Scrafty/Volcarona

[RogueListers]

EDIT: I've removed Houndoom in favor of Scrafty. It's much faster and more consistent, while also getting a paralysis as well. I'll keep the original info in case anyone has any ideas that can save Houndoom/Volcarona, or if anyone wants a decklist for it.

Basic strategy is similar to Lilligant--that is, stream Scrafty with Fliptini to get a Paralyze every turn while also burning for 4 between turns, possibly OHKOing Dragons for 1 sp dark and a Dark Claw, not to mention the better Terrakion matchup (paralyze, small chance at retaliate working)


4-4 Scrafty BW (BW Scraggy as well... should I run some of the others?)
3-3 Volcarona DEX (60 HP 1 retreat Larvesta)
1 Magby CL
1 Darkrai EX
2 Victini NV14
14

T/S/S
4 Collector
2 N
4 Professor Oak's New Theory
3 Juniper
4 Junk Arm
2 Pokémon Communication
3 Level Ball
3 Dark Claw
3 Catcher
2 Switch
1 Super Rod
34

Energy
4 Special Dark
7 Dark
11

Some things I've tested, but dropped:
Crobat Prime -too clunky, impossible to get completely set up
Mew + Crobat Prime -STILL too clunky, much better to straight attack with Houndoom
Vileplume -no more energy acceleration, the deck was horrible
Amoongus + Pichu -Sure, a full lock was cool, but setting up 3 stage 1s by turn 2 was impossible and while the deck was fun and decent, it was waaaay too inconsistent for me to take to a BR

Things I want to test, but am either too lazy or just haven't yet:
Torkoal UL -Still requires a flip and it's an into play ability. I don't think it'd work well
Druddigon NVI -no energy acceleration and lower HP. Granted DCE would be usable and it's easier to search out.
Venomoth TM - With Darkrai and Energy a tails flip isn't too bad. Still, another stage 1 and flippy
Hypno HGSS -God forbid more catcher bait! Still, locking an opponent and forcing them to flip twice between turns is enticing and I might try it...


Anyways, here's the list:

4-3-1 Houndoom (3 Prime 1 regular)
2-2 Volcarona DEX (60 HP 1 retreat Larvesta)
1 Magby CL
1 Darkrai EX
14

T/S/S
4 Collector
2 Sage's Training
2 N
4 Professor Oak's New Theory
2 Juniper
4 Junk Arm
3 Dark Patch
2 Pokémon Communication
2 Ultra Ball
3 Dark Claw
3 Catcher
2 Switch
1 Super Rod
34

Energy
4 Special Dark
8 Dark
12

60 total

Let me know what you guys think

 

[Emopanda133]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

Try Arcanine from ND, the one with blazing mane, it auto burn the opponent, instead of relying on a flip, and he's pretty strong too.

-4-3-1 Houndoom
+4-4 Arcanine (Stoke Growlithe, Blazing Arcanine)

-12 Dark
+10 Fire
+2 Fliptini (Helps Arcanine)

-2 Darkrai EX
+2 Reshiram EX (great secondary)

-4 Darkness claw
-2 Darkness patch
+2-2-2 Typhlosion Prime (energy Accelaration)

 

[Mora]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

2-2-2 Typhlosion is going to be way to inconsistent, especially without Rare Candy. You could possibly leave in Dark Patch and some {D} so that you could use Arcanine T2. That way you'd have some energy acceleration, but it's just a thought. Maybe another Catcher; two just seems to low.

 

[Rikko145]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

- 1 Magby CL (2 of these is too many)
- 1 Darkrai EX (You don't want to start with it or give up too many prizes. Use just 1 for the ability and a crunch-attacker.)
- 1 Sage's Training (I'm trying to make this list a little less reliant on Dark Patch, that way if you don't hit one you won't be up the creek without a paddle.)
- 2 N (2 is really inconsistent.)
- 1 Dark Patch (We're making your list more independant, so you don't need 4.)
- 3 Pokémon Communication (We should replace this with something more efficient.)

+2 PONT (Major consistency card.)
+1 Juniper (Major consistency card, great draw card
+2 Switch (sometimes you just can't afford to waste your energy attachment for the turn.)
+1 Dark Claw (Keep that damage output up.)
+1-1 Volcorana (You need to bench 2 Larvesta from the get-go, and this makes it more consistent and easier to draw into.)
+1 Catcher (Take advantage of Dark Clamp.)

I hope you find these helpful! They should make this deck much more consistent, at least.

 

[Professor Pokémon]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

I would play something like this:

4-4 Arcanine
3-3 Volcarona
2 Entei EX
2 Reshiram Ex (maybe the will be good but i don`t know you can put them out)
2 Fliptini

4 Collector
4 PONT
3 N
2 Juniper

4 Heavy Ball
4 Junk Arm
3 Catcher
2 P-Com
2 Switch


9{R}
3 DCE

 

[Rikko145]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

^That actually looks like a very solid list. Although, you should drop the Reshiram EX's for Rocky Helmets, 1 Catcher 1 Heavy Ball and 1 N for 2 Sage's Training and another Juniper, and 1 of the DCE's for another Communication.

