Discussion Ho-Oh EX Discussion Thread

socery

socery

I love being bad
Member
I'm testing Ho-Oh and loving it. It reminds me of Darkrai and it's not completely awful.
3 Ho-Oh-EX (BKP 121)
1 Hoopa-EX (AOR 89)
1 Absol (ROS 40)
3 Smeargle (BKT 123)
3 Shaymin-EX (ROS 106)
3 Grass Energy (XY 132)
3 Lightning Energy (XY 135)
3 Water Energy (XY 134)
2 Fire Energy (XY 133)
3 Fighting Fury Belt (BKP 99)
1 Switch (PCL 163)
4 VS Seeker (ROS 110)
3 Sky Field (ROS 89)
4 Ultra Ball (ROS 93)
2 Assault Vest (BKT 133)
1 Switch (KSS 38)
4 Max Elixir (BKP 102)
2 Professor Birch's Observations (PCL 159)
3 Professor Sycamore (BKP 107)
1 Super Rod (BKT 149)
2 Float Stone (BKT 137)
4 Trainers' Mail (AOR 100)
2 Lysandre (FLF 104)
2 Level Ball (AOR 76)

What are your thoughts on making this concept as a whole better? I'd like to play this deck for the future, it seems pretty fun :)
 
I think the concept overall is not good. First off, the attack is hard to set up. Yes, I do know Smeargle exists, but so does Silent Lab, Wobbuffet, Hex Maniac, the new Greninja, etc. In your specific setup, manually attaching and relying on Max Elixr is unreliable. What if you face against Toad (with weakness as well)? Or can't switch energy because of ability lock? The damage for the attack is OK and 30 on the bench is OK but nothing there is jaw dropping. Another issue is the ability. While healing 50 dmg a turn with a fire attached is great, it doesn't help that you have no colorless cost in the attack. This means to consistently attack AND heal you need 4 energy attached. Healing is crucial against decks, but at the same times decks like Yveltal and M Mewtwo Y are going to stomp on any extra attachments regardless. Lastly, it has weakness to water. Before BKP, this would have been very good. As of now, no one really knows how good/big Toad Gyrados, Palkia, and/or Greninja will be next format. For now, I think it would be best to avoid any water-weak decks (including entei) until we know where those decks stand. This deck has some flaws that IMHO make it unplayable for the time being.
Though I have seen it being played with Mega Manectric. If you do plan to do this, I still think there are some challenges to overcome. First, you have to understand the deck will either be tight or clunky. If you go consistent, you might have to drop the 1-of and make a tight list, or if you feel you need the 1-of's (megaphone/AZ/etc.) then it will feel a bit clunky.
 
I feel like Ho-oh EX almost needs Rainbow Energy to be fairly consistent with its attacks. That said, considering that Rainbow Energy is easily targeted by hate (Enhanced Hammer and Xerosic specifically), I could see why most people I see attempting this deck do not run it, but with the choices being that and running more than 1 Smeargle BKT... I think I would take my chances. :p

Still, I agree with (most of) Elbow stated. You're going to have either A. consistency issues or B. a clunky deck. That said, the only thing I do NOT agree with is the fact that you should "stay away" from this deck, simply because Pokemon is a game meant for fun and, knowing you Socery, this is your "let's make silly thing happen" deck.

Now, as a deck itself...this deck specifically needs a Front-Runner. Something to allow you to set up Ho-oh because quite frankly, it takes time. Personally, it is much too early for me to be thinking too hard, but I will suggest finding something that will both stall for time until Ho-oh is set up AND something that will slow your opponent down at the same time. That way, faster decks you may run in to on PTCGO will not simply walk all over you and you will be able to set up the powerhouse that is Fire Chicken. Either that... or Hammers. Because Hammers.

Hope this helps at least somewhat!
 
I'm playing Ho-Oh EX right now and I think I have the best build concept for it. I think the best way to play it is with Golduck Break. It requires so much energy to attack and there's no real way to get it going. It really needs things like max potion to do well. I'm still working on the list but I feel there aren't enough card spaces to fit what you need. Ho-Oh really benefits from EXP Share, even if its just one copy. Ho-Oh EX from concept was doomed from the start with this format.
 
