• When creating a thread in the Deck Garage, make sure that you post one deck per thread, you use the correct prefix, you have the set name/card number next to each card, you give a strategy for non-metagame decks, and give translations for all cards not available in English.

    When posting in a thread, be sure to explain all your suggestions thoroughly. Additionally, do not ask for advice in another member's thread.

Standard Post LST - Gardevoir GX/Alolan Ninetales GX

momand

momand

Aspiring Trainer
Member
Very similar strat to the original Gardevoir GX archetype, except new! Alolan Ninetales GX LST provides more support for the usually clunky deck and provides a backup attacker.
Pokemon:
4x Ralts BUS
2x Kirlia BUS
3x Gardevoir GX
1x Gardevoir LST
2x Alolan Vulpix GRI
2x Alolan Ninetales GX LST
2x Tapu Lele GX
1x Chikorita (60 HP)
1x Meganium LST
1x Oranguru SUM

Trainers:
4x Cynthia
3x Guzma
2x Professor Elm's Lecture
2x Lillie
1x Copycat
1x Judge
1x Tate and Liza

4x Ultra Ball
3x Rare Candy
2x Max Potion
2x Choice Band
2x Escape Board
1x Field Blower
1x Rescue Stretcher

Energy:
4x DCE
8x Fairy Energy
 
Last edited:
Bump
Just realized I forgot Rescue Stretcher so I'm gonna add that lmao. To be honest, I don't think the deck really needs Diantha, so that's what I'm gonna be cutting for now.

-1 Diantha
+1 Stretcher

Also want to add Super Boost Energy but space is too tight so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
Leoisnotyou said:
How is this setup working for you?

An awesome idea to switch between Ninetales & Gardevoir.
Click to expand...
Haven't exactly gotten any testing done to be honest with you.

Theoretically the deck should run great. You Elm's for Vulpix, Ralts and Chikorita, Beacon for Ninetales and Meganium, use Ninetales's ability to search out Ultra Ball and Rare Candy, Rare Candy into Meganium, and then you're good for the rest of the game.
 
TSA123 said:
Haven't exactly gotten any testing done to be honest with you.

Theoretically the deck should run great. You Elm's for Vulpix, Ralts and Chikorita, Beacon for Ninetales and Meganium, use Ninetales's ability to search out Ultra Ball and Rare Candy, Rare Candy into Meganium, and then you're good for the rest of the game.
Click to expand...
Why not play sylveon line? Meganium is a bench sitter and a liability if forced into play by a card like Guzma, while sylveon can be used early game to find cards and endgame as a secondary attacker.
 
Mysticvulpix said:
Why not play sylveon line? Meganium is a bench sitter and a liability if forced into play by a card like Guzma, while sylveon can be used early game to find cards and endgame as a secondary attacker.
Click to expand...
I more or less decided that Meganium would be cool 2 months ago b/c you have automatic Rare Candy each turn if you have it down. It also decreases the amount of total items you would be playing against Trashalanche. It's not necessarily good, just something I thought would be cool

As for Sylveon, the reason I don't like it as opposed to Ninetales is b/c you can always get Let Loosed or Judged and lose the cards you Magical Ribbon for. You can use Ninetales to get important items on the turn you evolve it. Silver Snow Wind is a good enough attack that can spread damage, and the GX attack can kill Blacephalon, baby Buzz, and Buzz GX in one hit.
 
Frankly I'd say the main reason why there's no need for Sylveon GX is because the new non-GX Gardevoir power creeps it.

Judge is not being played often enough and at high enough counts per deck for it to discourage Magical Ribbon. Magical Ribbon was still the best way to set up at the end of Gardevoir's last season even when N was being played at 4. If my opponent goes out of their way to Lele for a Judge just to brick themselves on 4 cards, then it's still a win for me. I can just Magical Ribbon/Brilliant Search again next turn anyway. Either way, the fact that we now have a 1 prize attacker who hits harder than Sylveon and can also search just as well as Sylveon means that Sylveon is obsoleted. Plea GX also loses value since most decks nowadays are Basic/Stage 1 focused and Parallel City has rotated. Nuking people's benches just doesn't really work anymore. Alolan Vulpix is a much better basic than Eevee, too.

