XY Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Why Should They Learn Them?

[Ririka]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6

Whenever we think we outsmart the game developer that's when we're bound to be wrong.

I mentioned Delphox with no Dazzling Gleam as a pure fan WANTS, not my NEEDS.

It's about the balance i think. Imagine that with Delphox's high speed it can pierce through opposing Dark pokemon easily, even kill some bad Sp.Def Dragons. Not to mention it's wide coverage already towards Steel-Ice-Grass-Fight-Poison, and it's status as Aegislash killer. Yeah, a single move like Dazzling Gleam could make Delphox into a sweeping machine.

 

[MtheW]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6

I am very disappointed that my umbreon can't' learn crunch, I was looking forward to it having a good physical move. It learned crunch in colosseum though, so maybe I should just transfer my umbreon from there. Still disappointing.

 

[Drohn]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6

@AscheRune: Actually, this is supposed to englobe all pokémon, I just called it "gen 6 edition" because we have new pokémon and new moves to add to the discussion...

I made a change to the title to make this more clear.

 

[Rusty Sticks]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6

I found 2 more...
Tyrantrum can't learn any Fire attacks. This complaint may seem weird at first as it is not a Fire-type but when you consider that other Rock, Dragon and/or Dinossaur-like pokémon like Aggron, Rhyperior, Tyranitar and Druddigon can, it doesn't make sense that Tyrantrum can't spit flames or learn a single fire move, more specifically, Fire Fang. Unless it learns the Elemental fangs through breeding, Strong Jaw is a useless ability cause it only learns Bite and Crunch. There are other Pokémon which would make better use of that ability like, again, Tyranitar and specially Drapion which also has Bug Bite and Poison Fang besides all the other biting moves...

I would like to say that Tyrunt CAN learn the elemental bites through breeding.

 

[TayBee]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6 Update

Maybe this sounds crazy... but the fact that Goodra cannot learn surf really ticked me off. Hydration... Muddy Water... but can't learn any other water moves. Heck... why wasn't this guy water/dragon?

 

[garbodorable]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6

I love how they ignore all of these blatant problems. DO THEY EVEN PLAY THE GAMES??? I mean really take any random pokemon fan and they could give you a list of all the things that don't make sense. Hell, I'm sure people would help them for free. Literally all they'd have to do would be to walk outside, find someone who plays pokemon, and ask them. Or, you know, GO ON ANY POKEMON SITE AT ALL. This stuff is all around them. I just don't understand how such a big company could be so dense. It would gain them money by simply getting some sort of PR position to research these kind of things. I almost want to major in graphical design and be so dam amazing that they hire me just so I can freaking tell them all of these issues.

No offense to anyone, but most of the posts in this thread have been nitpicking and not substantial game design issues. The pokemon you guys like aren't getting the moves you want them to have. Oh dear.

Take a deep breath and think about how maybe Game Freak has higher priorities than giving Umbreon fans Moonblast or giving EVEN MORE pokemon Earthquake or Surf or whatever. Every move pool decision they make has an obvious logic behind it, and just because it's not a logic you agree with doesn't give you license to suggest they're doing a lot of navel-gazing instead of playtesting their own games, which is demonstrably false.

 

[MrSquarepants]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6 Update

Well they have over 700 pokemon and more than I count moves and abilities. I knew someone, somewhere in the company would eventually forget some stuff. Hopefully... Gen 7 or Z or RS remakes fix these.

But they might also just not care and just leave things be.

 

[Metalizard]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6

No offense to anyone, but most of the posts in this thread have been nitpicking and not substantial game design issues. The pokemon you guys like aren't getting the moves you want them to have. Oh dear.

Take a deep breath and think about how maybe Game Freak has higher priorities than giving Umbreon fans Moonblast or giving EVEN MORE pokemon Earthquake or Surf or whatever. Every move pool decision they make has an obvious logic behind it, and just because it's not a logic you agree with doesn't give you license to suggest they're doing a lot of navel-gazing instead of playtesting their own games, which is demonstrably false.

Well, the directors may indeed have higher priorities but that's why they have something called a "Development Team"... If they test the games, they should notice these issues...

 

[Frezgle]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6 Update

The directors and developers might be the ones who are usually right about their own product.
But I stand by the fact that they were very, very wrong about this: Ampharos can't learn Dazzling Gleam.

If that's an oversight, it's a terrible one. If it's intentional... well, then it's even more terrible.

 

[Blob55]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6 Update

Why isn't Heliolisk Electric/Grass? It evolves with the Sun Stone, which is a stone only Grass types could use to evolve before. Plus when it attacks it's very Sun-like and thanks to its Electric/Normal typing, it can't learn Solarbeam!
Also, is it just me, or is Heliolisk the only Pokémon that evolves with a non-Generation 1 Evolutionary Stone that has no level up moves?

