Finished Mafia XLIX: Fight for the Falls!

[PMJ]

Well what did you mean by "He is scum and should be lynched at once" then? Sarcasm?

Reading is hard, guys.[/camo]

 

[Lorde]

That was day one. It's not relevant anymore because I have brought forth information that proves he is innocent, but now you're all like 'well the result could be wrong guys' even though I said a page ago that I was told by the host that they are not.

Pretty sure I said that here, bud, scroll up.

We have host confirmation, aka absolute certainty.

I was referring to mentality. I don't go into games with that kind of mentality, ever. That was talking about reads, not results.

This is how you cover your ass so when you push the lynch of a townie and they flip town you can be like well guys sure it was possible he was town but it was also possible he was scum so I'm definitely not scum for pushing him.

I was naming a possibility. Despite you being seer and me being confident in that, if you're not everything you're saying is bullshit and you're collecting information for who you want to kill tonight. Skepticism is normal, and now I'm gonna get hanged for not obeying king PMJ's every word. Awesome.

Also, if the only thing Lord can do is serve as announcer, she is expendable so if she flips town then we are no worse off in terms of relevant night actions. I wanna see more claimz.

I can't argue that. Except I can in that I'm still a number. Any sort of town flip is bad because we still lose numbers...

 

[PMJ]

Pretty sure I said that here, bud, scroll up.

I know you said that, that is my argument against you. You should not be doubting me.

I was naming a possibility. Despite you being seer and me being confident in that,

I'm gonna stop you right there because if you are confident in me telling the truth then you should not be entertaining the idea of Robin being scum, even a little bit.

if you're not everything you're saying is bullshit and you're collecting information for who you want to kill tonight.

But wait, I thought you were confident in me? You don't sound very confident here.

Skepticism is normal,

Sure, but not when we have the host's word on something.

and now I'm gonna get hanged for not obeying king PMJ's every word. Awesome.

AtE, awesome. PS you are getting hanged because you are scum and for no reason other than that.

I can't argue that. Except I can in that I'm still a number. Any sort of town flip is bad because we still lose numbers...

That's true but you are scum of the earth so no worries about that today. Better tell your teammates to strongman block me tonight because otherwise I'll weed out the rest of you

 

[bbninjas]

@GekkisaiDaiNi Can you quote the exact words that Jade said to you and Camo, that said you were both town?

The question would imply that, because I was never too strong on your case. I may have thought it was the best but I wasn't sold you were scum. As for the bolded, I'm not sure what you mean. I don't think I ever operated under the BB is confoscum belief, at all.

You said here that you voted Jabberwock because "you considered me [bbninjas] scummy and Jabberwock sticking his neck out to defend me made Jabber look shady too". But you also say that "you were never too strong on the bbninjas case". If you were never 'too strong', then I don't see why you would assume that I'm scum and then based on that asssumption, proceed to read and vote Jabber as scummy. (This is also what I was referring to in the bolded question: What changed for you to originally entertain the probability that I was town, but then operate under the assumption that I'm scum).

Maybe Drac, but that's entirely based on jalap's actions. It may be based on him being afraid to be seen as scum (like the beginning of D1) and so he just stopped talking.

Then don't forget we had a Retributionist, which alone is a super strong role. All of that's stupidly powerful to all be town-sided.

Yeah, this is concerning me. I'm not sure whether to expect this game to be balanced, but I don't think Jade would let two lynchproofs slip. It is possible that one of them is town and is lying (probably Camo if anyone).

Are you able to put in-thread the original messages you posted?

This. I'm not sure why you wouldn't have volunteered this information freely, @Lord o da rings.

Don't lynch Robin Aisaga.

I'm not sure how Jade was planning on reinforcing your restriction, because this is a pretty legitimate get-around for that restriction, and it is obvious that you scanned Robin as innocent, without you actually claiming that.

