skyla, catcher, candy and more

Dark Void said:
Ah but on the other hand you only have to run 1 since you can use Skyla to search it out ;)
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lol

venasour x said:
Still. Now I have to run Tool Scrapper.
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That may not actually be a bad thing. Hard counters Garbodor for one. Also getting rid of Eviolites and Dark Claws is honestly really useful. There are also two more tools coming out that may be used like Rescue Scarf. And getting rid of EXP Share is icing on the cake for decks that rely on that.

dmaster out.
 
dmaster said:
That may not actually be a bad thing. Hard counters Garbodor for one. Also getting rid of Eviolites and Dark Claws is honestly really useful. There are also two more tools coming out that may be used like Rescue Scarf. And getting rid of EXP Share is icing on the cake for decks that rely on that.

dmaster out.
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The above reasons are why we would run Tool Scrapper anyway. It's not like Skyla, ACE SPEC, or Garbodor changed that very much. (However, Garbodor was probably a big reason, but the biggest reason, imo, would be the Dark Claws and Eviolites.)

Dark Void said:
Ah but on the other hand you only have to run 1 since you can use Skyla to search it out
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...haha
 
Having the ability to search ACE SPEC doesn't mean you're necessarily always going to have it available. Since it can only be a one-off, if it's prized, you're in trouble.
 
Seriously, who in their right mind is going to play Ace Specs Kyurem? Why is this even a concern? Even if you have 300 HP, you are still OHKOd by Garchomp with 3 Altaria... Not to mention that your whole set up is completely crippled by one Tool Scrapper, which is going to be a common card since Garbodor is in the format. Did I also mention that both of the Kyurem EX cards are terrible? Even if both Kyurems were printed cut and dry with Ace Specs attached, they'd still be bad cards. 4 Energy for 150 is bad. Especially when you need two different energy types to build the attack up. Just because a Pokémon has a lot of HP, doesn't mean it is good. This used to be a no-brainer.
 
Vulpix Yolk said:
Seriously, who in their right mind is going to play Ace Specs Kyurem? Why is this even a concern? Even if you have 300 HP, you are still OHKOd by Garchomp with 3 Altaria... Not to mention that your whole set up is completely crippled by one Tool Scrapper, which is going to be a common card since Garbodor is in the format. Did I also mention that both of the Kyurem EX cards are terrible? Even if both Kyurems were printed cut and dry with Ace Specs attached, they'd still be bad cards. 4 Energy for 150 is bad. Especially when you need two different energy types to build the attack up. Just because a Pokémon has a lot of HP, doesn't mean it is good. This used to be a no-brainer.
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It's not neccesarily those Ace Specs I'm worried about- its the ones comming up. Yes the Kyurem EX cards are bad, but maybe the next batch of Ace Specs will be amazing. Btw, the 300 HP isn't good, but I think the one hitting for 200 might have some potential.

EDIT: I guess it hits for 200, not 300.
 
Skyla seems pretty awesome, but any comparisons with Cyrus are overdrawn IMO. The reason: Card advantage. Skyla doesn‘t provide the card advantage Cyrus did, and most good Supporters still do. Not to mention the chaining options.

I am very curious to see if decks will adapt to include a Skyla toolbox when this comes out... Tool Scrappers, Enhanced Hammers, Energy Switch maybe, Skyarrow Bridge.... I think this is going to lead to some interesting deckbuilding if people play it right. Btw, the best way to get value/card advantage out of your Skyla is probably a singleton Rescue Scarf.
 
I for one will not be playing Skyla. Getting simply one trainer card is too small of a justification for using up your supporter of the turn.
 
Vulpix Yolk said:
Seriously, who in their right mind is going to play Ace Specs Kyurem? Why is this even a concern? Even if you have 300 HP, you are still OHKOd by Garchomp with 3 Altaria... Not to mention that your whole set up is completely crippled by one Tool Scrapper, which is going to be a common card since Garbodor is in the format. Did I also mention that both of the Kyurem EX cards are terrible? Even if both Kyurems were printed cut and dry with Ace Specs attached, they'd still be bad cards. 4 Energy for 150 is bad. Especially when you need two different energy types to build the attack up. Just because a Pokémon has a lot of HP, doesn't mean it is good. This used to be a no-brainer.
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{W}{L}{L}{C} is difficult to power up, I agree - plus the drawback isn't very nice to you. {W}{R}{R}{C}, however, is relatively easier to power up, because with that you at least have Emboar, and on top of that, you can use the big attack every turn if you can try and pull it off - Energy Retrieval can help. Oh, and {R}{C}{C} allows you to hit 110.

