Discussion How to Destroy the Mega Mewtwo Decks!

Otaku said:
If you have Lysandre handy.

If your opponent has an appropriate target on the Bench.

By this logic though, other decks do not have to take down M Mewtwo-EX, just its Bench. ;)

This point is not entirely without merit, but it isn't the be all end all answer either. As a hypothetical, because I don't know M Scizor-EX decks except as a general concept, can they try a trick like shifting gears to Scizor-EX as well? I mean, are you going to keep using Damage Change while Scizor-EX puts just enough damage on you to set up for a 2HKO the next turn, but not enough that you'll get to Lysandre up something from the Bench and Damage Change for a OHKO? Really asking because I don't know. ^^'

Well, this thread reminds me why folks are so excited about Mewtwo (XY: Evolutions).
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I have a m Mewtwo EX/ Garbodor and played against Scizor EX a few times and they all ended the same way. I was just able to damage change and place damage on other Pokemon. Mewtwo hits them too fast and hard and while saying just hit the Shaymins is hypothetical, it is a factor. For me, its been 4 free prize cards, between the Shaymin EX and Hoopa EX, meanng in all my games, I just needed to KO a single Scizor EX. Taking 2 prize cards while I completely heal m Mewtwo EX is a big deal. Its hard to say right now because no one really knows how to build Scizor EX but my build runs heavy Max Elixir and Mega Turbo so if they manage to discard my basic energy, I can still get an explosive turn.

Another thing for the match up is you don't even need m Mewtwo EX. You can go solo mewtwo to lock in your Damage Change and then mega evolve when you need to KO something so Mewtwo EX is capable of just playing around Scizor EX because Scizor can't OHKO you.
 
I have yet to lose a single game against mewtwo with my scizor deck, even when my opponent plays smart and opts out of the mega to secure his damage change it isn't enough, his energy cost is still higher than mine by 3 psychic energy minimum and 4 maximum, and with crushing hammers and chained flare grunts its even harder for them to keep up. So it takes 3 for the damage change and either a mega on the next turn or an additional psychic energy for the knockout because scatter shot can only hit for 70, and you can forget about lysandering anything out that isn't a scizor, I have been able to very consistently setup a bench of 3 scizor 1 hoopa and 1 shaymin and parallel city them off my bench, and if the option for the knockout is to mega then they have forced themselves into the position they don't want to be in and one of my other powered and ready to go scizors can continue its onslaught onto the already heavily invested mewtwo. I wont lie some of the games have come really close, so its not an auto win, but the mewtwo deck will run out of steam faster then I will due to there greater cost and my incredible energy disruption.
 
I played in a league challenge today and I know of at least four people that were playing Mega Mewtwo/Garbodor. I ran a not quite finished Mega Kyogre deck got slammed by one, hammered the other the difference was Garbodor and Parallel City; take them out spread damage to the bench, hit, move, don't let them set up. Got to have abilities. Sounds easier than it was but its doable.
 
SpoonLarry said:
I have yet to lose a single game against mewtwo with my scizor deck, even when my opponent plays smart and opts out of the mega to secure his damage change it isn't enough, his energy cost is still higher than mine by 3 psychic energy minimum and 4 maximum, and with crushing hammers and chained flare grunts its even harder for them to keep up. So it takes 3 for the damage change and either a mega on the next turn or an additional psychic energy for the knockout because scatter shot can only hit for 70, and you can forget about lysandering anything out that isn't a scizor, I have been able to very consistently setup a bench of 3 scizor 1 hoopa and 1 shaymin and parallel city them off my bench, and if the option for the knockout is to mega then they have forced themselves into the position they don't want to be in and one of my other powered and ready to go scizors can continue its onslaught onto the already heavily invested mewtwo. I wont lie some of the games have come really close, so its not an auto win, but the mewtwo deck will run out of steam faster then I will due to there greater cost and my incredible energy disruption.
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I can agree with this. I just played a Scizor deck that uses all the hammers and grunts. I still managed to win the match but it could have gotten out of hand but Mega Turbo and other recovery cards works wonders for Mewtwo.
 