 

[bbninjas]

I am really not following whatever discussion is happening between PMJ and Lorde, for the record.

@GekkisaiDaiNi
PMJ is a seer. He is not allowed to claim what his results were. He seer'd Robin. He is also telling us to not lynch Robin in very large text. I'd say he scanned Robin as innocent and is getting rather frustrated by people not noticing that. So, yes, he was being sarcastic about Robin being scum.

 

[Lorde]

I know you said that, that is my argument against you. You should not be doubting me.

You said I said that on D1, did you not?

I'm gonna stop you right there because if you are confident in me telling the truth then you should not be entertaining the idea of Robin being scum, even a little bit.

Get it through your thick skull: I don't think he is.

But wait, I thought you were confident in me? You don't sound very confident here.

Oh you know, never rule out a possibility. You're not confirmed town, so stop acting like it.

Sure, but not when we have the host's word on something.

You're not confotown the same way Camo and Gekki are. That means little, it's just a scum seer's... kind of unheard of for me. Either you're a town seer or really brave scum.

You said here that you voted Jabberwock because "you considered me [bbninjas] scummy and Jabberwock sticking his neck out to defend me made Jabber look shady too". But you also say that "you were never too strong on the bbninjas case". If you were never 'too strong', then I don't see why you would assume that I'm scum and then based on that asssumption, proceed to read and vote Jabber as scummy. (This is also what I was referring to in the bolded question: What changed for you to originally entertain the probability that I was town, but then operate under the assumption that I'm scum).

Because I have to do something. If I'm not strong on a read, I'll try and develop one. Same thing happened with the Gekki mess last game. I wasn't voting you because I had no idea of your vote total and wasn't trying to risk anything, and bandwagoning you wasn't gonna do anything. Why not look elsewhere?

This. I'm not sure why you wouldn't have volunteered this information freely, @Lord o da rings.

Didn't know anyone wanted them, and didn't think they're important (vanilla announcer is dumb). I hadn't seen his post. Anyways, here:

Announcement: Hey guys, can't wait to start playing here! I hope you're ready for me!

So I tried to mask myself, trying to not be guessed as the announcer in the case these were, in fact, readable normally. But the coding crap got in the way, so it didn't really matter because no one knows what the hell I'm saying.

Announcement: So the bbninjas lynch was wrong. What's next? I got nothing...

I need to do some work. I'll be in Canada from Monday to Thursday (3 days of basically not checking the site), and if I miraculously survive I'm gonna sub out then, because even though today was free I don't have free time like this again until Friday.

 

[PMJ]

Welp, not what I meant when I said you could lie, but I suppose that is my fault for not understanding your question in the first place and not replying sooner. For future reference, you can not hint at how you read someone. You can lie about who you read.

I'll find a workaround.

 

[PMJ]

Lord claims she's confident of my claim and my alignment but still tries discrediting me by planting the seeds of doubt.

 

[Camoclone]

@GekkisaiDaiNi Can you quote the exact words that Jade said to you and Camo, that said you were both town?


You said here that you voted Jabberwock because "you considered me [bbninjas] scummy and Jabberwock sticking his neck out to defend me made Jabber look shady too". But you also say that "you were never too strong on the bbninjas case". If you were never 'too strong', then I don't see why you would assume that I'm scum and then based on that asssumption, proceed to read and vote Jabber as scummy. (This is also what I was referring to in the bolded question: What changed for you to originally entertain the probability that I was town, but then operate under the assumption that I'm scum).

Maybe Drac, but that's entirely based on jalap's actions. It may be based on him being afraid to be seen as scum (like the beginning of D1) and so he just stopped talking.


Yeah, this is concerning me. I'm not sure whether to expect this game to be balanced, but I don't think Jade would let two lynchproofs slip. It is possible that one of them is town and is lying (probably Camo if anyone).


This. I'm not sure why you wouldn't have volunteered this information freely, @Lord o da rings.