 

[Infinity]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

2-2-2 Typhlosion is going to be way to inconsistent, especially without Rare Candy. You could possibly leave in Dark Patch and some {D} so that you could use Arcanine T2. That way you'd have some energy acceleration, but it's just a thought. Maybe another Catcher; two just seems to low.

Patch only works on dark mons.

 

[Mora]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

Oh thought it was just {D} energy. In that case, I would take out all the {D} related stuff and Darkrai EX, and just run more Switch. Switch doesn't give up two prizes.

 

[The Fire Wyrm]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

I think you should use an Arcanine Volcarona Emboar list. Way more consistent IMO

 

[RogueListers]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

I think you should use an Arcanine Volcarona Emboar list. Way more consistent IMO

A stage 2 and 2 stage 1s is more consistent than 2 stage 1s and a basic? If I added any card like Arcanine it would be Druddigon...

@rikko
First of all, thank you for being the only person to give constructive criticism on this deck instead of just suggest I run a different one.
I went 2/2/2 for PONT/N/Juniper because that way I wasn't over-committed on any 1. Of the 3, though, I think N is the most important. It can cause decks like CMT or Zoroark to just sputter late-game, especially if I catcher up their Darkrai and Dark Clamp. However, I ill try to make room for more PONT andmaybe more Juniper, just not at the cost of N.
I totally agree with you on the switch, though. It would boost my speed and save me from status lock decks or a paralyze from Raikou, which in testing is causing some problems. I originally had 2 but when I tested with Amoongus I had to remove it for space issues and never put them back in.
I went 2-2 on Volcarona because I feel people will want Houndoom dead more than Volcarona because, without Houndoom, Volcarona is pretty useless. Also, if I start Darkrai and Collector for Houndour, Larvesta, Larvesta my opponent can just Catcher KO my lone Houndour and I won't be burning anything on T2 (without Magby)
Speaking of, Magby is also an awesome card in this deck, as sometimes I just won't have a Houndoom Prime ready on the bench, and I can wall while possibly doing 80/turn
You said I should take out the Pokécoms for something else, but you didn't offer anything. I reeeally don't want to run PokéComs, but because Houndoom has 1 retreat and both Houndoom and Volcarona have >90 HP, my only options in the format are Ultra Ball and PokéCom. Through testing, Ultra Ball eats through my hand way too quickly, and I sometimes have to choose between keeping a hand refresher or ensuring an attacker the following turn. I could try PETM, but honestly... no. I run enough Pokés to where I usually don't whiff the search, and I usually (85% if the time) get at least 1 of each Houndoom/Volcarona up by T2. Energywise, though, I usually don't power up an attack until T3 :/

My damage output before burn per turn is on average 100, so averaging 20 between turns with burn and I'll usually be hitting about 140/turn cycle for {D}{D}{C}+Dark Claw, so it's nothing to sneeze at. Arcanine + Rocky Helmet can get in the same range, but what's cooler: Clifford or a Demon dog?

Anyways, here's what I did, based on your suggestions:
-1 Darkrai EX
-1 Magby CL
-1 Dark Patch
-1 PokéCom
-2 Sage's

+2 PONT
+1 Catcher (You're completely right about this, I kinda want to have 4)
+1 Dark Claw
+2 Switch

 

[JimboJumbo]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

Not sure if it was mentioned earlier but without Houndoom, they can easily retreat/switch out of the burn, which kind of sucks.
At least if they have the switch to use to get out of it, eventually the Darkrai will come in and clean up.

 

[RogueListers]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

Not sure if it was mentioned earlier but without Houndoom, they can easily retreat/switch out of the burn, which kind of sucks.
At least if they have the switch to use to get out of it, eventually the Darkrai will come in and clean up.

Exactly, but that's also why I'm considering Druddigon; with Druddigon, I can keep them from retreating while also punishing them for attacking me.


EDIT: I tried my updated list at league last night, and while it was more consistent, I really need a Cleffa or Smeargle to get over the hump. Probably Cleffa, since I don't run Skyarrow, but I just really need a way to stream Houndooms better.

 

[JimboJumbo]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

You might want to consider fixing your draw support a bit. Making it more reckless might help you in getting the cards you need to stream Houndoom, since he isn't as searchable as other Pokemon. If the OP is your most updated list, this is what I would change.

4-3-1 Houndoom (3 Prime 1 regular)
3-2 Volcarona DEX (60 HP 1 retreat Larvesta)
1 Magby CL
1 Darkrai EX (+1)
15

T/S/S
2 Pokemon Collector
2 N
4 Professor Oak's New Theory
4 Professor Juniper
4 Junk Arm
3 Dark Patch
2 Ultra Ball
3 Dark Claw
3 Pokemon Catcher
2 Switch
1 Super Rod
3 Dual Ball
1 PokeGear 3.0
34

Energy
3 Darkness Energy
8 Dark Energy
11

Also, just out of curiosity, is Houndoom Prime in there solely for the Burn Function? If so, you might be able to speed the deck up a bit by using Druddigon instead of Houndoom. He's basic, so you can search with Collector and Dual Ball and can use DCE which makes up for not being able to Dark Patch. In addition (although not super relevant) he has a built in Rocky Helmet, which might be useful time and time again.