SS Mega Gardevoir is my favorite counter to Mega Mewtwo. It's not that fast anymore since the rotation (no more Dimension Valley at least in Standard), but 110 base power x2 for weakness is guaranteed to 1-hit KO Mega Mewtwo. Alternativey, I use AO Golurk with ancient trait, too, but it needs energy boost from Carbink-Break or Garchomp.
 
The version of mega gard I run has only one weakness and thats scizor, but mega mewtwo is usually a win thanks to turn 2 setup, but mega mewtwo is still a really great deck, of course I love mega gard so it sorta just becomes an easy matchup. I Do really think people underestimate mega gard in the new meta with the less of aromatisse. I never played it in the old meta, but I play my updated version irl and it works really really well, I just make sure to pack a couple extra super rods to recover pokemon, and I run 2 hoopa ex to make sure I dont have one prized every or very rarely
 
Doesn't Mew-EX from Black and White return in a week or two? Surely that's one of the best counters out there for M Mewtwo Y because it uses all your attacks you have anyway and hits for weakness
 
AuraJackle said:
The biggest counter to Mewtwo would be the card lab making a errata on what is an obviously broken attack (Damage exchange). I hate this attack it forces you to play a deck that can 1 shot opponents in the up to 230 damage department. if a deck can easily shut down a multitude of decks without any skill involved its pretty much instantly broken and the only reason why its a big deal now is because mewtwo know longer has to worry about a 60 hp pumpkin OHKO'ing it all the time. Also to comment on somebody above i definitely believe scizor is a solid counter to Mega mewtwo with magearna EX it makes damage change not work on scizor though the healing affect still works it forces the opponent into a situation of no damage dealing and Mscizors attack also discards Shrine of memories so another big help. yes theres garbodor but scizor can KO it easily under ability lock unlike decks like Greninja.
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Night March. M Rayquaza. The only way M Mewtwo-EX will be difficult for you is that you refuse to accept it and move on. Complaining about it is making the situation any better. Mewtwo actually takes skill to play, while it's tad bit easier then other decks, it does require skill to play, unlike Night March. And yes, really the main reason it's a big deal right now is since there's no obvious counter to it, that'll happen with a lot of things, a lot of decks can shut down a multitude of decks in an instant, but that doesn't make a deck "broken." While it's frustrating, you can't just say a card is broken because you can't beat it. Errata's are only used when a card is translated wrong from Japanese, like Galvantula not to "fix" broken cards, counters are released instead. Right now I'll give you the run down of why Damage Change isn't "an obviously broken attack," 1. It requires skill to know when's the optimal time to use it 2. It costs two psychic and a colorless, here's where the clever card design comes in, since Mewtwo-EX has that energy costs, 90% it takes the Mewtwo player more time set up, and can's start attacking imediatly, and you can't attach Psychic and Double Colorless Energy which is what you need for M Mewtwo-EX, see what I mean there? 3. It doesn't do damage. And it is one-shotable, M Rayquaza-EX, Volcanion, M Gardevoir-EX, and a few others can deal with it. Your speaking like you know balance of these cards, while it does suck not being able to play weird fun rogue decks, you either accept matches against M Mewtwo-EX as losses, or you figure out how to adapt, or you'll be left behind. Good luck.
 
