Is It Too Late to Save the Earth from Climate Change?

[Card Slinger J]

The World's Governments have been too busy trying to fix the Global Economy yet there's another important issue that needs to be resolved before it's too late and that's to try to curb climate change. If we keep allowing countries like China and the U.S. to pollute the planet to the nth degree then we could be leaving behind a huge burden on our children and grandchildren. It would be sort of like what happened during the last Ice Age where the landscape changed and such.

If we wait any longer the problem is only going to get worse (we waited for like a decade and it's already gotten much worse) and I think part of the problem is the U.S. and other countries have been too distracted from foreign political affairs with the War on Terror and fixing the Global Economy. Those issues are important to resolve too but helping to curb Climate Change or as some people call it Global Warming needs to be resolved too and fast. We must take action now I don't know why we spent 10 years doing nothing.

What do you guys think? Discuss.

 

[Rusty Sticks]

If the government is so conflicted about climate change, let them deal with it. We can help our environment simply by doing those daily things like recycling and throwing away only the trash that should be thrown away. If the government wants to spend billions of dollars on solar panels and all that crap let them deal with it.

And besides, in the long run, it won't matter anyway. We'll all be dead and won't have the issues of experiencing the world we are leaving future generations

LIVE YOUR LIFE WHILE YOU STILL CAN.

/end controversial rant

EDIT: if any of my statements have displeased you, please refer to my avatar for guidance on how to deal with this matter

 

[brOkenice]

Slick u so cray-zee.

Well, I see that people don't care. For whatever reason. And the Government. They can't make money off of a clean environment.
What really needs to be taken care are critical diseases that's killing more people and more people.

 

[Rusty Sticks]

What really needs to be taken care are critical diseases that's killing more people and more people.

^This

I'd rather cure cancer and AIDS than have a clean environment.

 

[Card Slinger J]

The thing is the U.S. is already doing what it can do to curb against climate change despite contributing to the problem, it's the other greenhouse gas polluting countries being China and India and If we can persuade them to switch to a different cleaner alternative then the better off we will be. It's been several years and both countries haven't even done their part on this regardless of the United Nations speech regarding the issue of climate change.

This is a problem that has been haunting us since the 1970's, nowadays the problem is staring right infront of us and yet we sit back and watch as the Government isn't doing their part on the matter and I think that problem also ties to money issues and with the state of the Global Economy we are unable to invest in technology that can save this planet. We have some technologies that are successful in helping to curb the problem, they are probably less expensive.

I feel bad for future generations in regards to climate change but it seems like financial slavery is preventing us from reaching out further on this issue especially for helping out the poor and homeless in Africa and other Third World Countries. The key is to make sure the money being donated to charities isn't swindled for personal greed like what happened with Hurricane Katrina in 2005. That could be what is holding back some people from reaching out to the poor and needy, I know for a fact this is part of the problem.

 

[Inigo Montoya]

No, the real thing is this. What caused the melting of the Ice Age? Did the mammoths and saber toothed tigers have big old SUVs and factories that produced greenhouse gases that made the climate warmer? No, they didn't. This is a natural function for the Earth to go through. It has been slowly warming up since the peak of the Ice Age and will not stop until we peak at the other end of the scale. Then it will eventually cool down again, hit another cold steak and just repeat again and again. While we may be accelerating the process a bit, you need to understand that this process has been going on for thousands, maybe ten thousands or even hundreds of thousands of years. It would've inevitably happened anyway without our intervention. No matter how much we try, you just can't stop Global Warming.

 

[Zenith]

warning harsh post ahead weeoo weeoo

jesus christ do any of you know anything about climate change at all ever

it's like "once i read an article about climate change on cnn.com so i am now an expert"

please read a book about climate change before you guys post stupid things like the following:

If the government is so conflicted about climate change, let them deal with it. We can help our environment simply by doing those daily things like recycling and throwing away only the trash that should be thrown away. If the government wants to spend billions of dollars on solar panels and all that crap let them deal with it.

