Pyroar Ideas and Possibilities

Right now there are about 14 main competitive decks (IMHO) in format right now:
VirGen (/DCE /Balloons variants)
RayBoar
Blastoise
Trev-Gor
Yeti (/Kyurem /Aromatisse /Tech variants)
Empoleon
Darkrai Yveltal (/Garb /Bouff /Hydreigon /Dusknoir variants)
Aromatisse (/Xerneas /Yeti /Puerta Rican /Plasma Pokémon /Klinklang variants)
Raichu Dugtrio Eevee-lutions DCE thingy deck
Ho-Oh decks (/notreallysuretoomany variants)
Ninetails
Weavile
Tool Drop
Kingdra/Greninja

How do you feel each of these decks will face against Pyroar's rath?
Specifically decks like RayBoar or Blastoise who'd have to rely on either their setup (draw 4/6) pokemon or their attaching pokemon?
Is it worth it to G-booster or tech in 1-1 lines of pokemon (Garb) just for Pyroar?
 
In regards to Pyroar being possibly "game-changing," as suggested earlier, let's take under consideration Elbow's list (thank you) of 14 competitive decks (and I'll add 2 more) vs. Pyroar-included decks (yet to be determined) and examine how much (high level) of an impact Pyroar might have in those particular match-ups. Following are some of my thoughts:

  • Aromatisse variants. Assuming Aromatisse is the only stage 1/2 Poké in the deck, these players need only to add Hard Charm to prevent a KO. On the other hand, Aromatisse can attack and KO a Pyroar with laserBank. And since Aromatisse decks have some type of healing, Aromatisse can be healed and return to the bench. Also, Aromatisse decks will have energy attachment acceleration and manipulation; so, advantage (albeit small): Aromatisse.
  • Blastoise. Pyroar is easily 1HKOd by Blastoise, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Blastoise.
  • Darkrai variants (without evolutions). Currently, these decks (assuming only basic Poké are in the deck) will be impacted by Pyroar somewhat... IF the Lilteo can survive the expected Night Spear attacks and evolve to Pyroar. Also, the Darkrai deck players (at least the ones I've seen) play Catcher and LaserBank. And Darkrai deck players have energy attachment acceleration too. So, advantage (small): Darkrai variants (without evolutions).
  • Darkrai variants (with evolutions e.g., Hydreigon or Garbodor). Pyroar is easily 1HKOd, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Darkrai variants (with evolutions).
  • Empoleon. Pyroar is easily 1HKOd, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Empoleon.
  • Gourgeist-Dusknoir (1 of the 2 decks I'm using to augment Elbow's list). With damage counter "drops" and "movement", Pyroar will not impact this deck either. Advantage: Gourgeist-Dusknoir.
  • Ho-Oh. I have yet to see a deck built around this Poké (probably due to a significant number of Blastoise decks being played in my area); although I have seen it as a tech in a few decks at some tournaments. I'll just concede the matchup advantage to decks running Pyroar.
  • Kingdra-Greninja. This is another fun deck to play since you have a great combo of Water Shuriken(s) followed by either Kingdra's Tri-Bullet or Dragon Vortex. Pyroar is easily 1HKOd, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Kingdra-Greninja.
  • Ninetails. Expect Lilteo and/or Pyroar to just be Bright Look'd and 1HKOd having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Ninetails.
  • PlasmaBox (2nd of the 2 decks I'm using to augment Elbow's list). There are several variations of this deck. These decks (assuming only basic Poké are in the deck) will be impacted by Pyroar somewhat... IF the Lilteo can survive the expected Frost Spear attacks and evolve to Pyroar. Also, some of these deck players (at least the ones I've seen) play Genesect (for Red Signal) or Catcher. And PlasmaBox deck players have energy attachment acceleration too. So, advantage: PlasmaBox.
  • Raichu-Dugtrio-Eeveelutions. All evolutions.... Pyroar can be easily 1HKOd, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Raichu-Dugtrio-Eeveelutions.
  • RayBoar (or RayBoarPhox). In either case, Pyroar can be easily 1HKOd by the supporting stage 2 Poké in these decks rendering Pyroar's impact to little, if any at all. Advantage: RayBoar/Phox.
  • Trevenant-Accelgor. Mostly evolutions comprise this deck and this deck can also apply certain "locks"; so, I expect Pyroar to have no impact on this deck either. Advantage: Trev-Gor.
  • Tool Drop. I have yet to see this deck played at any major tournament (e.g., States) and although this deck is supported by a stage 1 Poké, it (i.e., Masquerain) may not prove strong enough to counter Pyroar. I'll just concede the matchup advantage to decks running Pyroar.
  • VirGen without Balloons. I expect VG deck players to just Red Signal the Lilteos and then just 1HKO them. With energy attachment acceleration, "Catcher" ability, and immunization to Status Conditions, I don't see Pyroar's impact being significant on this deck either. Advantage: VirGen without Balloons.
  • VirGen with Balloons. All the above comments; plus now, you have an evolution that can also 1HKO Pyroar with Laser Bank). Again, I don't see Pyroar impact this deck either. Advantage: VirGen with Balloons.
  • Yeti. I've only seen 1 player play a version of this deck in my area and the variant deck I've seen run contained primarily Team Plasma Poké, all of which were basic; so, Pyroar may impact this deck somewhat. However, if the Yeti deck player plays Genesect EX, he/she can just Catcher and KO the Lilteos or other opponent's Poké, essentially "play around" Pyroar. Advantage: Yeti.
  • Weavile. This is another deck based upon a Poké evolution, and this deck also has energy acceleration attachment too. Pyroar is easily countered, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Weavile.
Overwhelmingly, most competitive decks (especially in the hands of skilled players), I believe, will not be greatly affected by an opponent's Pyroar. Pyroar as a "game-changing" Poké... I still don't believe so, but I welcome others' thoughts.
 
