Need some input for a silly alternate format idea.

megatron

megatron

i lose a lot
Member
Okay! So I love this game, and without luck, it wouldn't be quite as fun. However, my friends and I usually end up arguing over what would have happened if I flipped heads on this or you didn't top deck that or blah blah blah.

And from that: an idea.

Basically, you play a game where luck is 100% eliminated. Here's what we've come up with so far.

1) At the beginning of the game, you choose seven cards from your deck to be your opening hand, and 6 prizes.
2) The opening coin flip is performed before drawing hands and choosing actives.
3) At the beginning of your turn, you search your deck for a card.
4) Any "draw" card becomes a "search" card. PONT = Shuffle in your hand and pick 6 new cards, etc.
5) All coin flips are treated as heads.



However, there are a lot of kinks that need to be worked out for this to be playable. (Dealing with "flip until you get heads" attacks, etc.)

Any ideas?
 
I'll play lilligrant Vileplume... GG. Sorry, but that doesn't really work. Luck is an integral part of the game and trying to derive a format without luck would cause problems. You'd need a big ban list...
 
I know we all hate this format, but there are other more productive ways to get around it.

Like take a break from playing.

Or find other ways to make it fun.

I've ended up doing both and it makes me feel great.
 
ANYONE THAT GOES FIRST WINS. ZPS could Seeker + Donk you in a heartbeat, so unless you pick three basics in your starting hand, you lose. Even if you have three out, they can upkeep the 120 damage with Seeker and shut down Oddish's from coming out by Catcher as well. And since you don't need consistency search cards, they might add in a few Weavile with Switch to kill anything in your hand, because you always have something good in your hand.

There's like a million ways wrong with your approach. Luck is a part of them game, and it should be accepted.
 
Luck is part of the game? That's the first time I've seen anyone else say that. So many other people hate that fact so much they either deny it or demand it not be a factor at all.
 
But the fact is that we are talking about a game that involves drawing cards from a deck. That already plays into probability. All you can do is work in the highest consistency you can afford. Mechanics that involve coin flips can be debated as unnecessary, but they're around anyhow. Point is, you're playing a game that you know is designed to naturally involve luck. Those that rage about this should go play something else like Chess or Go.
 
I really really don't think you guys have any idea what I'm getting at.

I am NOT whining about the game, the luck involved, and I have no interest in playing chess. I don't hate the format. I don't hate anything.

My friends and I had an idea we thought would be fun. Fun. Like, we wanted to do something different. For fun. Y'know, fun.

Jeez.
 
Did I ever say you were whining? No. I did not. I simply said your suggested system doesn't work. My paragraph was replying to the group that PokeMedic mentioned.
 
Okay. Did I ever say you said I was whining? No. I did not. You aren't the only person who replied, dude.

Would anyone besides Zyflair like to contribute to this?

Emphasis on the "contribute" part. Constructive criticism is cool, but I really don't care if you don't think this will work. It's just something my friends and I want to try for fun. See: my last post.
 
I know exactly what you're getting at Megatron, and I love it. This should make for some really intense games.

To solve your "flip until you get heads" dilemma, here's a solution: treat it as if it were only one heads, since that's what these attacks are supposed to average out to. For example, if you multiply the various probabilities of Raichu HS's Iton Tail flips into infinity, its expected utility should be 29.999...; or in other words, the exact amount of damage, energy, etc printed on the card.
 
JEKyl said:
I know exactly what you're getting at Megatron, and I love it. This should make for some really intense games.

To solve your "flip until you get heads" dilemma, here's a solution: treat it as if it were only one heads, since that's what these attacks are supposed to average out to. For example, if you multiply the various probabilities of Raichu HS's Iton Tail flips into infinity, its expected utility should be 29.999...; or in other words, the exact amount of damage, energy, etc printed on the card.
Click to expand...

Yeahyeah, that definitely makes sense. Nice! What would you suggest about going first/second? Is best 2/3 the only way to deal with it?
 
More games = less variance, but you don't have all day to do a 4/7 lol. 2/3 should do a great job at what you want.

Also, going back to the coin-flipping thing, you might want to what I suggested for each and every effect requiring multiple coin flips, so that you're closest to the original intended effect of the card. Is your purpose to create a brand new format with a totally different metagame, or is it to make the one we have more skill-based? If it's the latter, then you ought to be averaging out flips.
 
Well the purpose would be the latter, but it would probably end up evolving into the former as decks such as Lilligant/Vileplume become unbeatable without proper techs. Obviously there's a reason the game isn't already played this way and we'd have to make a lot of concessions, especially along the lines of banning certain cards/combos. I think coins that flip for paralysis are the biggest threat. Maybe just banning trainer lock?

Also, I think another good alternative for having to play 2 or 3 games could just be flipping for who goes first and THEN choosing your hand and prizes so both players can adjust accordingly.
 
Cards like Erika, Prof Oak, and most other trainers will kill you! The donk decks to amazing without searching, so with searching, it would be amazing.
 
megatron said:
Why's that? (I most certainly don't doubt you; just curious)
Click to expand...
Gambler.
You get a heads? Great, you search for 8 cards.
Tails? Oh no, just get another Gambler or a Professor Oak to promptly attempt to search for 8 cards or just flat-out search for 7.

Gambler and Professor Oak would break the game.
 
It would HAVE to be modified.

Also, I think it would be interesting for, instead of ALWAYS heads, to either:
-ban cards with coin flips,
-make coin flips the opposite of the last one (if you got a Tails last time, it's a Heads this time), or
-flip 5 coins per where a coin would normally be flipped, basically a best out of 3 Heads vs. Tails.
 
Scizorliscious said:
It would HAVE to be modified.

Also, I think it would be interesting for, instead of ALWAYS heads, to either:
-ban cards with coin flips,
-make coin flips the opposite of the last one (if you got a Tails last time, it's a Heads this time), or
-flip 5 coins per where a coin would normally be flipped, basically a best out of 3 Heads vs. Tails.
Click to expand...

I think banning coin flips is the only way to really do that, but then popular/important/thereasonwethoughtofthis cards like Jirachi, Super Scoop Up, and Cleffa/Babies, would be gone. I think banning any attack that involves a coin flip could be the way to go.
 
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