And besides, in the long run, it won't matter anyway. We'll all be dead and won't have the issues of experiencing the world we are leaving future generations

2050 is probably about when we'll have to deal with this, if you want to drink yourself to death by then or something have fun

(also recycling uses too much energy to be truly efficient, solar panels are much more useful in general)

I'd rather cure cancer and AIDS than have a clean environment.

i don't even know how to respond to this it's just too stupid

The thing is the U.S. is already doing what it can do to curb against climate change despite contributing to the problem, it's the other greenhouse gas polluting countries being China and India and If we can persuade them to switch to a different cleaner alternative then the better off we will be.

because the us loves to support clean energy and doesn't use too much oil and natural gas or anything

while the developing countries are issues too (except for brazil, which has the advantage of easy hydroelectric power) trying to claim that the us is doing what it can do is unfortunately hopelessly naive

The key is to make sure the money being donated to charities isn't swindled for personal greed like what happened with Hurricane Katrina in 2005.

fun fact: hurricane katrina was as bad as it was due to climate change

No, the real thing is this. What caused the melting of the Ice Age? Did the mammoths and saber toothed tigers have big old SUVs and factories that produced greenhouse gases that made the climate warmer? No, they didn't. This is a natural function for the Earth to go through. It has been slowly warming up since the peak of the Ice Age and will not stop until we peak at the other end of the scale. Then it will eventually cool down again, hit another cold steak and just repeat again and again. While we may be accelerating the process a bit, you need to understand that this process has been going on for thousands, maybe ten thousands or even hundreds of thousands of years. It would've inevitably happened anyway without our intervention. No matter how much we try, you just can't stop Global Warming.

this is an uninformed argument i see all the time. yes, the earth's climate is cyclical. no, the current climate change isn't natural. as much as we'd like to believe. deal with it.

recommended book for all of you: Hot, Flat, and Crowded by Thomas L. Friedman (Laurence C. Smith's The World in 2050 is good too)

(i probably won't change any minds with this post, and i certainly won't convince card slinger j of anything, but i figured i would try because this is actually something i know about due to my choice in college major)

(also to respond to the original question it's probably too late to stop it but we can cushion its effect)

 

[doublenikesocks]

We don't even know that climate change is real. Evidence proves that the Earth's temperature and climate changes about every 4000 years and it's been about 3500 years since that last major change, thus we could just be entering another change. Al Gore has just made it seem like a big deal because he wants money, and he also wants people to support him and make him feel like an important person. Climate change is not definite yet, and hurricanes are not even evidence for climate change. I recently read a book about hurricanes and climate, and another book about climate change in general. The hurricane book I read cited the reasons for increased hurricane activity as: "increased sea surface temperatures due to the Atlantic Multidecal Cycle, decreased vertical wind shear (which by the way, has nothing to due with temperature/climate,) and La Nina." The climate book I read listed only warming appearing in large cities. That warming is caused by the effect of skyscrapers not allowing heat to rise and increased asphalt coverage. The book actually says that many other places around the globe are cooling, due to the mini ice age. Zenith, you may be mixing up city temperature rise with global temperature rise. Thay are not connected in any way.

 

[Cris]

it's like "once i read an article about climate change on cnn.com so i am now an expert"

Hahahah that's so true!

(also to respond to the original question it's probably too late to stop it but we can cushion its effect)

I disagree with this, and so do many climatological scientists. Have you read the book "Earth: The Operators Manual"? I recommend it to anyone interested in this kind of stuff (or if you're to lazy to read it, you can always watch the the documentary they have on PBS (It's not as good as the book though)). It gives really good insight on climate change and sustainable energy. They mentioned a mentioned how it's not too late to control climate change due to the fact that there are way the sun provides with more than enough energy to power the world.

Fun Fact: If we were to set up power plants that used solar panels to get energy across the deserts of the American Southwest, we would get enough power from them to meet the U.S's growing energy demands and we would still have plent left over.

Fun Fact 2: If we set up power plants that used solar panels to get energy across the Sahara desert, we would have enough energy to power the entire world and we would still have plenty left over.

because the us loves to support clean energy and doesn't use too much oil and natural gas or anything

You can't just blame this on the U.S governement. The oil companies influence politicians all the time by bribing them with money that could go towards their election campaigns, etc and in return they have to listen to them. They are always involved in politics making sure they get their way.

fun fact: hurricane katrina was as bad as it was due to climate change

I'll back you up on this one Zenith because rising climate temps. have led to an increase in the sea-surface temp. which has been one of the reasons why hurricanes have gained so much force and seem stronger. The flooding we are seeing in Thialand and Columbia is also due to climate destabilization. The rate of evaporation of ocean water has been significantly increased due to the rising sea-surface temps. which has been causing more precipatiation cerian areas. Thus this all shows climate destabilzation is disturbing the hydrologic cycle.