I think the Meganium is interesting spicy tech, but also don't think your bench has room for it when the goal of the deck is to have as many Gardevoir in play as possible. I'd say this deck's "optimal bench line up" is 2 Gardevoir GX, 1 Gardevoir non-GX, 1 Alolan Ninetales GX, 1 Tapu Lele GX (you're going to use one most games), and either Oranguru, Alolan Vulpix to Beacon, or the 4th Gardevoir (either GX or non-GX depending on situation). In games where you aren't going to be using Alolan Ninetale's GX attack, you will likely end up Twilight GXing for resources anyway, including your rare candies. Twilight GX is a GX attack that I feel a lot of people underutilize. I almost always use it after I get a KO and know my opponent has no way to counter KO because it means I will always win the resource battle against my opponent. Restocking energy and rare candy after getting KO'd is a huge plus as well.

But that choice is up to you. I haven't playtested the new Magenium in Gardevoir and it might end up being a crucial partner.

In my opinion, I would play this deck top heavy.

-1 Kirlia
+1 non-GX Gardevoir

With the addition of Alolan Ninetales GX, you should be rare candy evolving your Gardevoir almost exclusively. Since Espeon EX is out of standard and no one is playing Shining Jirachi for good reason, you don't have to worry about devolve KOs preveting you from accessing your Stage 2s anymore. You can keep 1 Kirlia for when things go poorly, but frankly I would play every Stage 2 deck with 0 Stage 1s with Alolan Ninetales GX in the picture. It's been very successful in all of my playtesting with Stage 2 decks like Solgaleo so far. I would even say get rid of the 2nd Kirlia for a 3rd Alolan Vulpix. Since this deck is ability based for its set up, you can afford to attack with Beacon to search for your Pokemon, or rather you might as well attack with Beacon to optimize your turns during set up. Having a 3rd copy also means that the one sitting up front to Beacon can afford to get KO'd since you will have enough copies with or without Rescue Stretcher.

Just my thoughts.
 
Duo said:
Frankly I'd say the main reason why there's no need for Sylveon GX is because the new non-GX Gardevoir power creeps it.

Judge is not being played often enough and at high enough counts per deck for it to discourage Magical Ribbon. Magical Ribbon was still the best way to set up at the end of Gardevoir's last season even when N was being played at 4. If my opponent goes out of their way to Lele for a Judge just to brick themselves on 4 cards, then it's still a win for me. I can just Magical Ribbon/Brilliant Search again next turn anyway. Either way, the fact that we now have a 1 prize attacker who hits harder than Sylveon and can also search just as well as Sylveon means that Sylveon is obsoleted. Plea GX also loses value since most decks nowadays are Basic/Stage 1 focused and Parallel City has rotated. Nuking people's benches just doesn't really work anymore. Alolan Vulpix is a much better basic than Eevee, too.

I think the Meganium is interesting spicy tech, but also don't think your bench has room for it when the goal of the deck is to have as many Gardevoir in play as possible. I'd say this deck's "optimal bench line up" is 2 Gardevoir GX, 1 Gardevoir non-GX, 1 Alolan Ninetales GX, 1 Tapu Lele GX (you're going to use one most games), and either Oranguru, Alolan Vulpix to Beacon, or the 4th Gardevoir (either GX or non-GX depending on situation). In games where you aren't going to be using Alolan Ninetale's GX attack, you will likely end up Twilight GXing for resources anyway, including your rare candies. Twilight GX is a GX attack that I feel a lot of people underutilize. I almost always use it after I get a KO and know my opponent has no way to counter KO because it means I will always win the resource battle against my opponent. Restocking energy and rare candy after getting KO'd is a huge plus as well.

But that choice is up to you. I haven't playtested the new Magenium in Gardevoir and it might end up being a crucial partner.

In my opinion, I would play this deck top heavy.

