
  • Latias EX is safe from Pokemon with abilities.
  • Mew from Evolutions is safe from evolutions.
• Depending on your matchup, bench one of these to switch into and prevent taking any damage at all. Definitely keep 4 Robo Substitute as an excellent switch in for all matchups.
• Guzma and Float Stone will be important to allow you to switch out of these wall Pokemon and back to Donphan. Guzma will be good for any scenario when your opponent tries to stall a turn on a Robo Subtitute since you can't retreat it, forcing you to discard if you wanna attack. It'll also be to pull up anything your opponent ties to set up to counter whatever walls the majority of their strategy.
• You're gonna want some field blowers or startling megaphones to remove any Silent Labs or Garbodor tools trying to block your abilities.
• On that note of Stadiums, there isn't one specifically that would greatly benefit this deck, but I'd suggest playing maybe Parallel City over Fighting Stadium. With Parallel City you can limit your opponent's bench or damage output, or remove any liability Pokemon from your own bench.

I hope this helps get your deck a bit more updated and keep it viable. I may try rebuilding a Donphan deck online myself!

 

[Kietharr]

I had a very fun and successful Donphan/Tauros deck back in BW-SM expanded but found that the power creep in GUR made Tauros, a key card for the deck, feel much weaker since choice band puts a base 150 attack to OHKO.

My current list runs 2 Hoopa and 1 Mew, I don't think that Latias is worth mentioning, Aegislash-EX is, it will auto win you any matchup against night march players who don't run a hex maniac (which is a lot these days, as they've began to include Zoroark and the list is getting tighter. Rescue stretchers are also key. I find that running basic energy feels almost like a waste, I just feel not attaching a strong energy makes your donphans feel so weak.

You want to run Scorched Earth as your stadium if you're going to run basic fighting energies and increase the chance of getting off the secondary attack. There are a lot of games where you frankly don't need it though, I've run the list with and without stadium cards.

 

[Toxic]

Haven't been able to get ahold of every card suggested yet (no Mew, Latias, or Xurkitree) but Hoopa and Aegislash EX are definite inclusions as of now. My Night March winrate has gone up considerably just with 1 Aegislash, and Hoopa's double immunity goes a long way against a lot of current meta decks. @Kietharr What was your energy count? I have concerns dropping the basic energy amount too much for a few reasons.

(now this is just based on my personal testing the last few days so maybe I'm totally wrong or missing the point, but):

1. I see merit in Donphan's second attack and think that the deck loses important oomph without it. 90 every turn (strong+choice) isn't cutting in long term games; not in Expanded where every deck has potential access to 4 or more Guzma effects (VS Seeker). There were a lot of games where I needed the burst damage or else my opponent would VS Seeker+Guzma KO next turn to seal the game in their favor. Of course you can do more than 90 by putting a second Strong on a Donphan but that brings me to my next point
2. You only have so much energy to go around. In real match scenarios Donphans do get KO'd. The more (Strong) energy you put on one Donphan means the less resources your other ones will have. 4 Strong 4 DCE would lead to way too many dead turns. The only real solution is to play a few basic fighting to patch things up. Agreed that Donphan is weak without the Strongs but the basics give you a consistent security net to fall back on.

I'm still tweaking around with amount numbers on a few things but here are the changes I've been playing with. I'll update the original post with the new list.

-2 Hawlucha FFI
-2 Lysandre
-1 Muscle Band
-1 Enhanced Hammer
-3 Fighting Stadium
- 2 Fighting Energy

+1 Hoopa SHL
+1 Tapu Koko Promo
+1 Aegislash EX
+2 Guzma
+2 Scorched Earth
+2 Field Blower
+1 Rescue Stretcher
+1 Double Colorless Energy

Thanks to the both of your for your input.

 

[Kietharr]

Donphan's second attack is a bigger deal when you're not playing against night march in about 50% of games which is my general experience with online play these days. It's a meta call, I played it that way back in the earlier SM sets, but Night March has gotten quite a few indirect buffs in recent sets, and Donphan is one of the decks that doesn't really need to worry about Karen or Oricorio to counter it. Aegislash and robosubs will make things hard enough for them. I estimate I have about an 85-90% wr against night march.

I run special charge to deal with the 'running out of energy' problem, didn't notice that the list didn't take advantage of it. If you need room, I'd cut N a bit, 4 N is more than you realistically need because you will be using several turns of Korrina in most games, I find.

I'd also try to get an extra vs seeker, the deck ran low counts of them in favor of more draw/shuffle support in the past due to the overwhelming prevalence of toad in expanded. I play the deck the way I do because I feel there's less toad and trev and more night march than there used to be. If you see more item lock where you're playing, you move back to higher supporter counts over items.

In terms of stadium, if you're not going to run very many basic fighting energy but want to run a stadium, you should run parallels. If you're going to run like 4-5 fighting energies you should run scorched earth. The point of that stadium is you really don't want to attach basic energy if you have a better play (ie strong/DCE) so if you can make that special energy attachment that turn, you can use the excess basic energies to increase your draw, then recycle the stadium for a KO. With just 1 basic fighting energy you're not getting much effect out of scorched earth.