I might consider running the White Kyurem next format, because it's the better of the two, but Tool Scrapper will be prevalent, so I dunno.
 
Skyla and Sableye are going to be BFFs. Fetching an arbitrary trainer, maybe Dark Patch or Ultra Ball, playing it and Junk Handing it together with a Random Receiver for the next Skyla sounds like a strong early play for Darkrai or Zoroark variants. For example, it could set up a very early hammer lock. It also looks like the only profitable way of chaining Skylas, but leads to the problem of having to play a very low supporter count.
 
for anyone wondering, I left esc. rope out of my OP because in a format with switch AND catcher, I'm not sure how effective it will be, but also because I wasn't around when warp point was being played, so I have no idea how useful it was back then or how you were meant to play it.



now, a few people have suggested that skyla's main flaw is that she isn't worth giving up your draw supporter for a turn. while this is correct, I think I have found a solution, in the form of Empoleon DE.

empoleon tends to play a low supporter count naturally, so 4 RR + 4 skyla could help it set up quickly without being a massive deviation from current strategy. It lest you get candy into your hand (along with level ball for piplup, poke-comm for emp' himself. ultra ball also works) allowing for T2 empoleon, which of course means that it can just explode from there.

The point is that empoleon's diving draw reduces the need for the draw-supporter and makes skyla less costly. If any single card can make empoleon good, I think it would be skyla.
 
Skyla is GREAT in Empoleon. It will almost garuntee you the turn 2 Empoleon. lol I can't spell garuntee :p
 
For the record, Switch has been in EVERY format, and Warp Point was infinitely superior to it for the 8 years it was legal. I don't ever see that changing. The only time I ever considered playing Switch was when I was already playing 2-3 Warp Point and needed even more switching capabilities.
 
Deus: Nightmare Autarch said:
{W}{L}{L}{C} is difficult to power up, I agree - plus the drawback isn't very nice to you. {W}{R}{R}{C}, however, is relatively easier to power up, because with that you at least have Emboar, and on top of that, you can use the big attack every turn if you can try and pull it off - Energy Retrieval can help.
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In terms of setup, how is Black Kyurem harder than White Kyurem? Black Kyurem gets Eelektrik, which bases Energy recovery off of contents of the discard pile. It's much more reliable than having to attach from the hand. Emboar gets hurt by N and needs a way to take Energy out of the discard pile/deck to keep streaming Energy, hurting its reliability.
 
Celebi23 said:
For the record, Switch has been in EVERY format, and Warp Point was infinitely superior to it for the 8 years it was legal. I don't ever see that changing. The only time I ever considered playing Switch was when I was already playing 2-3 Warp Point and needed even more switching capabilities.
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So basically only in Machamp SF?

Anyway, White Kyurem does have Emboar, which is infinitally better than Elekrik because Emboar works on the Active, while Elektrik works only on the Bench. That means that you will need to either keep Switching or have 2 Kyurem out. The 2 Kyurem stadegy won't work because you can only run 1 Ace Spec card, and that is what makes Kyurem good(ish).
 
Hope said:
In terms of setup, how is Black Kyurem harder than White Kyurem? Black Kyurem gets Eelektrik, which bases Energy recovery off of contents of the discard pile. It's much more reliable than having to attach from the hand. Emboar gets hurt by N and needs a way to take Energy out of the discard pile/deck to keep streaming Energy, hurting its reliability.
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...Yeah, I suppose you're right. I think that more people will run WK more than BK because the drawback from the 2nd attack isn't as severe, plus like I said it can use ACE-SPEC to use an {R}{C}{C} attack for 110. And WK isn't quite as vulnerable to Tool Scrapper as BK is. (Think about it for a while if you can't figure out why.)
 
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