 

[Whitefire]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6 Update

Why isn't Heliolisk Electric/Grass? It evolves with the Sun Stone, which is a stone only Grass types could use to evolve before. Plus when it attacks it's very Sun-like and thanks to its Electric/Normal typing, it can't learn Solarbeam!
Also, is it just me, or is Heliolisk the only Pokémon that evolves with a non-Generation 1 Evolutionary Stone that has no level up moves?

Gaining weakness to fire, poison, flying and bug? I'm fine with just ground and fighting, thanks >_> though the solarbeam and dry skin.... wat

 

[professorlight]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6 Update

Why isn't Heliolisk Electric/Grass? It evolves with the Sun Stone, which is a stone only Grass types could use to evolve before. Plus when it attacks it's very Sun-like and thanks to its Electric/Normal typing, it can't learn Solarbeam!
Also, is it just me, or is Heliolisk the only Pokémon that evolves with a non-Generation 1 Evolutionary Stone that has no level up moves?

Electric is fine, helioptile is based on solar panels (though, a little shiny blue color and a solar panel pattern somewhere would have been cool) and sunlight's potential to become electric energy, is not based on photosynthesis, so even though a grass type could have been a possibility, it would come to the price of making it some sort of lizard-plant electric/grass creature (something that was made with sceptile and all the starters).
Though not having solar power and not learning solarbeam and sunny day is unforgivable.

 

[Metalizard]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6 Update

Why isn't Heliolisk Electric/Grass? It evolves with the Sun Stone, which is a stone only Grass types could use to evolve before. Plus when it attacks it's very Sun-like and thanks to its Electric/Normal typing, it can't learn Solarbeam!
Also, is it just me, or is Heliolisk the only Pokémon that evolves with a non-Generation 1 Evolutionary Stone that has no level up moves?

lolwut? Just because it uses the sun and as such evolves with the sun stone, it should be Grass-type? Do you see anything in its design that is remotely related to plants? I don't think so... There are other pokémon related to the sun like Volcarona or Espeon and they're not Grass-types...

@professor light: It does have Solar Power but only as its Hidden Ability...
Though that part of not learning Solarbeam and Sunny Day is indeed annoyingly stupid... The Helioptile line is a total mess when it comes to its concept...

And that's why we complain about GF's choices, because sometimes they're just too dumb to not notice...

 

[Blob55]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6 Update

At least they finally gave Flareon Flare Blitz.

Heliolisk looks more like a Ground try to me, because of its colouring and where you find Helioptile. Also, Dry Skin would work better for it as a Ground/Normal type.

 

[professorlight]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6 Update

Why isn't Heliolisk Electric/Grass? It evolves with the Sun Stone, which is a stone only Grass types could use to evolve before. Plus when it attacks it's very Sun-like and thanks to its Electric/Normal typing, it can't learn Solarbeam!
Also, is it just me, or is Heliolisk the only Pokémon that evolves with a non-Generation 1 Evolutionary Stone that has no level up moves?

@professor light: It does have Solar Power but only as its Hidden Ability...
Though that part of not learning Solarbeam and Sunny Day is indeed annoyingly stupid... The Helioptile line is a total mess when it comes to its concept...

And that's why we complain about GF's choices, because sometimes they're just too dumb to not notice...

Yes, it does, but seriously, when they talk about a pokemon which uses sunlight to generate energy, do you think "oh, it must have dry skin/sand veil" or "yes! this mofo has solar power, this will be great!".
When something is the most distinctive concept of a pokemon, it being it's extremely rare hidden ability doesn't make any sense. Consider all the levitate pokemon who don't get a hidden ability because flying is such an essential part of their concept.

 

[Ohman177]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6

I love how they ignore all of these blatant problems. DO THEY EVEN PLAY THE GAMES??? I mean really take any random pokemon fan and they could give you a list of all the things that don't make sense. Hell, I'm sure people would help them for free. Literally all they'd have to do would be to walk outside, find someone who plays pokemon, and ask them. Or, you know, GO ON ANY POKEMON SITE AT ALL. This stuff is all around them. I just don't understand how such a big company could be so dense. It would gain them money by simply getting some sort of PR position to research these kind of things. I almost want to major in graphical design and be so dam amazing that they hire me just so I can freaking tell them all of these issues.

No offense to anyone, but most of the posts in this thread have been nitpicking and not substantial game design issues. The pokemon you guys like aren't getting the moves you want them to have. Oh dear.

Take a deep breath and think about how maybe Game Freak has higher priorities than giving Umbreon fans Moonblast or giving EVEN MORE pokemon Earthquake or Surf or whatever. Every move pool decision they make has an obvious logic behind it, and just because it's not a logic you agree with doesn't give you license to suggest they're doing a lot of navel-gazing instead of playtesting their own games, which is demonstrably false.