PineDog said:
Night March. M Rayquaza. The only way M Mewtwo-EX will be difficult for you is that you refuse to accept it and move on. Complaining about it is making the situation any better. Mewtwo actually takes skill to play, while it's tad bit easier then other decks, it does require skill to play, unlike Night March. And yes, really the main reason it's a big deal right now is since there's no obvious counter to it, that'll happen with a lot of things, a lot of decks can shut down a multitude of decks in an instant, but that doesn't make a deck "broken." While it's frustrating, you can't just say a card is broken because you can't beat it. Errata's are only used when a card is translated wrong from Japanese, like Galvantula not to "fix" broken cards, counters are released instead. Right now I'll give you the run down of why Damage Change isn't "an obviously broken attack," 1. It requires skill to know when's the optimal time to use it 2. It costs two psychic and a colorless, here's where the clever card design comes in, since Mewtwo-EX has that energy costs, 90% it takes the Mewtwo player more time set up, and can's start attacking imediatly, and you can't attach Psychic and Double Colorless Energy which is what you need for M Mewtwo-EX, see what I mean there? 3. It doesn't do damage. And it is one-shotable, M Rayquaza-EX, Volcanion, M Gardevoir-EX, and a few others can deal with it. Your speaking like you know balance of these cards, while it does suck not being able to play weird fun rogue decks, you either accept matches against M Mewtwo-EX as losses, or you figure out how to adapt, or you'll be left behind. Good luck.
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Emphasis added, but not to agree: you had a pretty good point except for what is in bold.

Short Version: Night March requires skill. Less than other decks? Maybe. If I go into detail, I think it counts as derailing the thread. What I can tell you is that by the World Championships, Night March lost. Sure some placed in the Top 8, but in the Masters division did any make the Top 4? Night March was heavily played and while the other decks all could be seen as "anti-Night March", most were at least solid in their own right, if not really good decks that happened to rise even higher because they were naturally anti-Night March.

So let us not go down this road again, where we elevate a deck into some kind of boogeyman (mon?) and miss potential solutions.
 
PineDog said:
does require skill to play, unlike Night March.
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Just so you know, anyone could pick up and play Night March, but there was/is a big difference between a good Night March player and a great one. The ladder knew all of the most optimal plays to get into a better position.
 
Otaku said:
Emphasis added, but not to agree: you had a pretty good point except for what is in bold.

Short Version: Night March requires skill. Less than other decks? Maybe. If I go into detail, I think it counts as derailing the thread. What I can tell you is that by the World Championships, Night March lost. Sure some placed in the Top 8, but in the Masters division did any make the Top 4? Night March was heavily played and while the other decks all could be seen as "anti-Night March", most were at least solid in their own right, if not really good decks that happened to rise even higher because they were naturally anti-Night March.

So let us not go down this road again, where we elevate a deck into some kind of boogeyman (mon?) and miss potential solutions.
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Yeah sorry, they way I quoted it was pretty misleading, which I do apologize for. What I was going for, but didn't mention is that I was trying to compare M Mewtwo-EX to Night March, easy to pilot, hard to master decks that are incredibly frustrating to deal with. I do appreciate the feedback though.
 
PineDog said:
Yeah sorry, they way I quoted it was pretty misleading, which I do apologize for. What I was going for, but didn't mention is that I was trying to compare M Mewtwo-EX to Night March, easy to pilot, hard to master decks that are incredibly frustrating to deal with. I do appreciate the feedback though.
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No problem. Ironically in trying to avoid one bit of confusion, I think I created another: apart from that I did agree with what you're saying. Looks like you were paying attention though, have already remedied the matter, and we're on course:

M Mewtwo-EX is strong, but we need to avoid the "Woe is us!" mentality that could blind us to actual solutions. Some of the tried and true methods are options (take out the Bench!): I don't think that is the real answer, but you take that and even a halfway decent counter and the two together should keep a versus M Mewtwo-EX match from being one-sided. Which means we are probably just waiting for XY: Evolutions, as its regular Mewtwo seems like a solid anti-M Mewtwo-EX trick.
 
