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Samuzor (Scizor/Samurott) HGSS ON

RE: TurnOr (Scizor/Lanturn) HGSS ON

xDMVx said:
Tyranodon said:
xDMVx said:
-2-2 Lanturn
-1 PETM
-3 electric
-1 dual ball
-1 juniper

+2-1-2 samurott
+2 rainbow
+1 DCE
+2 rare candy

Fire decks will eat you alive and lanturn is not a viable counter to fire imo because it gets OHKOD by fire decks poster child Reshiram. Also Samurott can abuse DCE if needed and rainbows will work towards the water requirement on heavier things like Emboar. Also Samurott can kill umbreon as you mentioned id leave Bouffalant in however since RDL will be seeing a ton of play this format.

Edit~ id probably also do -1 twins, -1 exchanger for 2 IQ to pull special energies more easily.
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I'm not sure about this as getting out a stage 2 against reshiboar is hard and if you do manage it they will have taken almost all their prizes. I will consider this change though.
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True unfortunately lanturn prime needs too many energies to be OHKO right back. Samurott has a bit more staying power as an anti fire tech. If the main thing you want to counter is reshiboar I suggest 2-2 Zoroark with either a few special dark or plupower as it will OHKO reshiram and RDL.
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Just tried out my list at the top of page 2 with your changes. I played on redshark against a very average and consistent reshiboar list. Game 1 I got completely thrashed losing 6 prizes to 1 (taken with scizor) they had an emboar out T3 and I couldn't get out the samurott. I even struggled to get out a scizor as all I could draw into was a Skarmory till about T4/5 when I got a communication. Game 2 I managed to win as I started with skarmory and hoothoot with a collector in my hand. I got a scizor doing damage out by T2 to knock out Cleffas in 2 consecutive turns. I also managed to OHKO a Reshiram with scizor as I had 4 sp metals and 1 rainbow attached to it thanks to skarmory when that got knocked out by a reshiram I brought Bouffalant up from the bench to do 90 and then when he got KO'D I brought up a benched scizor who finished it off. Next turn I started settting up a samurott on the bench as I had a rare candy, rainbow energy and samurott in my hand as well as an oshawott on the bench. I then ko'd the reshiram and then his other set up reshiram couldnt take out samurott so I finished it off with 160 (x2 weakness).

Sorry for such a long post and match description I just wanted to show how this change works very well but isn't consistent at all. I was thinking of making the samurott line either 2-2-2 or 3-2-3 as a main or secondary attacker rather than a tech so I can get it out a lot quicker when I am playing a heavy hitting or fire deck. Any other tips for consistency?
 
RE: TurnOr (Scizor/Lanturn) HGSS ON

The main issue seems to be getting those basics earlier. So maybe add another collector. You could up it to a 3-2-3 line Samurott since he makes a nice pair with Scizor as a fire counter and to absorb hits. I would try maybe cleffa as a starter(or 2 cleffa 2 skarmory) with a few IQ's. Skarmory ive always felt is kinda meh i mean yes he gets those special metals out soon but with cleffa you would get 6 cards to set up the rest of what you need and IQ can draw into the special energies you have. Ill keep looking over the list and see what i can tune. Also test a bit more 3 games isnt a good consistency test imo.
 
RE: TurnOr (Scizor/Lanturn) HGSS ON

xDMVx said:
The main issue seems to be getting those basics earlier. So maybe add another collector. You could up it to a 3-2-3 line Samurott since he makes a nice pair with Scizor as a fire counter and to absorb hits. I would try maybe cleffa as a starter(or 2 cleffa 2 skarmory) with a few IQ's. Skarmory ive always felt is kinda meh i mean yes he gets those special metals out soon but with cleffa you would get 6 cards to set up the rest of what you need and IQ can draw into the special energies you have. Ill keep looking over the list and see what i can tune. Also test a bit more 3 games isnt a good consistency test imo.
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I originally had IQ'S in but I felt I had quite a lot of supporters so I always had higher priorities such as twins, collector and seeker were used more. In terms of Cleffa I disagree one of the reasons I like skarmory is the way it can take a hit often at the start of the game before being retreated with the metal energy attached to use the attack. I will definantly test at least 7-8 games before I decide to change anything in the real deck but I do think that Samurott is probably a better partner than lanturn as nothing can really OHKO samurott without hitting for weakness. I am considering maxing out PONT in place of judge as I feel the disruption isn't as key as hitting those key cards. Thanks for your help so far.
 