I mentioned this when the set came out but palkia EX and smeargle, there is no need to play 3 of every energy and hope your not going to get something more consistent.

5-7 water
2 electric
2 grass
3 fire
(13-14 energy is fair)

Is probably going to be more effective, to be fair your probably going to want something like 15-16 energy to proc max elixir consistently. as for your trainer engine as long as you have

2 shaymin EX

3 sycamore
3 birch
1 cassius
4 ultra ball
4 vs seeker
4 trainers mail
4 max elixir
2-3 super potion
2 super rod
3 assault vest/fighting fury
1 weakness policy
(eco arm is an option instead of adding more tools)

everything else is optional, chances are with 16 energy and 12-13 pokemon minimum your likely to draw into half of your pokemon with birch and sycamore, weakness policy is for nm and manectric, super potion and super rod is to heal 110 dmg per turn, even putting in a centre lady will probably balance out you bats, greninja, trevenant, and overall matchups, having the option to heal everything off of your active in a turn and only drop 1 energy is dangerous to have with this deck. Good luck.
 
So can the new ho oh be viable with some energy acceleration like Vivillon or togekiss (if I'm not including a much viable way to accelerate pls tell me) I'll love to pull a ho oh deck, it doesn't have to be 100% competitive or god tier in the current meta I just want a cool bit at the same time powerful and viable deck. I'm getting back into the tcg and looking for a deck to build and my other option is garchomp but don't know if that deck will be as fun as the ho oh one. I know this ho oh card is not super good but my last deck was a rebirth ho oh one so that's why I'm interested in this one
 
Ho-Oh is seeing a little hype with MegaMan and Smeargle. Max Elixir is huge and can help accelerate Basic Energy, potentially pulling off a T2 (or even T1 if you run enough/get lucky with Max Elixir) Elemental Feather. With Fighting Fury Belt and its Ability, it could be pretty difficult to Knock Out Ho-Oh. It's kind of risky because of Trevenant becoming so popular that Item lock can put a damper on this deck. Furthermore, its Weakness to Water might hurt if Palkia-EX variants get popular.
 
Serperior said:
Ho-Oh is seeing a little hype with MegaMan and Smeargle. Max Elixir is huge and can help accelerate Basic Energy, potentially pulling off a T2 (or even T1 if you run enough/get lucky with Max Elixir) Elemental Feather. With Fighting Fury Belt and its Ability, it could be pretty difficult to Knock Out Ho-Oh. It's kind of risky because of Trevenant becoming so popular that Item lock can put a damper on this deck. Furthermore, its Weakness to Water might hurt if Palkia-EX variants get popular.
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Palkia EX is very slow though, at least the builds I have played against are slow. But, I digress.

Anyways, there are quite a few options for accelerating the energy needs for Ho-Oh EX right now. You can use M Manectric as a setup pokemon and switch into a Ho-Oh EX with FFB to Tank for the rest of the match. You could use Max Elixir to attach directly to Ho-Oh EX. Togekiss EX can also supplement your attachments from the hand allowing you to attach twice in one turn. You could even try doing some fairy box and Rainbow Energy shenanigans.

I think the real killer of Ho-Oh is the going to be the lack of consistency needed to compete with the top tier decks of the current meta. But I think the most viable and consistent option is going to be MegaMan / Ho Oh with a mix of Max Elixirs and Battle Compressors.
 
With MegaMan running around, it's a risky play. I think the card will get better over time. I believe it will be one of those sneaky cards that just break out a year later and trainers start playing it. I'm a bit of a hoarder when it comes to that stuff. Versus trading cards right away, I find that cards like that get better over time as new sets come out. It is one of the reason, I buy them when their low $$.

Some cards will remain a bit higher, like Jolteon EX because of versatility. While other cards, just get better over time like Lando EX.

But right now, I'd say there are just two many counters being played for it. When those counters go away, I think it will have some time to shine.
 
The main reason the megaman ho-oh deck does not work is that it has nothing to actually hit regice once it uses a resistance blizzard. This being a two-of or more staple in most decks running water energy/rough seas. When a reliable counter (trainer card or more suitable partner) for negating EX blocking attacks is released we may see the elemental feather Ho-Oh EX shine.
 