We don't even know that climate change is real. Evidence proves that the Earth's temperature and climate changes about every 4000 years and it's been about 3500 years since that last major change, thus we could just be entering another change. Al Gore has just made it seem like a big deal because he wants money, and he also wants people to support him and make him feel like an important person. Climate change is not definite yet, and hurricanes are not even evidence for climate change. I recently read a book about hurricanes and climate, and another book about climate change in general. The hurricane book I read cited the reasons for increased hurricane activity as: "increased sea surface temperatures due to the Atlantic Multidecal Cycle, decreased vertical wind shear (which by the way, has nothing to due with temperature/climate,) and La Nina." The climate book I read listed only warming appearing in large cities. That warming is caused by the effect of skyscrapers not allowing heat to rise and increased asphalt coverage. The book actually says that many other places around the globe are cooling, due to the mini ice age. Zenith, you may be mixing up city temperature rise with global temperature rise. Thay are not connected in any way.

I honestly think there is enough evidence that suggests that climate destabilization is real. Rising climatic temps., disturbances in the hydrologic cycle, studies showing increases in the amounts of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere due to anthropogenic activities, increased intensity of natural disasters (i.e hurricanes), etc so yeah...

 

[Zyflair]

This video shows that climate change problems should be low priority, if a priority at all.
Language warning
[video=youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5Miv4NHsDo&feature=related[/video]

 

[Zenith]

I disagree with this, and so do many climatological scientists. Have you read the book "Earth: The Operators Manual"? I recommend it to anyone interested in this kind of stuff (or if you're to lazy to read it, you can always watch the the documentary they have on PBS (It's not as good as the book though)). It gives really good insight on climate change and sustainable energy. They mentioned a mentioned how it's not too late to control climate change due to the fact that there are way the sun provides with more than enough energy to power the world.

i'll look for it if i get the chance, it's a recent release so i don't know how easily i'll be able to read it. i never said that climate change was uncontrollable, though, only that we've sped it up so much that no matter what we do this cycle will continue to be terrible.

You can't just blame this on the U.S governement. The oil companies influence politicians all the time by bribing them with money that could go towards their election campaigns, etc and in return they have to listen to them. They are always involved in politics making sure they get their way.

i am a geography major, but my focus is geopolitics. bribery != politics. i understand that the us government receives a lot of money from oil companies - i'm not stupid. but the whole is to not accept it. honestly, we could probably last without the oil companies - but the oil companies need us. eventually, other countries are going to realize that this whole oil thing is kind of stupid.

but anyway "don't blame the us government they're being bribed" is not a good argument

honestly, though, i'm just glad there's someone else in this thread who actually knows what they're talking about.

Zenith, you may be mixing up city temperature rise with global temperature rise. Thay are not connected in any way.

i...huh? what? that makes no sense. when did i say anything about temperature?

 

[Delta]

"And the electricity bills a fortune now they're saying save the planet, save the planet and all this sorta stuff. I'm lovin this shit they're coming up with. The Americans driving about in 4 by 4 humvee's, Las Vegas lit up like a christmas tree every night but if I switch of that little standby button on my TEEVEE...
Suddenly it's our fault...we gotta do something about it and y'know we gotta do something about it. You got all these leaders from all these countries jumping on jumbo jet planes and landing and in choffuer driven cars to meetings to try determin whats fucked up the planet and I get a letter from the coucil the other day TURNS OUT iiiit's me."

- Lee Evans live at the O2 has fixed all your problems.
Watching comedians tear apart the goverment is hilarious. Lee Evans, Bill Hicks and just about every other comic out there has had a stab at it and they have all been right.

 

[Chillarmy]

I feel this isn't an issue... at all. The Earth is simply going through its natural cycle. We may be speeding up the process slightly, but us preventing climate change is like an ant lifting an elephant. With one hand.

 

[Card Slinger J]

Since when did George Carlin do that skit? Back in the 90's I presume. If that's the case times have changed ALOT since then. Over the course of the 21st Century up to now the U.S. has been hit by a barrage of Category 3-4 Hurricanes that have shattered Guinness World Records with Katrina being the costliest, There has been at least 2-3 major Earthquakes that were Magnitude 8-9 being with Japan, Chile, and Haiti, a devastating Tsunami in Indonesia that almost shifted the planet's axis in 2004, the list goes on and on.

Us humans are selfish beings, we only see the world through our eyes here and now. Those that lived before me and you thought their time on Earth was the most important time just like us. If you think Climate Change is really a surprise concerning the weather then you are allowing yourself to be played. No Scientist(s) can actually tell us what quantity of emissions (produced by man or nature) would be necessary to cause a climate shift with any legitimacy. Sure they can try but 9/10 times they just show current climate concerns with some cool math and timelines as examples for why they are right.