RE: TurnOr (Scizor/Lanturn) HGSS ON

Tyranodon said:
xDMVx said:
The main issue seems to be getting those basics earlier. So maybe add another collector. You could up it to a 3-2-3 line Samurott since he makes a nice pair with Scizor as a fire counter and to absorb hits. I would try maybe cleffa as a starter(or 2 cleffa 2 skarmory) with a few IQ's. Skarmory ive always felt is kinda meh i mean yes he gets those special metals out soon but with cleffa you would get 6 cards to set up the rest of what you need and IQ can draw into the special energies you have. Ill keep looking over the list and see what i can tune. Also test a bit more 3 games isnt a good consistency test imo.
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I originally had IQ'S in but I felt I had quite a lot of supporters so I always had higher priorities such as twins, collector and seeker were used more. In terms of Cleffa I disagree one of the reasons I like skarmory is the way it can take a hit often at the start of the game before being retreated with the metal energy attached to use the attack. I will definantly test at least 7-8 games before I decide to change anything in the real deck but I do think that Samurott is probably a better partner than lanturn as nothing can really OHKO samurott without hitting for weakness. I am considering maxing out PONT in place of judge as I feel the disruption isn't as key as hitting those key cards. Thanks for your help so far.
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Well IQ could help since you do run quite a bit of special energy. Im torn on the disruption thing however. PONT will hit those key cards better but judge's can really mess up Reshiboar especially early game before too many ninetales get up. I like skarmory as well for all matches not Reshiboar since it wont matter how many special metals are on scizor he will be OHKO'd. I dont really like Cleffa it was just a suggestion to help speed up as you mentioned it felt clunky. Samurott is definitely a better partner because it survives hits from emboar, Reshiram and RDL (providing they have no pluspowers) and can destroy Donphan.
 
RE: TurnOr (Scizor/Lanturn) HGSS ON

Even with a 3-2-3 line currently its taking way too long to get the samurott out with energy so I am going to add in 2 IQ and 1 dewott for 1-1 noctowl and 1 energy exchanger. I have lost a couple more games in the testing and have currently won 2/5 which still isn't bad I guess.
 
RE: TurnOr (Scizor/Lanturn) HGSS ON

Whats the part taking the longest to get out? The basic or stage 2?
 
RE: TurnOr (Scizor/Lanturn) HGSS ON

xDMVx said:
Whats the part taking the longest to get out? The basic or stage 2?
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Stage 2 I'm thinking of readding professor elms as I search for oshawott with collector but then it is left sitting there without a dewott or rare candy for the samurott.
 
RE: TurnOr (Scizor/Lanturn) HGSS ON

Tyranodon said:
xDMVx said:
Whats the part taking the longest to get out? The basic or stage 2?
Click to expand...

Stage 2 I'm thinking of readding professor elms as I search for oshawott with collector but then it is left sitting there without a dewott or rare candy for the samurott.
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Do you run 4 communicators?
 
RE: TurnOr (Scizor/Lanturn) HGSS ON

xDMVx said:
Tyranodon said:
xDMVx said:
Whats the part taking the longest to get out? The basic or stage 2?
Click to expand...

Stage 2 I'm thinking of readding professor elms as I search for oshawott with collector but then it is left sitting there without a dewott or rare candy for the samurott.
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Do you run 4 communicators?
Yes but only 3 collectors.
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RE: TurnOr (Scizor/Lanturn) HGSS ON

Elm is bad compared to communicators im very curious to where this hang up is without seeing it myself.

Edit~ if you can update the first page/pm me/ post here what you have in the deck now ill playtest it against my reshiboar and see what i can find.
 
RE: TurnOr (Scizor/Lanturn) HGSS ON

xDMVx said:
Elm is bad compared to communicators im very curious to where this hang up is without seeing it myself.

Edit~ if you can update the first page/pm me/ post here what you have in the deck now ill playtest it against my reshiboar and see what i can find.
Click to expand...

Sure I was just about to post the decklist anyway as I think I have found a consistent list.
 
Alright ill test it against mine be back in a bit.

It definately is more consistant. Out of the 5 games i tested it won 3 with Samurott being the star twice and bouffalant once (OHKOing RDL on revenge.) The times it lost was once against a double RDL set up early on and a skarmory/scyther start against a starting reshiram. The judges work really nice in there interrupting Reshi before he can get going.
 
Ok thanks, so far in my testing the samuzor won 4/8 matches. But I am confident if I played another 3 I would win at least 2 as I now know how to play the match up. Just completely forget about scizor until you have a tanking samurott then build him up so you can finish the game with him and bouffalant taking the last couple of prizes together.
 
Tyranodon said:
Ok thanks, so far in my testing the samuzor won 4/8 matches. But I am confident if I played another 3 I would win at least 2 as I now know how to play the match up. Just completely forget about scizor until you have a tanking samurott then build him up so you can finish the game with him and bouffalant taking the last couple of prizes together.
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Exactly if you see a reshiram/tepig and to an extent vulpix start, then you will start loading energy via skarmory or w.e to oshawatt. Once samurott hits the field Reshiram players will be hard pressed to take it out unless they use RDL which bouffalant then cleans up.
 
Have you ever tried this with steelix? they both (steelix and samurott) can utilize DCE and steelix can tank as good, if not better, than scizor.

Here's a deck list, i call it samurai X ...lol

18
3-2-3 Samurott
3-3 Steelix
4 Skarmory

TSS 25
2 Collector
2 Dual Ball
2 Rare Candy
2 Energy Exchanger
3 Engineers Adjustment
3 Communication
2 Juniper
2 CopyCat
2 Life Herb
2 Switch
3 Junk Arm
1 FSL

16 Energy
4 DCE
4 SP Metal
4 Metal
4 Water
 
Nice idea may have to try it but the list will be way too slow for reshiboar match up. Samurott takes long enough to set up never mind a steelix which needs 5 energy to set up (4 if you use DCE). Looking for a bit more advice on the current list as it is still a tad sluggish in getting out of the blocks.
 
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