Reshiphlosion or ZPST?

Which deck should I build?

  • Total voters
    30
Serperior

Serperior

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I'm going to do my best to get back into the game competitively this year. And I wanna do well.

The two decks that seem to be doing the best right now are Reshiphlosion and ZPST, or Zekrom Variants. (I'm not going for MegaZone because that's out of my budget.)

Which deck should I run, and why? I'm stuck between these two.

And don't tell me to check my metagame. I haven't played in a tournament for about two years.
 
ZPST hands down. As to why Reshiphlosion is getting those numbers is beyond me, but ZPST is basically 50-50 across the board, barring Mew which it destroys and Reuniclus which it flat-out loses to. However, it's incredibly fast and gets plenty of donks, and donks make all those 50-50 and even un-winnable matchups become favorable at times.

3-4 Mew and 1 Relnicath can help the Goth matchup a lot (hurl Tornadus), but Relnicath starts suck otherwise and Mews are probably out of your budget if Yanmega/Magnezone is. Still, if the deck is not big in your area then you're probably fine.

Be aware of Vileplume/Reuniclus/Donphan decks too, because those will run through you Mew or not. However, they haven't been doing so hot, mostly because they're under-represented in a timed format.
 
ZPST. The Yanmega I would say is a very important piece of the deck, and it hurts your Stage 1s Matchup not to have it. ZPST has 50-50 against MegaZone, Gothitelle, and DonMega, a 45-55 against Stage 1s and TyRam, and like a 90-10 against Mew varients. The tough decks are DD and google, so if you don;t think those will be played highly, use ZPST. Thise statistics are without donks, and no Yanmega.

TyRam is a very good, and cheap play. It has 50-50 against most things, with a good Mew matchup, an ok google matchup, and an ok Gothitelle matchup. Beware Zoroark though.
 
I'm going to go with ZPST. The reason I say this is because it has excellent matchups across the board, as Celebi23 stated. TyRam is fine too, but unless you start with a Shaymin, you should be fine (heck, even Pachi can donk :p). As long as the right player has the right build, ZPST should win almost every matchup. Bad starts are easier to have in TyRam than in ZPST (of course, ZPST is probably the worst donk deck somebody could choose to use in Unlimited).
 
I personally would go with Reshiphlosion, it seems a lot more consistent than anything with the Pachi-Shaymin engine, but that is just my preference I guess. ZPST will lose to a good Donphan player, Ruins of Alph turns Tornadus from a counter, to something easily 2 shotted, not to mention the amount of Donphans that will care Zekrom. Reshiphlosion really has no auto losses, and is solid all across the board, assuming you can make a list that can set up fast enough. Not to mention it is about 5 times cheaper price wise.
 
Oh my. This is definitely poll-worthy...

I see we have more ZPST-lovers. I personally would love to have the speed ZPST does, but with all those Basics, what if you don't start with Zekrom? It seems a little less consistent to me. (Then again, I don't play competitively...so...I'm probably wrong.)
 
ZPST, ZPST, ZPST. With Tornadus and Catcher out now (and Eviolite coming soon, meaning -40 damage per turn for Zekrom), ZPST is BDIF hands-down. Say what you will, but it will bring home the most BRs and Cities at the very least (and I would bet on Fall Regionals as well). ZPST really has no autolosses or even any terribly bad matchups. Oh, and it's amazing in Sudden Death. TyRam is good, but not near the level of ZPST.

EDIT (ninja'd): If you don't start with Zekrom, it's not a big deal. Tornadus is a fine starter as well, and running 7 of the two combined means you'll start with that a large amount of the time. Besides, you'll probably run SSU/Switch anyways, so critter starts aren't a huge issue. Getting a T1 120 isn't all-important now that Zekrom has a late-game.
 
Vulpix Yolk said:
I personally would go with Reshiphlosion, it seems a lot more consistent than anything with the Pachi-Shaymin engine, but that is just my preference I guess. ZPST will lose to a good Donphan player, Ruins of Alph turns Tornadus from a counter, to something easily 2 shotted, not to mention the amount of Donphans that will care Zekrom. Reshiphlosion really has no auto losses, and is solid all across the board, assuming you can make a list that can set up fast enough. Not to mention it is about 5 times cheaper price wise.
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After you drop Ruins of Alph, it becomes somewhat likely Zekrom will be able to OHKO Donphan. Reshiphlosion basically auto-loses to Gothitelle and to most Vileplume decks.

EspeonROX said:
Oh my. This is definitely poll-worthy...

I see we have more ZPST-lovers. I personally would love to have the speed ZPST does, but with all those Basics, what if you don't start with Zekrom? It seems a little less consistent to me. (Then again, I don't play competitively...so...I'm probably wrong.)
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Well with 4 Zekrom, 4 Tornadus, 3 Mew and potentially a Cleffa or Tyrogue, you've got a huge amount of basics that mean a good start. Plus, with only 2 Pachi and 2 Shaymin, combined with 2 Switch and potentially some SSU, the chance of not getting a good start is really low.

Tornadus is actually the best T1 attacker for the deck because it doesn't waste as many energy and doesn't damage itself.
 
Mew Prime? In ZPST? I'd rather cut that for more T/S/S that'd grab me Zekrom and Tornadus. Therefore, I wouldn't need Rainbow Energy either.