Despite it not being the best card, does anyone think it would be in any way helpful to run a small line of Pyroar in any deck (probably fire based)? Obviously not as a main player but maybe as a counter to some EX's?
 
TuxedoBlack said:
In regards to Pyroar being possibly "game-changing," as suggested earlier, let's take under consideration Elbow's list (thank you) of 14 competitive decks (and I'll add 2 more) vs. Pyroar-included decks (yet to be determined) and examine how much (high level) of an impact Pyroar might have in those particular match-ups. Following are some of my thoughts:

  • Aromatisse variants. Assuming Aromatisse is the only stage 1/2 Poké in the deck, these players need only to add Hard Charm to prevent a KO. On the other hand, Aromatisse can attack and KO a Pyroar with laserBank. And since Aromatisse decks have some type of healing, Aromatisse can be healed and return to the bench. Also, Aromatisse decks will have energy attachment acceleration and manipulation; so, advantage (albeit small): Aromatisse.
  • Blastoise. Pyroar is easily 1HKOd by Blastoise, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Blastoise.
  • Darkrai variants (without evolutions). Currently, these decks (assuming only basic Poké are in the deck) will be impacted by Pyroar somewhat... IF the Lilteo can survive the expected Night Spear attacks and evolve to Pyroar. Also, the Darkrai deck players (at least the ones I've seen) play Catcher and LaserBank. And Darkrai deck players have energy attachment acceleration too. So, advantage (small): Darkrai variants (without evolutions).
  • Darkrai variants (with evolutions e.g., Hydreigon or Garbodor). Pyroar is easily 1HKOd, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Darkrai variants (with evolutions).
  • Empoleon. Pyroar is easily 1HKOd, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Empoleon.
  • Gourgeist-Dusknoir (1 of the 2 decks I'm using to augment Elbow's list). With damage counter "drops" and "movement", Pyroar will not impact this deck either. Advantage: Gourgeist-Dusknoir.
  • Ho-Oh. I have yet to see a deck built around this Poké (probably due to a significant number of Blastoise decks being played in my area); although I have seen it as a tech in a few decks at some tournaments. I'll just concede the matchup advantage to decks running Pyroar.
  • Kingdra-Greninja. This is another fun deck to play since you have a great combo of Water Shuriken(s) followed by either Kingdra's Tri-Bullet or Dragon Vortex. Pyroar is easily 1HKOd, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Kingdra-Greninja.
  • Ninetails. Expect Lilteo and/or Pyroar to just be Bright Look'd and 1HKOd having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Ninetails.
  • PlasmaBox (2nd of the 2 decks I'm using to augment Elbow's list). There are several variations of this deck. These decks (assuming only basic Poké are in the deck) will be impacted by Pyroar somewhat... IF the Lilteo can survive the expected Frost Spear attacks and evolve to Pyroar. Also, some of these deck players (at least the ones I've seen) play Genesect (for Red Signal) or Catcher. And PlasmaBox deck players have energy attachment acceleration too. So, advantage: PlasmaBox.
  • Raichu-Dugtrio-Eeveelutions. All evolutions.... Pyroar can be easily 1HKOd, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Raichu-Dugtrio-Eeveelutions.