To Reply to PineDog I understand where your coming from i recently looked at mewtwo ex a bit more and realized its attack wasn't as broken as i originally thought(or was told) however it still is to some extent. That being said its not that i believe mewtwo is not a card that you can't one shot its that i hate the idea of a card that must be one shotted otherwise your going to have to sacrifice a Pokemon to take it out. this makes mewtwo a a very annoying counter to any deck that wants to use cheap 2 shotter attacks something that is an alternative to a OHKO but heavy energy deck. Any time a single deck alone can shape the format we are looking at a bad metagame(Of course you can't really say we have a defined format at this point). look at night march and vespiquen both were low hp single attachment cards that dealt allot of damage very fast and with little skill to set up. as a way to react to these decks people had to stop using big hitting but high energy cards and focus more on those that could attack fast and deal low damage but still enough to KO night march. when i picture an image of a perfect format is when no one deck can stand over all others and that all stategies for victory are viable this means mill, 2HKO decks,OHKO, 3HKO decks with disruption, and others can come out on top with the right amount of skill and strategy.where as Mewtwo EX makes allot of potentially good decks not viable. I do however want to play against it, i dont have allot of practice do to my usual league lacking any real variation so i'd like to see how decks that i use could beat it. Also a little side note Night march was easy to play but i had more respect for night march than i did for trevenent players that was the lowest of the low deck for me and was very happy to see it fail at worlds. I'm sorry if my errata statement seemed a little over the top that was when i believed that the attack worked more like a damage transference instead of exchange however i do believe that cards that are more broken than the lab initially perceived should be fixed in the future as a way to create the most healthy format possible
 
Just to add to M Mewtwo EX. Damage Change is a 'broken' attack. A deck not equipped to deal with it just can't win and I'm not talking about some bad rogue. Damage Change just makes it to where if you can't OHKO it, you risk losing something or getting damage on something huge. When I play m Mewtwo EX, the only time I wasn't able to damage change was because I didn't have Shrine available to me but I've never seen a time to where there was the right time to use it. If I had enough damage on me to be KO'ed in the next hit, then I used Damage Change. Any other time its just knowing how to manage damage output. No need to damage change 40 damage but this is the difference between a good and bad mewtwo player.

For my build, I hardly have issues getting energy down and running 4 puzzles means I can at least recover mega turbo and DCE when needed. I think people underestimate m Mewtwo Ex's bulk and what a Damage Change Lysandre play can mean. You really do need a specialized deck to effectively play against Mewtwo EX or you can just play mega ray and rainbow road.
 
thegrovylekid said:
One thing people seem to forget when discussing M Mewtwo vs M Scizor is that you lose to the basic Mewtwo with Damage change. Not through Shrine of Memories, but just loading up the basic Mewtwo by itself can wreck M Scizor.
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We have pokemon ranger.
 
While playtesting Waterbox i've battled around 37 Mega Mewtwo/Garbodor decks. i won 26 of those matches (most of them where decent to good in terms of skill)

It really depends on what deck your running and if you have a good start. but in my opinion the way to beating Mega mewtwo is dropping the abilities you need as fast as you can before garbodor shows up. or spam the ever living crap out of Lysandre to get rid of Garbodor.
Both methods work depending on the deck and start. maybe im just lucky that Waterbox isn't as dependant on Shaymin as some other decks are (or on abilities in general) again,, i might be really wrong with this as im no genius when it comes to beating metagame decks so take these statements with a grain of salt i guess XD


just wanted to give my two cents on the subject~
 
Robin Aisaga said:
Not sure what you mean but, Pokémon Ranger does not remove Damage Counters or Special Conditions that were the effect of an attack. Those are excluded.
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I thought it was like Hex Maniac, but I am very wrong in that. I haven't play tested him yet so I am very stupid.
 
mordacazir said:
I thought it was like Hex Maniac, but I am very wrong in that. I haven't play tested him yet so I am very stupid.
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Don't get upset... Pokémon Ranger has a vague desciption and it confuses a lot of players. They could've explained it more explicit on the card itself. There are other ways to stop Damage Change though. Twisted Spoon and Wonder Energy block the effects of attacks for example.
 
Robin Aisaga said:
Don't get upset... Pokémon Ranger has a vague desciption and it confuses a lot of players. They could've explained it more explicit on the card itself. There are other ways to stop Damage Change though. Twisted Spoon and Wonder Energy block the effects of attacks for example.
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I'm not upset:D. I am probably going to play M gardevoir, because it got a lot of good matchups.
 
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