I'm not sure how Jade was planning on reinforcing your restriction, because this is a pretty legitimate get-around for that restriction, and it is obvious that you scanned Robin as innocent, without you actually claiming that.

He did late yesterday.

 

[Camoclone]

I'll find a workaround.

Just be clear with your vote.

 

[Camoclone]

If the confo towns want to lynch someone you don't agree with don't vote them and we will know.

 

[Jabberwock]

Absolute certainty is physically impossible in a game like this, and I've never operated under that kind of mentality in any game I have ever played of Mafia.

If everybody played the way you're currently playing, we would literally never get past RVS. And I'm p sure you don't normally play this way.

I was referring to mentality. I don't go into games with that kind of mentality, ever. That was talking about reads, not results.

What reads? You have no reads. Except for Robin (?).

I am really not following whatever discussion is happening between PMJ and Lorde, for the record.

PMJ: "I'm seer. Massclaim and don't lynch Robin."
Lorde: *claims*
Lorde: *also throws some shade at Robin*
PMJ: "I SAID DON'T LYNCH ROBIN."
Lorde: "it's chill, I still think he's town"
PMJ: "then what was all that about"
Lorde: "it's called skepticism"
PMJ: "if you're confident that I'm seer then you should be confident that Robin is town"
Lorde: "but I do think he's town :OOO"
...etc.

Get it through your thick skull: I don't think he is.

Are we on ad hominem now?

Oh you know, never rule out a possibility. You're not confirmed town, so stop acting like it.

This is the entire point of the game: you make reads and use those to figure out who you can trust and who you can't. You can't be confident in PMJ and not confident in him at the same time.

Because I have to do something. If I'm not strong on a read, I'll try and develop one.

That is not at all what I've been seeing you do this game.

I need to do some work. I'll be in Canada from Monday to Thursday (3 days of basically not checking the site), and if I miraculously survive I'm gonna sub out then, because even though today was free I don't have free time like this again until Friday.

Please sub out now and save us the time.

 

[bbninjas]

Nonono, please don't sub out... we'd just lynch whoever subs in.

Requoting would be a lot of help, @Camoclone, for everyone's sake. Shouldn't be too hard either!

 

[Camoclone]

This situation honestly seems way too good to be true. I don't mind a little skeptism but lord is scummy. I don't understand how this made it through the hosts if this is actually all true.

 

[Camoclone]

Nonono, please don't sub out... we'd just lynch whoever subs in.

Requoting would be a lot of help, @Camoclone, for everyone's sake. Shouldn't be too hard either!

Feel free to look yourself. I'm on mobile.

 

[bbninjas]

@Lord o da rings You're not responding to the crux of my point, so I'm just going to narrow it down a bit.
You said you were never 'too strong' on my lynch (I interpret this as a more neutral-scum lean). However, you also read Jabberwock as scummy because he was defending me, which only makes sense if I am mafian. Hence, you were assuming that I was mafian in reading Jabberwock. I want to know what changed from you not being "not too strong" on my lynch, to be "very strong" on my lynch (evidenced by your assumption that I'm scum, and you basing your reads on that).

This situation honestly seems way too good to be true. I don't mind a little skeptism but lord is scummy. I don't understand how this made it through the hosts if this is actually all true.

I don't understand this bolded part.

 

[Camoclone]

If everything is like we think it is this game is super unbalanced.

 

[PMJ]

He means how did a setup with five clears in a 14 man game be allowed.

Just be clear with your vote.

I know I was yanking gekki's chain but I'm not going to lynch anyone I scan as town.

If the confo towns want to lynch someone you don't agree with don't vote them and we will know.

only people I scanned are gekki and Robin so no problems there.

 

[bbninjas]

If everything is like we think it is this game is super unbalanced.

Oh, yeah, I definitely agree.

 

[Camoclone]

only people I scanned are gekki and Robin so no problems there.

I meant in the future.