But these aren't just wants. They are simple and necessary characteristics of pokemon. THEY are the ones who gave Umbreon the moon theme. They can't just do that and not give him Moonblast. There is just no sense in it. If a move fits in the your pokemon's actual storyline and what it's inspired from and how it's viewed in the games, it's your job to fullfill. And can you honestly say my accusations of them not testing the game enough aren't sound when we have pokemon like Helioptile and Heliolisk not learning solar beam? I know you're trying to be the voice of reason here but they have simply made a lot of mistakes.
And as a second example, Ampharos' line still can't learn tail glow. The fact that they gave him a mega means they definitely haven't forgotten about him, and the fact that they gave him dragon pulse means they definitely haven't forgotten about his move pool, so them not giving him that move simply means they are over looking it (like a lot of things) since it's 110% nonsensicle for him not to have it. Over looking things isn't acceptable to me when you have enough money to hire one person for each pokemon to be an expert on everything about it and its needs.

 

[professorlight]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6

No offense to anyone, but most of the posts in this thread have been nitpicking and not substantial game design issues. The pokemon you guys like aren't getting the moves you want them to have. Oh dear.

Take a deep breath and think about how maybe Game Freak has higher priorities than giving Umbreon fans Moonblast or giving EVEN MORE pokemon Earthquake or Surf or whatever. Every move pool decision they make has an obvious logic behind it, and just because it's not a logic you agree with doesn't give you license to suggest they're doing a lot of navel-gazing instead of playtesting their own games, which is demonstrably false.

But these aren't just wants. They are simple and necessary characteristics of pokemon. THEY are the ones who gave Umbreon the moon theme. They can't just do that and not give him Moonblast. There is just no sense in it. If a move fits in the your pokemon's actual storyline and what it's inspired from and how it's viewed in the games, it's your job to fullfill. And can you honestly say my accusations of them not testing the game enough aren't sound when we have pokemon like Helioptile and Heliolisk not learning solar beam? I know you're trying to be the voice of reason here but they have simply made a lot of mistakes.
And as a second example, Ampharos' line still can't learn tail glow. The fact that they gave him a mega means they definitely haven't forgotten about him, and the fact that they gave him dragon pulse means they definitely haven't forgotten about his move pool, so them not giving him that move simply means they are over looking it (like a lot of things) since it's 110% nonsensicle for him not to have it. Over looking things isn't acceptable to me when you have enough money to hire one person for each pokemon to be an expert on everything about it and its needs.

I agree with you in that many of the complaints make sense, but I also agree with garbodorable, I think this particular time it was for lack of time/resources. Every generation/game comes with that kind of mistakes, oversights and story and gameplay segregation, but this game seems particularly lacking in everything but graphics and deep and shallow gameplay. soemtimes I think that in some cases there are factors we don't notice that explain why certain pokemon get or don't get moves that don't or do make sense but this gen seems to be more about little attention given to movepools and old pokemon than just the usual oversights.

 

[Ohman177]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6

But these aren't just wants. They are simple and necessary characteristics of pokemon. THEY are the ones who gave Umbreon the moon theme. They can't just do that and not give him Moonblast. There is just no sense in it. If a move fits in the your pokemon's actual storyline and what it's inspired from and how it's viewed in the games, it's your job to fullfill. And can you honestly say my accusations of them not testing the game enough aren't sound when we have pokemon like Helioptile and Heliolisk not learning solar beam? I know you're trying to be the voice of reason here but they have simply made a lot of mistakes.
And as a second example, Ampharos' line still can't learn tail glow. The fact that they gave him a mega means they definitely haven't forgotten about him, and the fact that they gave him dragon pulse means they definitely haven't forgotten about his move pool, so them not giving him that move simply means they are over looking it (like a lot of things) since it's 110% nonsensicle for him not to have it. Over looking things isn't acceptable to me when you have enough money to hire one person for each pokemon to be an expert on everything about it and its needs.

I agree with you in that many of the complaints make sense, but I also agree with garbodorable, I think this particular time it was for lack of time/resources. Every generation/game comes with that kind of mistakes, oversights and story and gameplay segregation, but this game seems particularly lacking in everything but graphics and deep and shallow gameplay. soemtimes I think that in some cases there are factors we don't notice that explain why certain pokemon get or don't get moves that don't or do make sense but this gen seems to be more about little attention given to movepools and old pokemon than just the usual oversights.

Plus some of these have been issues since Gen 1 so I just don't really know anymore haha.

 

[Chrono]

RE: Pokémon That Don't Learn Attacks That Fit Them - Generation 6 Update

After all these years...

ZANGOOSE STILL DOESN'T GET CUT.

I think GF is just trolling us at this point.

 

[ScorchingShock]

RE: Moves that Pokémon should get but don't - Gen VI Edition

Apparently Umbreon didn't get Moonblast. I call bullshit.

Oh hell no.
Umbreon HAS to learn Moonblast!
What the heck was GF smoking when they chose not to give Moonblast to Umbreon, a pokemon who ACTUALLY GAINS POWER FROM MOONLIGHT?!