Mismagius and Bellelba & Brycen-Man Banned by Creatures and TPCi!

Skeleton Liar said:
The point was what I said right after the first sentence. I think you're jumping the gun by wanting to ban Dusk Stone just in case Pokemon makes the same very specific bone-headed decision that they had to fix. Then to back that opinion up, I explained why that should be a non-issue and doesn't need to happen when Mismagius already received an errata. But sure, apparently giving an explanation to back up my own opinion means you win. If it's that important. :rolleyes:
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Got it. I had no idea we were supposed to be trying to "win". My mistake.
 
Otaku said:
Got it. I had no idea we were supposed to be trying to "win". My mistake.
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Well, that "makes me wonder if you do get it." winky face
Dude, if you want to discuss something with someone, just do it.

Get over yourself. I'm done with this.
 
Skeleton Liar said:
Well, that "makes me wonder if you do get it." winky face
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You're right. I don't get it. I shouldn't have lied, but I panicked because - from my perspective - I realized it wasn't about miscommunication, but you wanting to "win" an argument. [Edit] Or about you thinking all I wanted to do was win an argument. [/Edit] That you say it is in response to me wanting to win an argument just means we both look like fools.

The good news is, at least it reminded me to re-read some of my past comments again, with the mindset of someone not enjoying a discussion of Pokémon minutiae and "What Ifs". They don't read as clear or as friendly as I intended, so even though I'm actually pretty annoyed with your last few comments...

...I was wrong. I'm sorry. I wasn't trying to be rude.

This has further confused what I was trying to say, so I am going to state it again, so at least people can be annoyed with me for the right reasons... though I can also tuck it behind Spoiler Tags so only those who want to see it will.

  1. I think Reset Stamp ought to have been banned. It is banned in Expanded to prevent combos like the one that got Mismagius banned in Standard. My bias is that I believe cards like Reset Stamp are "too good" in general, though "too good" describes most of the competitive card pool, so there's no point in banning such cards until something like this happens. Why is Reset Stamp "too good"? How do I know this isn't just personal preference? I don't, but I can support my stance by pointing out where and how the card causes problems. Again, see the Expanded Format's Banned List.

  2. Something I never mentioned, and regret not doing so, is highlightly @JakeTheGearHeart 's solution: an errata or general rule change so that when Mismagius self-KO's, taking the Prizes is optional. It might actually be a better idea than banning any of these cards.

  3. Next best option is, according to my analysis, is banning Dusk Stone. If Reset Stamp cannot be touched, then this doesn't affect it. It means Mismagius can also remain as is, because without Dusk Stone it cannot hit the field during a player's first turn. Maybe no deck will bother with it if that isn't an option. What about the other Pokémon compatible with Dusk Stone? Those currently available aren't exactly competitive at the moment. The only two that seem remotely competitive (Mismagius and Honchkrow-GX) can still soldier on without it... and as a bonus future Evolutions cards belonging to these Evolution lines no longer need to be preemptively nerfed to avoid "breaking" when used with Dusk Stone.

  4. I've been playing a long time. That doesn't mean I know what I'm talking about... and in one sense, it makes it more likely I don't. I say a lot of things that, for me, are a given. Evolution acceleration, in general, is bad for this game. Why do I say that? Because I've seen it not work out since the game began! The problem with balancing out the Stages is not that Evolutions need to hit the field more quickly, it is the combination of Basics (and even certain Evolutions) hitting the field too fast so that the fundamental Evolution mechanic just doesn't work as intended, and the fact that evolving Basics and Stage 1 Pokémon are so often the worst kind of filler. Restricting the evolution acceleration to work only with a certain card, or certain cards, or certain Pokémon helps, but odds are low Dusk Stone either won't be a waste of time forever more or cause problems with some future release, after it is long forgotten. When it is causing problems as part of another combo, this makes it a little higher on the list of cards that ought to be banned.

  5. From what you (Skeleton Liar) said in your posts from this thread, you value not banning cards more than I do.

  6. You also appear to value the other cards compatible with Dusk Stone more than Mismagius.

  7. So... we don't agree, and don't seem likely to agree.

  8. If I were to keep maintaining my pattern of stupid, here is where I'd put something that either is or is mistaken for being an insult or other pettiness.
 
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That's really great to hear! I loved Pokestar Studios in BW2, but their FA was too pricey. Hopefully this drives the price down.
 
The information in the article is incorrect. The cards aren't errata'd versions of the banned cards, they're explicitly mentioned as entirely new cards according to the announcement in the official japanese website. They still have C regulation marks though, so should rotate alongside the final Sun&Moon cards in Japan.

The trainer is also differently named, Sabrina & Brycen (ナツメ&ハチク) instead of Bellelba & Brycen-Man (ジュジュベ&ハチクマン). Credits to Toine Lay for that detail though https://twitter.com/ToineLay/status/1311896238262902785

Thanks for the update <3
 
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I dont know why but that Mismagius art is just so amazing it has a creepy setting and Mismagius is there, your like "this is where you live?" while Mismagius is just like "yeah :D isn't it great?"
 
I do wonder how you are gonna get 90 damage on enough pokemon to get that sweet OHKO I dont think there are good enough spread options that dont have something better
 
  • Bellelba & Brycen-Man revamp - striaght up bad. If Prof. Oak's Setup wasn't so much play, why do get hopes on this one? 2-3
  • Mismagius revamp - ehh. 9 dmg counters is hard to exploit than 4 dmg counters turn 1, and its for 2 energy, which is a bit worse. 2 Geodudes
 
They are considered brand new cards that “spiritually replace” the old ones (our interpretation).

Your interpretation is... questionable. Maybe I'm just annoyed by the end result, when the situation originally had so much promise, so I'm feeling the need to be very specific.

The whole situation is weird, but no, these cards are not spiritual replacements. Technical replacements might be a better word for it: they're being presented as replacements when the only thing they have in common with them are their stats... but the effects of the cards are wholly unrelated to the originals.

Oh, and the translation for the new Mismagius claims it has no Resistance, when the scan shows Fighting Resistance -20.
 
These cards are crap. I was waiting for them to print Mismagius with a hard OPT restriction, and change the effect of Belleba&Brycen to mill 2 and discard 3 to discard 2 mons from bench.

Not... These abominations that now won't warrant any play. There was literally no point in "reprinting" them this way, and I may go as far as saying that the way they worded things, it was misleading as fudge.
 
These are just new card like how we get a zard in every set, why tell us they reworking when they not
 
These aren't nerfs, these aren't reworks, these aren't even re-releases - these are just brand new cards.

I especially hate the new Mismagius, because with Dusk Stone it might actually be playable, in the most gimmicky way possible. Spread exactly 9 counters to kill any Tag Team/VMAX, or use the spread to counter Blacephalon/Spiritomb/Owls. If it turns out to be good, it'll be extremely annoying to play against.
If Sabrina & Brycen were released in this state, it'd play a single copy in my Slowpoke & Psyduck deck. It's actually not that bad - it can change any five cards into three Pokemon + two energy. In a healthier, slower format it might had actually seen some play.
 
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Yaginku said:
If Sabrina & Brycen were released in this state, it'd play a single copy in my Snorlax & Psyduck deck. It's actually not that bad - it can change any five cards into three Pokemon + two energy. In a healthier, slower format it might had actually seen some play.
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It's 6 cards into 2 basic energy, and 3 pokemon of different types. Cool, but I would have preferred the mill and bench restrict effect.
 
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