-1 Kirlia
+1 non-GX Gardevoir

With the addition of Alolan Ninetales GX, you should be rare candy evolving your Gardevoir almost exclusively. Since Espeon EX is out of standard and no one is playing Shining Jirachi for good reason, you don't have to worry about devolve KOs preveting you from accessing your Stage 2s anymore. You can keep 1 Kirlia for when things go poorly, but frankly I would play every Stage 2 deck with 0 Stage 1s with Alolan Ninetales GX in the picture. It's been very successful in all of my playtesting with Stage 2 decks like Solgaleo so far. I would even say get rid of the 2nd Kirlia for a 3rd Alolan Vulpix. Since this deck is ability based for its set up, you can afford to attack with Beacon to search for your Pokemon, or rather you might as well attack with Beacon to optimize your turns during set up. Having a 3rd copy also means that the one sitting up front to Beacon can afford to get KO'd since you will have enough copies with or without Rescue Stretcher.

Just my thoughts.
Click to expand...
The reason I thought sylveon was a good alternative is that though eevee is a worse basic than alolan vulpix, eevee is not meant to be a basic. The thing that makes sylveon’s magic ribbon better than gardevoir LST’s brilliant search is that it can be used almost instantly. If you take turn 2, it’s a viable option to use, while at that same state your Gardevoir is still not set up. I can see where your going, my point is that having alolan vulpix beacon makes it a target to be attacked. It doesn’t matter that it is only worth one prize, it’s crucial use is what makes it targeted. Just my thoughts.
 
Mysticvulpix said:
The reason I thought sylveon was a good alternative is that though eevee is a worse basic than alolan vulpix, eevee is not meant to be a basic. The thing that makes sylveon’s magic ribbon better than gardevoir LST’s brilliant search is that it can be used almost instantly. If you take turn 2, it’s a viable option to use, while at that same state your Gardevoir is still not set up. I can see where your going, my point is that having alolan vulpix beacon makes it a target to be attacked. It doesn’t matter that it is only worth one prize, it’s crucial use is what makes it targeted. Just my thoughts.
Click to expand...

While it's true that a T1 going 2nd, T2 going 1st Magical Ribbon is optimal, it's also fairly difficult to pull off since this demands that you start Eevee or switch it into the active somehow and demands that you have Fairy Energy in hand since you are likely playing Elm on T1 instead of a draw supporter.

This restriction is what makes Alolan Ninetales GX to me the superior pick. It doesn't matter who your active is. You just need to grab yourself Alolan Ninetales GX and you have a "guaranteed" Gardevoir GX to begin accelerating energy on Turn 2 of the game. With Magical Ribbon, you have your first "guaranteed" Gardevoir by Turn 2 going second or Turn 3 going first since you have to wait until next turn to use your cards.

The other small nuance thing is that running Sylveon GX means that you are dedicating energy to Sylveon and not to Gardevoir. With Alolan Ninetales GX, you can dedicate all of your energy attachments to your Gardies as early as Turn 1, and that means your Gardies are stronger, sooner.

The argument for Sylveon GX is if you plan on using Magical Ribbon 2 turns in a row. This allows Sylveon GX to get you the energy you need in hand to "make up" for having to dedicate the energy to Sylveon in the first place, and it also guarantees a 2nd Gardevoir at the same time. If your strategy is to focus on setting up a bigger board, Magical Ribbon is actually better. Sylveon's 2nd attack hitting for 110 is also a much better number than 70/30, allowing it to OHKO Ray GX and Ultra Necrozma GX without band. But the restrictions for set up still apply.

I think there is merit for both builds, but for me the deciding factor comes down to the fact that Ray GX and Blacephalon GX are decks that I expect to see much more of with Lost Thunder, and both are faster than Gardevoir and can OHKO Sylveon GX easily. Because of this, I'd rather have an Alolan Vulpix getting smashed for 1 prize than a Sylveon GX getting smashed for 2. You also aren't going to get off 2 Magical Ribbons against these decks.


tl;dr - Sylveon GX vs Alolan Ninetales GX is match up/meta dependant, and I think with the insane speed of Basic-centric OHKO decks coming into the meta with Lost Thunder, Alolan Ninetales GX is the way to go for now.
 
Duo said:
While it's true that a T1 going 2nd, T2 going 1st Magical Ribbon is optimal, it's also fairly difficult to pull off since this demands that you start Eevee or switch it into the active somehow and demands that you have Fairy Energy in hand since you are likely playing Elm on T1 instead of a draw supporter.

