Discussion Jolteon EX

LightningCloud224

LightningCloud224

Aspiring Trainer
Member
This seems like a deliberate attempt to push us back into evolution, mega and Archie/Maxie decks. At least with pyroar it was an ability that could be disabled. What do you think this will do to the metagame?

Jolteon-EX – Lightning – 160 HP
Basic

[L] Swift: 30 damage. This attack’s damage isn’t affected by Weakness, Resistance, or any other effects on your opponent’s Active Pokémon.

[L][C][C] Flash Ray: 70 damage. During your opponent’s next turn, prevent all damage done to this Pokémon by attacks from Basic Pokémon.

Pokémon-EX rule: When a Pokémon-EX has been Knocked Out, your opponent takes 2 Prize cards.

Weakness: Fighting ×2
Resistance: Metal -20
Retreat Cost: 0
 
The way I see it, it will either be really good or decent(I thought the same about Toad and look what happened, especially at states). It has a good damage output, weakness on Yveltal, and it beats EXs, but it loses to almost all stage 1 or 2 decks. The most popular stage 1 deck is Vespiquen, which you will always lose the prize trade. Also, Megas and a things and it's going to have a hard time doing anything against them. I could see something like Toad/Jolteon/Garb with disruption, but for now, it could go either way. One last thing, Manectric is better. It has a better energy cost, more damage, more HP, and they both have the same function. BatMan beats almost all basic decks, losing only to Lucario/Bats(Entei/Zard is questionable because you can Assault Vest/Parallel City to make them do 60 less). If there's a lot of Lucario/Bats, then just play Yveltal. But, I could be wrong and there may be something I overlooked, but those are just my thoughts.
 
The new Jolteon-EX gives me mixed feelings about Archeops in future Expanded tournaments. If you manage to get a Turn 1 Archeops and set up Jolteon's attack, that's a essentially an auto-win unless you run Maxie or Wobuffett/Hex Maniac w/ evolutions. Otherwise, evolutions, energy disruption, and specialized attackers become more necessary.
 
Sabaku said:
The new Jolteon-EX gives me mixed feelings about Archeops in future Expanded tournaments. If you manage to get a Turn 1 Archeops and set up Jolteon's attack, that's a essentially an auto-win unless you run Maxie or Wobuffett/Hex Maniac w/ evolutions. Otherwise, evolutions, energy disruption, and specialized attackers become more necessary.
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For ways to get around Archeops, Wally and Evosoda(don't run Evosoda) exist. Also we've had Pyroar/Archeops for over a year and nobody has done really well with it.
 
Sabaku said:
The new Jolteon-EX gives me mixed feelings about Archeops in future Expanded tournaments. If you manage to get a Turn 1 Archeops and set up Jolteon's attack, that's a essentially an auto-win unless you run Maxie or Wobuffett/Hex Maniac w/ evolutions. Otherwise, evolutions, energy disruption, and specialized attackers become more necessary.
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You can add Garbotoxin + Evolutions to the list of Jolteon-EX auto-win deniers...

Also, Tyrantrum-EX(in no-Garbotoxin situations only)can bypass Jolteon's Flash Ray for 190 damage, and two prizes...

Enough said...

EDIT: Also, we have Greninja BREAK and its Moonlight Slash attack(Archie's Ninja + Wally)... When combined w/ one Giant Water Shuriken plus one regular Water Shuriken(or even one GWS plus a Muscle Band), and one dropped energy to do an added 20 on top of base 60(which is 10 more than needed to KO in the former of the mentioned conditions, and exactly the number needed to KO in the latter of the mentioned conditions(which are: one Giant Water Shuriken, a MB, and a Moonlight Slash use after energy discard to add 20 more on top of base 60 + 20(from MB)), bye bye, Jolteon-EX(and Pyroar)...
 
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cardgjammer said:
You can add Garbotoxin + Evolutions to the list of Jolteon-EX auto-win deniers...