Sounds like I'm building ZPST lol. I'm gonna make a list soon, but you guys can continue discussing why one is better than the other.

What makes Reshiphlosion not as good as ZPST? Or why do you think it is better than ZPST? I want more feedback on Reshiphlosion.
 
With Defender (Evolite) and Tornadus, ZPST is basically a faster Reshiphlosion.

And yes, Mew Prime. And Relicanth (Rainbow? lolwhat?). And arguably Bellsprout. Those cards just make such a difference against Gothitelle and googlebox that there's really no reason not to run them. It's four to five spots to make 2 of your 3 otherwise un-winnable (seriously 10-90) matchups winnable. All that got cut from my list was clutch draw (Relicanth almost serves as this though), Tyrogue and 1-2 Defender/Energy Exchanger. Tyrogue was mostly there for Goth/Plume in the first place. I wish the deck had that same kind of tech for Magneboar.
 
Actually, just being able to Bellsprout up a Reuniclus can let ZPST beat G/R or googlebox, in which case you would only need 2 of them, which seems like a far smaller investment than Mew. Now to sit back and wait for someone to argue that G/R can set up 2 Gothitelle and 2 Reuniclus by t2...
 
^GR can set up 2 Goth and 2 Reuniclus T2 so easily it's crazy. Lol jk but I actually do have an argument.

Firstly, Bellsprout has a retreat cost and 20 less HP than Mew, so it's automatically a horrible start for the deck. Mew has 60HP and free retreat, so it's automatically a great start. Mew is there to OHKO Gothitelles mostly - no point in going for Reuniclus against a deck running Switch and often DCE. When you're already running Mew and Relicanth for Gothitelle, Bellsprout becomes a 1-card investment.

Also, against Vileplume/Reuniclus, you always go for Vileplume. Then you can Catcher Reuniclus later.
 
Scizorliscious said:
ZPST, ZPST, ZPST. With Tornadus and Catcher out now (and Eviolite coming soon, meaning -40 damage per turn for Zekrom), ZPST is BDIF hands-down. Say what you will, but it will bring home the most BRs and Cities at the very least (and I would bet on Fall Regionals as well). ZPST really has no autolosses or even any terribly bad matchups. Oh, and it's amazing in Sudden Death. TyRam is good, but not near the level of ZPST.
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Oddly enough I'm seeing Defender being played in place of Eviolite in ZPST, as for the deck yes it's amazingly good. It won BR's in my area and it's already proved to be the BDIF for HGSS-On. Reshiphlosion may be cheap but in terms of power and speed it doesn't come close to ZPST.
 
Well, in terms of power, Reshiphlosion does come close to ZPST...they both have the same max damage output. ZPST is way faster though and that is pretty handy, although I find it far less versatile, with no room for techs. Still, its a good choice.
 
Card Slinger J said:
Oddly enough I'm seeing Defender being played in place of Eviolite in ZPST
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What? Eviolite is basically a permanent Defender for anything in ZPST. Once it's out, it'll be much better than Defender for any purpose...
 
Scizorliscious said:
What? Eviolite is basically a permanent Defender for anything in ZPST. Once it's out, it'll be much better than Defender for any purpose...
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I think he means Defendering being played in ZPST right now, since there is no Eviolite in the format at the moment.
 
^Well then it's not being played "in place of it," is it? I thought that was what he meant at first too, but Eviolite isn't out yet.
 
Dark Void said:
Well, in terms of power, Reshiphlosion does come close to ZPST...they both have the same max damage output. ZPST is way faster though and that is pretty handy, although I find it far less versatile, with no room for techs. Still, its a good choice.
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Except ZPST generally runs 3-4 PlusPower and 4 Junk Arm so theoretically its damage cap is higher. Also if we're going to get picky, Zekrom does 160 damage per Bolt Strike and Reshiram does 120 per Blue Flare.

Also, it has room for techs. It just doesn't have many good techs to run. They have to be free retreating basics or basics that can do 50+ damage T1.
 
Ok, why is Reshiphlosion getting more votes if ZPST is the way to go? Someone just give me a list of pros and cons.
 
Because this is 'Beach lol. There's no explaining some of the things that happen on this site playing skill/strategy wise lol. It's probably because Reshiram is easier to play so a lot of people are getting falsely good results for Reshiram after playing both decks.

Zekrom Pros:
-Can donk
-Tornadus covers Zekrom's weakness well
-Plays well in timed environment
-Barring Magneboar, googlebox and Goth (depending on your list) it has 50-50 to favorable across the board

Zekrom Cons:
-Pachi/Shaymin starts are horrible
-It takes a reasonable amount of skill to know when to promote Zekrom vs spamming Tornadus
-It (rarely) fizzles late-game


Reshiram Pros:
-It has built-in draw with Ninetales
-Once it sets up, it's hard to take it down
-No self damage after attacking

Reshiram Cons:
-It has a much worse Mewbox and Stage 1 matchup than Zekrom, but Magneboar, google and Goth are all just as bad if not worse
-It's slow
-It relies on bench support
-You have to scoop up your cards whenever they flip over a water Pokemon
-It can't donk and performs worse than Zekrom in 30+3
-It's not Zekrom :p
 
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