This restriction is what makes Alolan Ninetales GX to me the superior pick. It doesn't matter who your active is. You just need to grab yourself Alolan Ninetales GX and you have a "guaranteed" Gardevoir GX to begin accelerating energy on Turn 2 of the game. With Magical Ribbon, you have your first "guaranteed" Gardevoir by Turn 2 going second or Turn 3 going first since you have to wait until next turn to use your cards.

The other small nuance thing is that running Sylveon GX means that you are dedicating energy to Sylveon and not to Gardevoir. With Alolan Ninetales GX, you can dedicate all of your energy attachments to your Gardies as early as Turn 1, and that means your Gardies are stronger, sooner.

The argument for Sylveon GX is if you plan on using Magical Ribbon 2 turns in a row. This allows Sylveon GX to get you the energy you need in hand to "make up" for having to dedicate the energy to Sylveon in the first place, and it also guarantees a 2nd Gardevoir at the same time. If your strategy is to focus on setting up a bigger board, Magical Ribbon is actually better. Sylveon's 2nd attack hitting for 110 is also a much better number than 70/30, allowing it to OHKO Ray GX and Ultra Necrozma GX without band. But the restrictions for set up still apply.

I think there is merit for both builds, but for me the deciding factor comes down to the fact that Ray GX and Blacephalon GX are decks that I expect to see much more of with Lost Thunder, and both are faster than Gardevoir and can OHKO Sylveon GX easily. Because of this, I'd rather have an Alolan Vulpix getting smashed for 1 prize than a Sylveon GX getting smashed for 2. You also aren't going to get off 2 Magical Ribbons against these decks.


tl;dr - Sylveon GX vs Alolan Ninetales GX is match up/meta dependant, and I think with the insane speed of Basic-centric OHKO decks coming into the meta with Lost Thunder, Alolan Ninetales GX is the way to go for now.
Click to expand...
Very true. My one question is: is this variant better than Gardevoir Swampede? I’ve tested swampede, and it was very strong against zoroark and kiawe decks. I haven’t fully tested Gardevoir Ninetales, and I want to know each other’s matchups.
 
Do you mean Swampert for the discard draw 3 as well as 80 base damage Hydro Pump? The only thing I kind of question about that is running too many lines of Stage 2s, unless you mean replacing the 1/1 Meganium line with it instead.

If that's what you mean then I think it wouldn't be a bad tech. It's fundamentally the same idea as a 1/1 Octillery line that requires rare candy, and if you were going to rely on that then I guess you would remove the Oranguru to have room for it too.

I've playtested the general flow of Gardevoir Ninetales and was decently pleased with it, but I've been personally falling away from Stage 2 decks in general so I haven't really tested it up against things like Psychic Malamar or Blacephalon to know how it holds up. No harm in playtesting it really, but I think the baseline is that Alolan Ninetales is a must have in Stage 2s nowadays. It increases set up consistency by a lot while something like Swampert is something that keeps your deck running after setting up. They serve 2 different fuctions in my book.
 
Duo said:
Do you mean Swampert for the discard draw 3 as well as 80 base damage Hydro Pump? The only thing I kind of question about that is running too many lines of Stage 2s, unless you mean replacing the 1/1 Meganium line with it instead.

If that's what you mean then I think it wouldn't be a bad tech. It's fundamentally the same idea as a 1/1 Octillery line that requires rare candy, and if you were going to rely on that then I guess you would remove the Oranguru to have room for it too.

I've playtested the general flow of Gardevoir Ninetales and was decently pleased with it, but I've been personally falling away from Stage 2 decks in general so I haven't really tested it up against things like Psychic Malamar or Blacephalon to know how it holds up. No harm in playtesting it really, but I think the baseline is that Alolan Ninetales is a must have in Stage 2s nowadays. It increases set up consistency by a lot while something like Swampert is something that keeps your deck running after setting up. They serve 2 different fuctions in my book.
Click to expand...
What I was asking about was an entirely different deck, which was a combination of gardevoir gx and swampert from celestial storm. The deck had seen some success, and i was wondering how strong it was compared to this new Gardevoir.
 