Also, Tyrantrum-EX(in no-Garbotoxin situations only)can bypass Jolteon's Flash Ray for 190 damage, and two prizes...

Enough said...

EDIT: Also, we have Greninja BREAK and its Moonlight Slash attack... When combined w/ one Giant Water Shuriken and one regular Water Shuriken, and one dropped energy to do an added 20 on top of base 60(which is 10 more than needed to KO in the aforementioned conditions), bye bye, Jolteon-EX(and Pyroar)...
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Great point on Tyrantrum-EX. That though is a specialty attacker. You pretty much have to build a deck around the card to swing more than once in a match viably.
 
It has an attack that negates damage from Basics, an attack-triggered(not ability-triggered) version of Pyroar's Intimidating Mane ability, and attack-triggered means Hex Maniac can't save Night March decks from Flash Ray... Unless the Night Marchers pack Maxie's Gallade to counter Jolteon-EX and prevent a possible auto-loss to Jolteon-EX, once Jolteon is fully charged, the only pokemon that can hurt it would be bronzong and vespiquen, and if Jolteon-EX has FFB attached, it will take Bee Revenge + 18 discarded pokemon to 1HKO it, and on the contrary, Flash Ray does 70 base, so if FFB is attached, if a Bats line is used as well, bye bye NM: Since decks tend not to function as well if they need to ditch one too many critical Trainer/Energy cards to counter one major threat to the deck(One too many cards=20+ pokemon in most cases, while some decks can take a little bit more pokemon cards, a deck that contains more than 24-26 pokemon is most likely a deck that could use less pokemon and more trainers/energy for consistency), such as one that blocks basic pokemon damage, NM finally has a bane to its existence. Will it finally drag it down to tier 2? After the SPTs come to a close, it's likely we will know the answer to that. Until then...
 
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cardgjammer said:
You can add Garbotoxin + Evolutions to the list of Jolteon-EX auto-win deniers...

Also, Tyrantrum-EX(in no-Garbotoxin situations only)can bypass Jolteon's Flash Ray for 190 damage, and two prizes...

Enough said...

EDIT: Also, we have Greninja BREAK and its Moonlight Slash attack(Archie's Ninja + Wally)... When combined w/ one Giant Water Shuriken plus one regular Water Shuriken(or even one GWS plus a Muscle Band), and one dropped energy to do an added 20 on top of base 60(which is 10 more than needed to KO in the former of the mentioned conditions, and exactly the number needed to KO in the latter of the mentioned conditions(which are: one Giant Water Shuriken, a MB, and a Moonlight Slash use after energy discard to add 20 more on top of base 60 + 20(from MB)), bye bye, Jolteon-EX(and Pyroar)...
Click to expand...

Yeah, but here's the idea regarding Garbodor. The main point for Jolteon-EX is to get a turn 1 Archeops, so in the worst-case scenario, Garbotoxin is stopped due to not being able to evolve Trubbish.

NintendoAlian said:
For ways to get around Archeops, Wally and Evosoda(don't run Evosoda) exist. Also we've had Pyroar/Archeops for over a year and nobody has done really well with it.
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True, but the big differences between Pyroar and Jolteon-EX is that one of them doesn't get completely ruined by Garbotoxin and doesn't clash with Archeops.
 
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I don't think Jolteon-EX is going to be a central attacker in any deck. However, I think it will be an easy inclusion as a one-of or possibly two-of in M Manectric-EX builds, and maybe Magnezone as well. The Pyroar-like effect can seal plenty of matchups, including Seismitoad and Night March. The attack cost of LCC means it can be powered up with a Turbo Bolt and a manual attachment, just like Regice AOR. The big news here is that Jolteon-EX uses Lightning Energy rather than Water, so by replaying Regice with this card in M Manectric-EX decks, you only need to run one kind of Basic Energy. Flash Energy can remove Jolteon-EX's weakness, making forcing Garchomp to attach two Energy and use its second attack to KO it. Unlike Regice, it does not grant immunity to Mega Evolved Pokemon-EX, so the exact benefits and drawbacks of Jolteon will need to be weighed. Still, I think this card can function extremely well in any deck that runs Lightning Energy.
 