  • RayBoar (or RayBoarPhox). In either case, Pyroar can be easily 1HKOd by the supporting stage 2 Poké in these decks rendering Pyroar's impact to little, if any at all. Advantage: RayBoar/Phox.
  • Trevenant-Accelgor. Mostly evolutions comprise this deck and this deck can also apply certain "locks"; so, I expect Pyroar to have no impact on this deck either. Advantage: Trev-Gor.
  • Tool Drop. I have yet to see this deck played at any major tournament (e.g., States) and although this deck is supported by a stage 1 Poké, it (i.e., Masquerain) may not prove strong enough to counter Pyroar. I'll just concede the matchup advantage to decks running Pyroar.
  • VirGen without Balloons. I expect VG deck players to just Red Signal the Lilteos and then just 1HKO them. With energy attachment acceleration, "Catcher" ability, and immunization to Status Conditions, I don't see Pyroar's impact being significant on this deck either. Advantage: VirGen without Balloons.
  • VirGen with Balloons. All the above comments; plus now, you have an evolution that can also 1HKO Pyroar with Laser Bank). Again, I don't see Pyroar impact this deck either. Advantage: VirGen with Balloons.
  • Yeti. I've only seen 1 player play a version of this deck in my area and the variant deck I've seen run contained primarily Team Plasma Poké, all of which were basic; so, Pyroar may impact this deck somewhat. However, if the Yeti deck player plays Genesect EX, he/she can just Catcher and KO the Lilteos or other opponent's Poké, essentially "play around" Pyroar. Advantage: Yeti.
  • Weavile. This is another deck based upon a Poké evolution, and this deck also has energy acceleration attachment too. Pyroar is easily countered, having NO impact on this deck at all. Advantage: Weavile.
Overwhelmingly, most competitive decks (especially in the hands of skilled players), I believe, will not be greatly affected by an opponent's Pyroar. Pyroar as a "game-changing" Poké... I still don't believe so, but I welcome others' thoughts.
Click to expand...

I agree with many of the things you say, but using Genesect EX to attack the pokemon you can damage isn't the problem. Let's say you are running Yeti/VirGen (without balloons) and are against Pyroar. Yes, you can target 3 of the Litleo's, but the last one can only be one-shot by a G-booster. Pyroar decks will most likely run EXP share/Flame torch, so they can easily set up another Pyroar...AKA one-shotting all VirGen. It also is a huge waste in Yeti to always red signal up attackable pokemon. In a way it is avoiding the bigger target.
Also attacking with Aromatisse is like the number 1 thing you don't do with Aromatisse...
 
Now I don't think that that list is that accurate. Especially if you are playing Archeops / Pyroar. This is what it should look like:
  • VirGen Pyroar (Weakness wins)
  • RayBoar Based off how fast you get Archeops out and how many Reshiram they run.
  • Blastoise Based off how fast you get Archeops out.
  • Trev-Gor Based off how fast you get Archeops out.
  • Yeti Pyroar
  • Darkrai Yveltal Pyroar (Darkgarb isn't played much anymore and they can't get garb out if you get Archeops out first.)
  • Aromatisse Based off how many non-EX attackers they run and how fast you get Archeops out. (I only run a 2-2 Aromatisse line...)
  • Raichu Dugtrio Eevee-lutions DCE thingy deck Pyroar (Arcehops wrecks them.)
  • Ho-Oh decks Pyroar
  • Weavile Based off how fast you get Archeops out.
  • Kingdra/Greninja Based off how fast you get Archeops out.
 