Unfortunately history has shown us that not only does our climate normally cycle but its been way worse in the past even before humans were around AND before we were industrialized. Research gothic architecture and reasons for it. Check the River Thames. Those are some examples of extreme weather related topics that show weather is not something that can be controlled by humans and shows cycles of extreme weather before humans were driving around pushing 20+ billion tons of CO2 into the air a year affecting the planet's Ozone Layer and such. There's no denying we play a part.

 

[Zyflair]

Since when did George Carlin do that skit? Back in the 90's I presume. If that's the case times have changed ALOT since then. Over the course of the 21st Century up to now the U.S. has been hit by a barrage of Category 3-4 Hurricanes that have shattered Guinness World Records with Katrina being the costliest, There has been at least 2-3 major Earthquakes that were Magnitude 8-9 being with Japan, Chile, and Haiti, a devastating Tsunami in Indonesia that almost shifted the planet's axis in 2004, the list goes on and on.

Though I can not deny that global warming has played a part in the hurricanes, you're spouting nonsense with the earthquakes. The seismic activity in those areas were due given the time period where they haven't acted up. Bringing those incidents up has nothing to to with the argument.

But really, if you think about it, why should we bother with fixing climate change? To save the Earth? As if. To save ourselves? You can't convince a population of this size to work to capping carbon emissions if they take everything for granted. To draw a comparison, Americans wasted 33 million tons of food in 2008, which, if you look on relative terms from food wasted per person, is insanely ridiculous to many countries, especially developing nations (surprise surprise). Americans don't see why they should wisely... for the lack of any good word - utilize all the food they purchase, because they don't see anything consequential coming out of it. Likewise, a typical American wouldn't converse electricity or use it efficiently if all it meant were just a few bucks difference on their bill. Humans are "selfish," as you put it. They're more short-sighted.

 

[Noobnerd]

Are you guys kidding me? You're actually buying the view George Carlin presented? I think it's kinda extreme :/

Edit: I mean, he's a comedian. Why are we even introducing these kind of videos into a debate thread? Not directed at anyone in particular (you know I love you Zyflair) but really...

Nevertheless, on another note, this video by him is great: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALf2HZsGtGQ

 

[Storywriter]

I'd like to introduce you to a planet named Venus. Now, Venus is a place similar in size to Earth, but it's very, very hot. Extensive research has shown that the source of this heat is the immense amount of greenhouse gas on Venus. We have a really great model right next to us that shows us exactly what could happen if we let this get out of control.

Sure, Earth has cycles, ice ages and warmer periods, but at this point even some of the most hardened skeptics are starting to acknowledge that yes, we virii (humans) have something to do with this particular heating cycle. We waste immense amounts of energy and pump tons of toxic chemicals and gases into the environment and atmosphere daily. Why? Convenience, Apathy, and Ignorance sums it up pretty well.

It's great to make an effort to change, and little by little the world may becoming marginally more "green", but people and small communities here and there are not going to have a huge impact. We would need a global revolution to reverse the damage we've done, millions of people working to make a difference, and that's simply not going to happen. Humans are lazy and prefer to blindly follow the path of least resistance instead of making an effort to do anything. The problem is compounded by oil and other fossil fuel tycoons paying off the government and sabotaging alt. energy efforts - I have met engineers who have had threats and attempts made on their lives and their families if they patented ideas and devices that could have threatened the livelihood of fossil fuels.

Is it too late? Yeah, probably. The damage has been done, and we're already starting to see some of the consequences - look at the rise in hurricane activity.

 

[Zyflair]

You're actually buying the view George Carlin presented?

I wouldn't use the word "buying." Comedians like Carlin aren't trying to "seriously" press a topic, but they offer insights that one wouldn't normally think of. One of the best points from Carlin is that the environmentalist approach isn't a goal to save "the world," but ourselves.

 

[Noobnerd]

Oh okay. I just found it a tad too offensive to people who do care for the environment. I'm not one though. :x

get all the "green people" to make a second Singapore out of NYC and then I'll listen to you.

Wait a minute. I'm Singaporean, and I totally don't understand what you said there.

 

[Cars4ME]

Love that George Carlin skit, I don't care when he did it, his points are still valid. Yes we are polluting the world, but the world will be here long after we are gone. The only thing we are polluting are ourselves, the earth will carry on...