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This could be a deck with the help of another Eeveelution, the game ender himself, Umbreon EX. Jolteon/Umbreon/Maxie's Archeops/Faded Town would be very interesting. Granted, it is a lot to set up and a bit cumbersome to do so but I want to see it work, if there's any chance. Plus the only 4 Eeveelutions with promise at this point are (in order of playability): Flareon, Jolteon, Espeon, and Umbreon. For those who have no idea what Umbreon does, it does 70 for [D] [C] [C]. If this attack knocks out your opponent's active mega evolution pokemon, take 2 additional prize cards.
 
Jolteon EX and Archelops have really flipped the game a bit in expanded. I'm wondering how trainers our countering the decks?

Jolteon EX is currently at $100 a card. I figured, for those whom are not going to spend the money, this might be good shop talk.
 
Hex Maniac seems to be the obvious choice against that deck, to be honest. That and any form of denial/lock will hurt it pretty bad. I think decks like these are actually encouraging more strategic supporter play, which is really interesting.
 
bbninjas said:
Hex Maniac seems to be the obvious choice against that deck, to be honest. That and any form of denial/lock will hurt it pretty bad. I think decks like these are actually encouraging more strategic supporter play, which is really interesting.
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Doesn't Hex just kill the ability and not the effect of an attack? Wondering if I'm misunderstanding the card.

What about Archelops? Or is it just more of a first turn issue? Whomever goes first generally controls the game.
 
poke4trade said:
Doesn't Hex just kill the ability and not the effect of an attack? Wondering if I'm misunderstanding the card.

What about Archelops? Or is it just more of a first turn issue? Whomever goes first generally controls the game.
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You play Hex Maniac so that you can play evolutions that turn. Then, Jolteon's attack's effect does nothing because ideally you'd be attacking with an evolved Pokémon.
 
It's a decent one-of in Magnezone to use against decks that just aren't prepared to deal with it. It's a Pyroar that can't be turned off once it attacks, with 50 more HP and you don't have to evolve, so it's at least decent. I can't see it being splashed into anything other than Magnezone though. Oh, maybe Smeargle toolbox.
 
The fact that Jolteon EX is an EX card in Generations packs ($7-8 per pack in USD, $13+ per pack in CAD; if you're buying in Mythical Collection Boxes) really makes the cost painful. I don't pay for single cards to build competitive decks because tbh I don't have that kind of money, but I feel bad for the people that do. With it's new friend Glaceon EX giving it a potential deck partner, it's gonna be hella expensive.

On the flipside if you're lucky, pulling a Jolteon EX will pay for 2-3 of your Mythical Collection boxes, and you'll have some sweet full arts and pins to boot!
 
The price of the card is the only thing that it has going for it, I also know that both sides of the market is hurting to get their hands on the card, players and collectors combind. But to be legit jolteon is a dead card in a format where you will honestly see this for cards in deck per amount, especially with NM in standard

4 VS
4 puzzle of time
2 lysandre
2 escape rope

no, you play jolteon by itself in this format and think your a good player, your dead wrong.
 
So what Jolteon does is for 2 colourless and a lighting energy it does 70 damage and can't be attacked by basics next turn.
What this means Hex doesn't work on it. The only effective counter is Maxie's Gallade.
Is this the new meta?
 

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Looks good, but there are a few ways around it. Megas, shred type attacks (which this also has) and special conditions like sleep and paralysis. It's not foul proof, but it should at least cause trouble for big basic decks (which have been given an unnecessary boost with Max Elixer and Fighting Spirit Belt).
 
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