So, basically; get out Twist Mountain and hope to flip heads, or luck out on the Plume Fossil. If you do, you're set for the win, since you'll get Archeops out before they can do anything.
 
Scorched Feathers said:
So, basically; get out Twist Mountain and hope to flip heads, or luck out on the Plume Fossil. If you do, you're set for the win, since you'll get Archeops out before they can do anything.
Click to expand...
53-archen.jpg


But yeah if you get an Archeops out before they get anything out then you win.
 
Oh yeah, and it's usually a good idea to use Evosoda, since it's one of the very few cards that can get around Archeops, allowing you to evolve.
 
Scorched Feathers said:
Oh yeah, and it's usually a good idea to use Evosoda, since it's one of the very few cards that can get around Archeops, allowing you to evolve.
Click to expand...
Exactly why this deck is so good... You can get multiple Archeops out as well as Pyroars.
 
Pryoar is the card I'm most looking forward to playing around with. Here's what I am thinking:

Pokemon:
  • 2 Litleo
  • 2 Pyroar
  • 1 Sigilyph
  • 2 Latias EX
  • 1 Mr. Mime
  • 1 Virizion EX
  • 1 Darkrai EX or 1 Spiritbomb
Trainers:
  • 4 Random Receiver
  • 4 Ghetsis
  • 3 Professor Juniper
  • 2 Skyla
  • 2 Level Ball
  • 2 Ultra Ball
  • 1 Evosoda
  • 3 Professor's Letter
  • 1 Energy Retrieval
  • 1 Max Potion
  • 1 Shadow Circle
  • 3 Silver Mirror
  • 3 Hypnotoxic Laser
  • 3 Crushing Hammer
  • 2 Enhanced Hammer
  • 2 Tool Scrapper
Energy:
  • 4 Blend Energy (Grass, Dark, Psychic & Fire - this deck was meant to happen)
  • 4 Prism Energy
  • 3 Fire Energy
  • 3 Psychic Energy

I want to call it 'Can't Touch This'.

I1lucky said:
Hey guys I was looking at the scans for wild blaze/flash fire and I found pyroar a pokemon I think will be a good mon to form a deck or 2 around. Basically pyroar is untouchable to all basics including exes making it a great counter to plasma and big basics decks not to mention the fact that it's untouchable by yveltal EX which is becoming very popular I'm thinking it could take trevanent's spot in an accelgor or palikia ex deck abusing float stones to get it on the bench and strafe or deck and cover back into the pyroar

Any ideas for other partners for pyroar? Discuss!
Click to expand...
 
Hi TuxedoBlack,

That list does not sound accurate.

Aromatisse variants do not want to attack with Aromatisse since it cannot ohko Pyroar but he would be able to ohko Aromatisse. In short Faries deck do not have an answer to Pyroar thus far.

Dark Rush decks will need to incorporate either Raichu or Zorurak to have an answer to Pyroar. Both do not seem to take much away from the deck since the stage one attackers are at least decent on their own and also benefit the deck in other matches.

Plasma will have issues unless it can fit a 2-2 stage one line into the deck that also works versus other decks. same holds for VirGen. Although VirGen can G-Booster Pyroar another one can ohko the active Genesect due to weakness. Thus VirGen has a bad match versus fire decks that run Pyroar and another decent attacker.

Raindance decks can handle Pyroar. RayBoar has a better match up since he can send out delphox and does not need to expose his energy acceleration stage two line which is actually what Fire Rush deck will want raindance decks to do because it will force them to replace their acceleration line within one turn in addition to the energies that will be discarded once the acceleration line is revenge ohkoed.