I'm having issues making it work as well. I'm trying to test it with a lot of other things and so far Golduck Break seems to be the way to go but the bird is so slow, having a water weakness is bad and its fighting resistance is completely irrelevant. Its colorless typing makes it to where it can't hit anything for weakness. If it were a fire type then things could look better for it. Also you need to run 4 different energy to fully use the card.

I never got the hype behind Megaman with Ho-Oh. It doesn't really do anything for the bird and Smeargle is nice but from my testing, if you can't get the energy on Ho-Oh, it won't help much and if a Ho-Oh ever goes down without taking at least 4 prize cards, they you will lose.

I'll post my list for Ho-Oh when I have it a little more solid.
 
I've been testing decently with Mega Manectric / Ho-Oh. It's best to view it as a supplementary attacker rather than a new centerpiece for the deck, which sould still remain based around M Manectric-Ex. Running the extra types of Basic Energy isn't nearly as much of an issue as I had though, especially with Max Elixir. Raikou BKT still provides a solid answer to Regice, able to hit for 130 with three Lightning Energy and a Muscle Band. Even with fewer Lightning Energy, it's still pretty easy to pull off thanks to Max Elixir and Battle Compressor.

Elemental Feather is such a strong attack when it goes off, and can really swing games around. It's almost like Darkrai-EX DEX's Night Spear with even more power behind it. Doing 130 with 30 snipe is good on its own, but cranking it up to 150 with Muscle Band allows Ho-Oh to take out Manectric's archenemy, Gallade BKT, which it also happens to have Resistance to.
 
I dont understand what's the point to run Ho-Oh in M Manectric, the extra 20 damage with 30 bench snipe is irrelevant, and its ability heal 20 more than Rough Seas, but it's lower HP and lacks of consistency make it much harder to play. Also, M Man has the best way to counter Regice, Zapdos ROA.
 
In my opinion hooh should be played with the idea of a healing/stalling deck, not trying to accelerate energy and attack with him as soon as possible,instead just increasing its survivability until he can attack
 
JYDeAlberto said:
In my opinion hooh should be played with the idea of a healing/stalling deck, not trying to accelerate energy and attack with him as soon as possible,instead just increasing its survivability until he can attack
Click to expand...

This is what I'm trying to do but the problem is other decks are just really bad for it. taking huge damage is bad because you're still trying to setup but I think the real factor is evolutions need more help trying to get out.

My deck list is solid so far but the trainer line needs more work. At this point, I want to try 4 Wally to see if I can manage a turn 2 golduck break.
 
I am new to TCG. I've only been playing for about a month.
My son has me hooked on this game. So I have 2 Ho-oh EX - I use them in a deck with 20 energy cards and 29 trainers and 11 basics - I only have basics. I know that you all are probably laughing at me for this, but I'm winning quite a few matches. Especially with 4 pokemon center lady cards, I can absorb a lot of damage. Other common cards I use every game are Cilan and Winona.
 
21times said:
I am new to TCG. I've only been playing for about a month.
My son has me hooked on this game. So I have 2 Ho-oh EX - I use them in a deck with 20 energy cards and 29 trainers and 11 basics - I only have basics. I know that you all are probably laughing at me for this, but I'm winning quite a few matches. Especially with 4 pokemon center lady cards, I can absorb a lot of damage. Other common cards I use every game are Cilan and Winona.
Click to expand...
are you playing against theme decks? or Similarly built decks? 20 Energy is ALOT of energy, thats even more than what most Deluge based decks run. Ho-Oh for sure could be a fun deck to play, but in competitive scenes it most certainly won't shine. Especially against the standard meta as of right now.
 
I can see ho oh used in an aromatisee deck with rainbow energy.
 
Micajah said:
I can see ho oh used in an aromatisee deck with rainbow energy.
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Thats what i was thinking too, but at that point i think it would only be a tech in the deck. it would be built like Fairy Box was. And when you start playing with rainbows you open up your deck to special energy hate as well.
 
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