Pokemon Ice Types - Weaker Than Ever

[Blob55]

One of my favourite types is now worse than a Caterpie in a Volcano! I for one won't stand for it and I think GF have taken it too far introducing the Fairy type.

Instead of making the Fairy type, they instead could of:
1. Made Ice type resistant to the types it's Super Effective against.
2. Made Ice type more common in Kalos.
3. Created more Dragon types that are 4x weak against Ice types.

As you can see, there are plenty of ways to make Dragon types less OP, all without making a new type.

One day (probably late 6th gen) GF will see the error of their ways and I want them to see it sooner.

 

[Scattered mind]

I hate that too. Its really funny that ice type moves are much better with other pokemon types. Ice beam is one of the best moves in the game

but still im very happy with the fairy type . Poison and ghost got more power so its not too late for grass and ice getting a boost maybe in the next gen

 

[Pokequaza]

One of my favourite types is now worse than a Caterpie in a Volcano! I for one won't stand for it and I think GF have taken it too far introducing the Fairy type.

Now? Nothing has changed concerning the Ice type, it's still the same.

Instead of making the Fairy type, they instead could of:
1. Made Ice type resistant to the types it's Super Effective against.
2. Made Ice type more common in Kalos.
3. Created more Dragon types that are 4x weak against Ice types.

Making Ice types more common isn't going to make them stronger, it's just going to create.. more Ice types..? Neither is creating more Pokémon that take 4x damage from Ice, you can easily use another Pokémon with, for example, Ice Beam to do the job.

As you can see, there are plenty of ways to make Dragon types less OP, all without making a new type.

One day (probably late 6th gen) GF will see the error of their ways and I want them to see it sooner.

It's not an error. The type system Pokémon uses for their game is complex, and bound to create inconsistencies. There is always going to be a ''better'' type, or Pokémon. I never found them ''weak'', STAB Ice Beam is worth the risk, besides, how often do you see Steel-type moves? Fire is quite uncommon as well, and Rock is usually paired with Ground. Perhaps it's just Fighting that poses a problem, but every type has got to have their weaknesses.

 

[Turtwig]

It's not an error. The type system Pokémon uses for their game is complex, and bound to create inconsistencies. There is always going to be a ''better'' type, or Pokémon. I never found them ''weak'', STAB Ice Beam is worth the risk, besides, how often do you see Steel-type moves? Fire is quite uncommon as well, and Rock is usually paired with Ground. Perhaps it's just Fighting that poses a problem, but every type has got to have their weaknesses.

While I agree that the type system will never actually be balanced, I disagree with the last few points. Fire is quiet common offensively. A number of even Electric-types can learn Flamethrower or Overheat. Now with Fairy-types being weak to steel, it will have a more offensive presence as well. Though at the moment only Scizor abuses it. Rock isn't always paired with ground, and a lot of ground-types learn rock-type moves just for this reason. Competitively, Stealth Rock is enough to already weaken most Ice-types. Fighting is going to be weakened a little this generation, so that may not be a problem.

I hate that too. Its really funny that ice type moves are much better with other pokemon types. Ice beam is one of the best moves in the game

but still im very happy with the fairy type . Poison and ghost got more power so its not too late for grass and ice getting a boost maybe in the next gen

Don't worry, Grass-types are immune to Spore and powder moves now!

 

[Pokequaza]

While I agree that the type system will never actually be balanced, I disagree with the last few points. Fire is quiet common offensively. A number of even Electric-types can learn Flamethrower or Overheat. Now with Fairy-types being weak to steel, it will have a more offensive presence as well. Though at the moment only Scizor abuses it. Rock isn't always paired with ground, and a lot of ground-types learn rock-type moves just for this reason. Competitively, Stealth Rock is enough to already weaken most Ice-types. Fighting is going to be weakened a little this generation, so that may not be a problem.

I was mainly talking about the regular gameplay.

 

[Mitja]

Gamefreak hadn't touched the type chart even slightly in 4 generations. Now they do so by adding a new type, but also actually take the opportunity and make 2 little interesting changes to the rest by nerfing the completely defensively OP Steel type a bit (I would have added an Electric weakness first, then got rid of maybe one of those two resistances, not both....Ghost and Dark are like twins offensively anyway..).