You also listed some stage one decks and it is not a surpirse that neither of them will have issues with Pyroar since he does not block either of their attackers from attacking and thus does not slow them down at all.

In a nutshell Pyroar can be beaten but he will also force decks that rely entirely on basic Pokémon to come up with an answer to Pyroar's attack lockdown. while this can be achieved in most decks with a small 2-2 stage one tech line it will force decks to take tech stage one lines into consideration. I assume this is all that the designers wanted to achieve with this card.
 
Dark Espeon said:
Aromatisse variants do not want to attack with Aromatisse since it cannot ohko Pyroar but he would be able to ohko Aromatisse. In short Faries deck do not have an answer to Pyroar thus far.
Click to expand...
Greetings DE.

I completely understand that players do not want to attack with his/her Aromatisse, Blastoise, Emboar, etc., but one can if need be. I'm only suggesting one could commit a Aromatisse (only evolution in the deck that COULD attack Pyroar) when it could KO a Pyroar (e.g., using laser Bank, Lilteo was damaged earlier, etc.).

Dark Espeon said:
Plasma will have issues unless it can fit a 2-2 stage one line into the deck that also works versus other decks. same holds for VirGen. Although VirGen can G-Booster Pyroar another one can ohko the active Genesect due to weakness. Thus VirGen has a bad match versus fire decks that run Pyroar and another decent attacker.
Click to expand...
Perhaps, but PlasmaBox and VirGen decks also have opportunities to KO the Lilteos first, thus avoiding (or postponing Pyroar). And let's not forget that there will be other possible, prime targets in the Pyroar deck that could be Catchered and KOd too.

Dark Espeon said:
Raindance decks can handle Pyroar. RayBoar has a better match up since he can send out delphox and does not need to expose his energy acceleration stage two line which is actually what Fire Rush deck will want raindance decks to do because it will force them to replace their acceleration line within one turn in addition to the energies that will be discarded once the acceleration line is revenge ohkoed.
Click to expand...
Currently, I've noticed Blastoise decks run perhaps a 4-0-3 line most often, others 3-0-3. And most players I've observed at tournaments do have 2 benched Blastoise. So, to use one to KO a Pyroar would not seem to be a big issue for Blastoise players at all. The remaining benched Blastoise will keep the energy attachment acceleration engine going. Same holds true for RayBoar players too.

Dark Espeon said:
In a nutshell Pyroar can be beaten but he will also force decks that rely entirely on basic Pokémon to come up with an answer to Pyroar's attack lockdown.
Click to expand...
Agreed.

Let's not forget my original comments regarding Pyroar - I do not think it will be "game-changing" like some of the other great cards we've had over history. I do think players (running all basic Poké) will need to adapt their decks and game strategy to account for it going forward. But since Pyroar does not affect several of the main, top decks, I do not consider it "game changing".
 
The thing with Aromatisse is that it gets one shot by pyroar... And considering most decks run a 2-2...3-3 at the most why would you want to waste him? He only 2HKOs them and no Aromatisse deck runs laserbank as there is no room. I guess if he's your only option, but then again you will most likely run a giratina EX or rayquaza or something with the shred attack to get through him. Blastoise and Emboar who have a lot of hp can take a hit and many decks run 4-0-3 of them like you said. Also litleos aren't the problem. Your opponent will not be running 7 litleos, so catchering up each one and Koing it would be bad as your opponent still will always have a 2HKO invincible attacker every turn.
 
If I was to play pyroar, I would personally run the card in an aggressive style deck rather than a defensive deck. Pairing pyroar with archeops may be viable but it will lack consistency whearas pairing pyroar with rayquaza/emboar will possibly be better. Instead of focussing a deck around pyroar it self, focus a deck around pyroars ability to disrupt and delay your opponent. Including pyroar into rayboar adds yet another way to give you an advantage with setting up. Everyone says that tropical beach is definitely needed in rayboar, but with pyroar to provide early game disruption, tropical beach may not be needed. This may be good for players who don't have access to tropical beach.