 

[The Fire Wyrm]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

A stage 2 and 2 stage 1s is more consistent than 2 stage 1s and a basic? If I added any card like Arcanine it would be Druddigon...

Trust me, It works. It does a consistent 100-140 a turn.
EDIT: AND DOESNT REQUIRE A FLIP!
My list actually managed to outspeed a Zekeels for some reason, but I think that was just luck.

But just do whatever floats your boat I guess.

 

[squirtwo]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

May i suggest scrafty from black and white? He auto burns for one energy plus flip for paralysis, im no trying to completely change the deck but i thought he would have a pretty similar strategy

 

[RogueListers]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

May i suggest scrafty from black and white? He auto burns for one energy plus flip for paralysis, im no trying to completely change the deck but i thought he would have a pretty similar strategy

No, no, I kinda like it. Scrafty is one of my favorite Unova Pokémon, and the card with Fliptini could be playable. 1 Energy, does damage and paralysis on a flip is pretty appetizing. I'll have to test it.


@JimboJumbo: I'm not a huge fan of Dual Ball, only because you usually only get 1 basic and, while you have a chance at 2, you have an equally large chance at 1. I use Level Ball or Heavy Ball wherever I can instead. In fact, in a Mew Prime/Absol deck I made my girlfriend, I only used Level Ball and communication.

I'm gonna have to try attacking with Druddigon, because Houndoom just isn't streamable. I can maybe get 2 set up and attacking a game, but that's about it. Dark Patch only works until you have to start junk arming for it, at which point it loses most of its appeal as I miss out on bigger junk arm targets like catcher. I could also take out the Dark Claws for Rocky Helmets and max out revenge damage, or just EXP Shares to stream Druddigons, while also forcing their Poké to stay active

 

[JimboJumbo]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

No, no, I kinda like it. Scrafty is one of my favorite Unova Pokémon, and the card with Fliptini could be playable. 1 Energy, does damage and paralysis on a flip is pretty appetizing. I'll have to test it.


@JimboJumbo: I'm not a huge fan of Dual Ball, only because you usually only get 1 basic and, while you have a chance at 2, you have an equally large chance at 1. I use Level Ball or Heavy Ball wherever I can instead. In fact, in a Mew Prime/Absol deck I made my girlfriend, I only used Level Ball and communication.

I'm gonna have to try attacking with Druddigon, because Houndoom just isn't streamable. I can maybe get 2 set up and attacking a game, but that's about it. Dark Patch only works until you have to start junk arming for it, at which point it loses most of its appeal as I miss out on bigger junk arm targets like catcher. I could also take out the Dark Claws for Rocky Helmets and max out revenge damage, or just EXP Shares to stream Druddigons, while also forcing their Poké to stay active

If that's the case, you might want to consider dropping the SP darks for more basic darks or for DCEs instead.

 

[bluejay1]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

I prefer the ball engine. If you use the ball engine you don't use your supporter for the turn up. Here is what I would do:
-4 collector

+4 dual ball

---

Try Arcanine from ND, the one with blazing mane, it auto burn the opponent, instead of relying on a flip, and he's pretty strong too.

-4-3-1 Houndoom
+4-4 Arcanine (Stoke Growlithe, Blazing Arcanine)

-12 Dark
+10 Fire
+2 Fliptini (Helps Arcanine)

-2 Darkrai EX
+2 Reshiram EX (great secondary)

-4 Darkness claw
-2 Darkness patch
+2-2-2 Typhlosion Prime (energy Accelaration)

Typhlosion prime is a stage 2 though. In this format, stage 2's are completally unplayable.

 

[RogueListers]

RE: Houndoom/Volcarona

I prefer the ball engine. If you use the ball engine you don't use your supporter for the turn up. Here is what I would do:
-4 collector

+4 dual ball

---

---

Dual Ball will get me
0 Pokémon: 25% of the time
1 Pokémon: 50% of the time
2 Pokémon: 25% of the time

So why not just run Level or Heavy Ball if all I'm getting is on average 1 Pokémon? Not to mention the numerous Top Cut videos of people getting double tails, wasting a junk arm and getting double tails again... I don't like Dual Ball.

@Squirtwo, @JimboJumbo
I've dropped Houndoom Prime in favor of Scrafty. I get set up 100% of the time, I have Fliptini for a 75% chance of Paralysis/turn, and because I only need 1 energy to attack I've dropped Dark Patch entirely while cutting back on Energies a bit. All this extra space I've filled with consistency cards and, yea, it's working beautifully. If only I found Scrafty before I bought all of these Houndoom Primes >_>

I'll update the title and first post to show these changes