I have a feeling the odds for them doing anything to the type chart gen 7 are close to zero ):

I don't understand whats up with this. I mean, I don't believe they didn't see the lack of defense for Ice compared to anything else..but then why wouldn't they do the very least?
Like, it would have been as simple as throwing a common sense Ground and Water resistance on them, and it wouldn't be so way below the rest anymore, but quite close to Rock (although Rock also has a nice weather buff..)

Maybe its because there aren't really any bulky Ice types to make the flaw obvious?
But there were some already:
-Articuno (talk about horrible weaknesses, with practically nothing it can switch into safely)
-Regice (Regirock is the second worst defensive type, so they both complain down in NU with their wasted concept of unbreakable defenses, while Registeel chills 2 tiers higher)
-Glaceon (110 def, what a waste of stats Q_Q, not the case on Vaporeon or Umbreon..)
-Frost Rotom (guess whos the shittiest of Rotoms formes)
-Cloyster (Water helps, but still never a problem taking this thing down... its used as a set-up sweeper because its actually some use that way)
-Cryogonal (the Sp.Def doesnt matter when any physical hit will break you into hundred pieces so this might not be a good example of a defensive pokemon either)

..
But then we see Fire gain a SIXTH resistance instead (even though it has one less weakness than Ice)

Maybe because the Fire types are pretty much all offensively oriented?

But then Ice would also deserve buffs for the same reason, so that doesn't make sense either lol.

Idk.

 

[WanderingWolf]

Fire is quite uncommon as well

Stepping in to say that 1 in 5 pokemon is fire.

(Well, the first 649 count that)

 

[Pokequaza]

Fire is quite uncommon as well

Stepping in to say that 1 in 5 pokemon is fire.

(Well, the first 649 count that)

Well done..

As of generation 5, 48 Fire Pokémon exist, 7.40% of all Pokémon. 15 of them are starter Pokémon, 5 are legendary. 4.31% are regular Fire types, which is below the average (5.88%). Again, Blob55 was talking about the regular gameplay, and so did I.

 

[PMJ]

Ice types cant be weaker than ever because nothing was changed in regards to its type. nothing newly resists it and it has no new weaknesses. there has to be a bottom and sometimes it's your favorite type. no sense crying about it and the only thing your suggested changes will do is ensure 80% of the kalos dex is taken out by heatran and/or scizor

 

[Turtwig]

Gamefreak hadn't touched the type chart even slightly in 4 generations. Now they do so by adding a new type, but also actually take the opportunity and make 2 little interesting changes to the rest by nerfing the completely defensively OP Steel type a bit (I would have added an Electric weakness first, then got rid of maybe one of those two resistances, not both....Ghost and Dark are like twins offensively anyway..).

I do agree that getting rid of both is kind of nerfing Steel, though an electric weakness I'm not sure. In the real world, steel conducts electricity, so it's more of a helper to electric than crippled by it. You probably know this and you're just saying you'd expect this first, but I'm just explaining why it's not.

 

[PMJ]

Also consider that Dragon is still weak to Ice and Ice/Electric is still great offensive coverage. Yes defensively Ice is a jank type but offensively it is one of the best.

 

[zappy800]

They should just give all future ice types the potential to be glass cannons it would stop people from complaining slightly more.

 

[98Greener]

So, Ice is basically super fragile....but it has a great offense....
Hey, its gotta be balanced somehow.

 

[ImBlue]

All I wanted was a resistance. It could have been flying, dragon, water, grass; I don't care. But nope!

 

[Matty]

Yeah, they seriously need to fix Ice-types. I believe the answers are: more resistances and buff/debuff moves.

For example;
"Ice Prison" is a frozen status move (Yeah, a frozen status move may sounds OPed but Ice-types have a lot of weaknesses which should be okay. In addition, Fire-types can't be frozen obviously).
"Benumb" it decrease the opponent's HP every turn.
"Heat Loss" it makes the opponents' lose their PPs every turn.
and so on.

 

[Turtwig]

All I wanted was a resistance. It could have been flying, dragon, water, grass; I don't care. But nope!