Furthermore, playing pyroar in rayboar adds another decision for you opponent to take into consideration: 'shall I focus on targeting the litleo/pyroar or the tepig/emboar'. This decision will occur mostly with decks like plasma, vizgen or darkrai which all have access to cards like catcher, escape rope or genesect ex which can all selectively target your opponents benched pokemon. Pyroar also provides a late game out in which if you are losing in prizes, a quick pyroar will catch your opponent off guard since they probably won't have set up for it and thus you can quickly regain some prizes while they find a counter for it.
 
Card Slinger J said:
I1lucky said:
That's a good idea but the problem would be to set it up being a stage 2 I think I would rather just put in the new megaphone card
Click to expand...

Goodra actually got it's ability changed to, "As often as you like during your turn (before you attack), you may discard an Energy attached to this Pokemon. If you do, heal 60 HP from this Pokemon." So yeah you're better off with Surprise Megaphone when Tool Scrapper gets rotated out next season.

As for Pyroar it helps against Keldeo EX in the Blastoise/Keldeo matchup but it doesn't take much for them to Deluge energies onto Blastoise to one shot Pyroar especially when they can get around it's high retreat cost with Switch. Any deck running Fire needs to run at least a 2-2 or 3-3 Leafeon line to get around Blastoise so If you're running Leafeon with Pyroar/Delphox you should be fine.
Click to expand...

Do you know which sets are getting rotated out next season sir?
 
Mr.Pokeman said:
Card Slinger J said:
Goodra actually got it's ability changed to, "As often as you like during your turn (before you attack), you may discard an Energy attached to this Pokemon. If you do, heal 60 HP from this Pokemon." So yeah you're better off with Surprise Megaphone when Tool Scrapper gets rotated out next season.

As for Pyroar it helps against Keldeo EX in the Blastoise/Keldeo matchup but it doesn't take much for them to Deluge energies onto Blastoise to one shot Pyroar especially when they can get around it's high retreat cost with Switch. Any deck running Fire needs to run at least a 2-2 or 3-3 Leafeon line to get around Blastoise so If you're running Leafeon with Pyroar/Delphox you should be fine.
Click to expand...

Do you know which sets are getting rotated out next season sir?
Click to expand...

Nooobody knooows~ *waves arms*
I'm honestly sad that Archeops will be 100% rotated out... it's like the best thing for Pyroar.
 
I really want to try to put Pyroar as a strict tech in something, just to see how he does.
 
I don't think fairies will have an issue with pyroar and neither will plasma, they both can simply tech in a single shred pokemon to deal with it. Plasma can run Giratina EX or fairies could run Cobalion EX also to OHKO a pyroar with a muscle band. Not to mention it would help against other safeguard decks.

I think pyroar will achieve the goal of shaking up the meta decks but not overturning them.
 
Cortel II said:
I don't think fairies will have an issue with pyroar and neither will plasma, they both can simply tech in a single shred pokemon to deal with it. Plasma can run Giratina EX or fairies could run Cobalion EX also to OHKO a pyroar with a muscle band. Not to mention it would help against other safeguard decks.

I think pyroar will achieve the goal of shaking up the meta decks but not overturning them.
Click to expand...

I agree, but this cards is going to be at T1-T2 and we will see it so often. Since it is the best counter for every Big basic deck. Just need a surprise megaphone to counter garbodor, and some huge "sweepers" like Charizard-EX/Entei-EX to complete the game (Despite Entei going out next rotation).
 
I actually doubt Pyroar will need these "sweepers" that you speak of. I think it would be viable doing the attacking and pairing this guy with LaserBank to be aggressive. Muscle Band Pyroar and you have a Pokémon that doesn't take damage from EXs and can deal 80 (or 110) by T2. Then, set up the other three you have in your deck. You can put the pressure on pretty quickly. I only have a problem with Blastoise still being a thing. Pyroar will definitely shake the meta but it won't be unstoppable because Special Conditions, damage counter placement (with Dusknoir?), and Evolved Pokémon in decks like Blastoise and Emboar can slow down Pyroar if the threat is recognized early.
 
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