Duo said:
Do you mean Swampert for the discard draw 3 as well as 80 base damage Hydro Pump? The only thing I kind of question about that is running too many lines of Stage 2s, unless you mean replacing the 1/1 Meganium line with it instead.

If that's what you mean then I think it wouldn't be a bad tech. It's fundamentally the same idea as a 1/1 Octillery line that requires rare candy, and if you were going to rely on that then I guess you would remove the Oranguru to have room for it too.

I've playtested the general flow of Gardevoir Ninetales and was decently pleased with it, but I've been personally falling away from Stage 2 decks in general so I haven't really tested it up against things like Psychic Malamar or Blacephalon to know how it holds up. No harm in playtesting it really, but I think the baseline is that Alolan Ninetales is a must have in Stage 2s nowadays. It increases set up consistency by a lot while something like Swampert is something that keeps your deck running after setting up. They serve 2 different fuctions in my book.
Click to expand...
And it used the multiple stage twos to its advantage, by using super boost energy more often and using sylveon GX to find cards in the beginning game.
 
Acerola Gardevoir, Meganium a Ralts back into Gardy, Secret Spring attach energies again.
Meganium breaks Acerola.
 
I think opting into Acerola would make more sense with a 2/2 line or heavier of Meganium which would imply removing Alolan Ninetales to make room for 2/2 Meganium and 2 Acerola, but 1/1 is just a cute tech at this point that will come up every now and again rather than being something to rely on. I wouldn't want to dedicate any deck space to combo off of a 1/1 line that can easily be prized and unusable throughout the game.

If we're going for the heal play, I would switch out Oranguru for Miltank as far as deck space efficiency is concerned.
 
Duo said:
I think opting into Acerola would make more sense with a 2/2 line or heavier of Meganium which would imply removing Alolan Ninetales to make room for 2/2 Meganium and 2 Acerola, but 1/1 is just a cute tech at this point that will come up every now and again rather than being something to rely on. I wouldn't want to dedicate any deck space to combo off of a 1/1 line that can easily be prized and unusable throughout the game.

If we're going for the heal play, I would switch out Oranguru for Miltank as far as deck space efficiency is concerned.
Click to expand...
True. I used to play miltank in gardevoir back last season. Only problem was that it allowed a free prize card possibility for your opponent. Overall, max potion is better due to the full healing and the fact that gardevoir can recycle cards.
 
The real question (besides whether meganium is worth the lost consistency) is where is your Xerneas Prism? That card is low-key disgusting in Gardevoir. My personal vote is for cutting Meganium line for Xerneas and another shuffle-draw supporter, probably another Tate & Liza. Also try out Zebstrika over Oranguru maybe? Premonition is what made Broken Gardy work, but some better ability based draw might speed the deck up a bit
 
I forgot about Xerneas Prism - I'd say that's a definite must have in the deck now that you brought it up.

Zebstrika is an interesting choice...and honestly maybe one that's a bit overlooked. Mallow + Octillery used to be a somewhat decent combo in Gardevoir decks, but Mallow + Zebstrika is even better since you aren't drawing up to an amount; you're just hard drawing 4 every time no matter what and searching out 2 of any card with Mallow regardless of your hand state. Twilight GX helps to prevent the discard cost from being too bad, but that also means you have to take into consideration needing a turn to Twilight GX if you end up actually having to discard full hands instead of discarding 1-2 cards to draw 4. Then again, granted Gardevoir decks used to play 4 copies of Sycamore, this is probably not a real issue.

To be clear I don't recommend the Zebstrika + Mallow combo. Was kind of just using it as an example of how it can potentially be even better than Octillery which was a support Pokemon that was 2nd only to Lele honestly.. For the most part, you would rather Zebstrika into a Cynthia and play the Cynthia to extend your draw to give you more resources to work with long term and puts you in a better position for the future.

I think Zebstrika is a decent draw support option, but I also don't think most decks have the bench space or deck space to accomodate for it. Running things like Acro Bike to extend your hand seems like the best option nowadays. Doesn't clog your deck or your bench and can always be played at any time.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top