Not Grass! Grass is already resisted by the most (at seven I think) D: Nerf Water. But seriously, I think Ice is still a great offensive type and it balances well with its rather lacking defensive qualities. I mean, it's the only type 4x super effective against the common Dragon/Flying or Dragon/Ground Pokemon. That has to count for something, right?

 

[Snowy]

Ice is a great typing for offense, but just fragile and brittle like in real life. Giving it a resistance would be nice, but GF can only do so much. Even though Ice is "weak" and "inferior" compared to other types in competitive battling, doesn't mean it still isn't viable. I mean IceBeam is a great move. Pair it up with ThunderBolt and you have the infamous BoltBeam. Ice type moves are not terrible and with Ice pokemon having great offensive power, STAB IceBeams are going to make a dent. Especially from a Modest SpecsGlaceon. Also, many Ice pokemon are not too fast. This can be fixed by making a TrickRoom team or using IceShard as a nice RevengeKiller - Mamoswine. All those dragons with 4x weakness dragons would not want to take a CB IceShard from Mamoswine. I just like to have fun and not taking battling so seriously. It is just a game... That's why I run a mono-Ice stall team. (I love BlizzSpam). As for me, I wish they helped Ice types more this generation, but just be happy they came out with a new game with new game mechanics. Maybe they will help it out in future generations. Only time will tell.

Spoiler

Auto-Freeze move would be nice... <3

 

[Mitja]

I do agree that getting rid of both is kind of nerfing Steel, though an electric weakness I'm not sure. In the real world, steel conducts electricity, so it's more of a helper to electric than crippled by it. You probably know this and you're just saying you'd expect this first, but I'm just explaining why it's not.

Water conducts electricity. Flying around the sky makes an easy target, so does attracting electricity.
I mean if those two make sense, Steel does too for me.
Also notice that Electric is already resisting Steel for some reason.

Also consider that Dragon is still weak to Ice and Ice/Electric is still great offensive coverage. Yes defensively Ice is a jank type but offensively it is one of the best.

So, Ice is basically super fragile....but it has a great offense....
Hey, its gotta be balanced somehow.

That's not balanced. Defense is tied to the Pokemon, offense is NOT.

All this results in is Water types and the like using Ice MOVES for awesome coverage, while any "defensive Ice Pokemon" turns out to be a joke because it doesn't work.

Ice types cant be weaker than ever because nothing was changed in regards to its type. nothing newly resists it and it has no new weaknesses. there has to be a bottom and sometimes it's your favorite type.

But I've been waiting for Ice specifically to get changed because it has always been awful. It's not that it simply happens to be at the bottom, it's the fact that it is several steps below the next worst.
I mean, if it got 2 resistances, it would still be the worst, just not to the point where its always a hinderance for a pokemon more than anything else.

Also, something DID change for Ice. Apart from its 3 very common weaknesses (Rock/Fire/Fighting), at least the fourth wasn't used much, but now with the advent of Fairy, Steel-moves will become more common, hence Ice being even worse off than it already was.

 

[Turtwig]

Water conducts electricity. Flying around the sky makes an easy target, so does attracting electricity.
I mean if those two make sense, Steel does too for me.
Also notice that Electric is already resisting Steel for some reason.

But what happens to the ocean life inside that water? Water is not the thing; it's just a characterization. Most Water-types live in the water, where electrical surges affect everything. That is why Electric is advantageous.

 

[Pokequaza]

Also consider that Dragon is still weak to Ice and Ice/Electric is still great offensive coverage. Yes defensively Ice is a jank type but offensively it is one of the best.

So, Ice is basically super fragile....but it has a great offense....
Hey, its gotta be balanced somehow.

That's not balanced. Defense is tied to the Pokemon, offense is NOT.

All this results in is Water types and the like using Ice MOVES for awesome coverage, while any "defensive Ice Pokemon" turns out to be a joke because it doesn't work.

Offense is as well tied to the Pokémon; STAB, you cannot just overlook a 50% boost in attack power. True, Ice moves can be used by numerous Pokémon, but Ice Pokémon can utilise them a lot better. Defensively it isn't great, but I don't really care.

I guess I would make sense if it resisted Normal, and Water as well, and dealt neutral damage to Water. Ice seems more powerful than Water in your average game world, it's always ice that freezes water, almost never the other way around, even though that isn't guaranteed in real life. So I guess that would make sense.