Synergy Questions

Mach

Mach

The Ultimate Life Form
Member
I asked this on Gym, but I only got one real answer. I wanted more opinions, so I'll post it here.

Okay, so for this being my first year playing competitively, I think I've done well. I've won 2-3 tournaments, I top-cut every now and then, but there is a few things I don't understand.

As a new player, I don't understand what exactly is different from the different formats. Sure, the cards are different, and we have some more powerful cards now than last year, but I don't get how deck building is different this year than last year. People bring up things like Metanite and LBS, but I don't know what they are, or what they do. I've seen people saying synergy has next to no use in this format, and I don't understand how that could be, since I don't know what used to be played. I've been personally using Gengar/Aerodactyl recently and I think that's great synergy, but can someone please point out what is so different this format than last?
 
Synergy means two cards that work well with each other. Like G+G and GallApe.

Last format, I may not have been playing, but the dominating deck was PLOX, which was just spamming Gardevoir SW with Gallade SW and DRE, Scramble, and locking powers. Since I started last April... I honestly don't know.

Just a fun quesiton: What is the purpose of the Gendactyl deck? I like naming things.
 
Well back in the days of HP-On and even before, the decks had amazing synergy. Things like Banette Ex, or LBS, or even DragTrode were all amazing. The main reason that people liked the old format was because there were only really setup decks, and more importantly anything could win. There was no such thing as a real metagame, there were just a couple of decks that seemed to work the best. Also techs were much more common, and people didn't have to have a set number of so many cards in their deck.

Nowadays donk decks and quick setup were key, whereas before the game really didn't get going until the fourth turn, unless you did play a T2 deck, but that normally didn't work too well.

Gliscor: I lol'd when you said GallApe had synergy. It is just a pair of SP's lumped together that don't fail, not much more than that.
 
DawnOfXatu said:
Well back in the days of HP-On and even before, the decks had amazing synergy. Things like Banette Ex, or LBS, or even DragTrode were all amazing. The main reason that people liked the old format was because there were only really setup decks, and more importantly anything could win. There was no such thing as a real metagame, there were just a couple of decks that seemed to work the best. Also techs were much more common, and people didn't have to have a set number of so many cards in their deck.

Nowadays donk decks and quick setup were key, whereas before the game really didn't get going until the fourth turn, unless you did play a T2 deck, but that normally didn't work too well.

Gliscor: I lol'd when you said GallApe had synergy. It is just a pair of SP's lumped together that don't fail, not much more than that.
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GallApe has synergy. Trust me... maybe it seems as if it's just two SP decks together, but they have synergy. I've played it before, so I know.
 
Basically, the format has gone from "best" to "fastest". And we are also in a very cheap era full of macheap(or at least in my meta, a lot of people play macheap, decreasing the fun :( It seems to be that way around most of california, not just my area too.)
 
Gliscor said:
DawnOfXatu said:
Well back in the days of HP-On and even before, the decks had amazing synergy. Things like Banette Ex, or LBS, or even DragTrode were all amazing. The main reason that people liked the old format was because there were only really setup decks, and more importantly anything could win. There was no such thing as a real metagame, there were just a couple of decks that seemed to work the best. Also techs were much more common, and people didn't have to have a set number of so many cards in their deck.

Nowadays donk decks and quick setup were key, whereas before the game really didn't get going until the fourth turn, unless you did play a T2 deck, but that normally didn't work too well.

Gliscor: I lol'd when you said GallApe had synergy. It is just a pair of SP's lumped together that don't fail, not much more than that.
Click to expand...

GallApe has synergy. Trust me... maybe it seems as if it's just two SP decks together, but they have synergy. I've played it before, so I know.
Click to expand...

I think that you are confused between synergy and a combonation deck. A synergestic deck is a pair of cards that work toward a common ability or attack. Metanite was synergestic because the two powers worked in unison to get energies and such. A combonation deck is a pair of cards that can coexist in a deck without failing completely. Gechamp is a good examaple of a combonation deck.
 
You start with Infernape 4 to Split bomb their main cards then bring up Gallade 4 X and OHKO with Aimed Cut.
 
So back before HP-On there really wasn't a metagame? That's a hard concept to think about.

And why do people not like that the format has gotten more speed oriented? I can understand liking longer games better, but speed based decks can have a lot of strategy elements in it as well as the speed.

Gliscor said:
Just a fun quesiton: What is the purpose of the Gendactyl deck? I like naming things.
Click to expand...

Considering most power-users have 70-80 HP (Claydol, Pixies, Weavile), Aerodactyl MD places 2 counters on them as soon as they use it. That makes it much easier to Shadow Room for KO's to take out support faster, and then you can focus on the main attacking line, or hope for the best with Fainting Spell.
 
TruTruSky said:
You start with Infernape 4 to Split bomb their main cards then bring up Gallade 4 X and OHKO with Aimed Cut.
Click to expand...

that is a combo...erego making it a combination deck, but it's not really synergetic, seeming as how they don't really work towards a similar concept

For example....Gardevoir (PT) & Mewtwo (MD) have pretty good synergy, especially in decks where you end up having to discard psychic energies for attacks (like Mewtwo Lv. X's Giga Burn)...Mewtwo gets the energy back from discard, you move Mewtwo to the bench, then use Gardevoir's Psychic Connect to move the energies to the new active, setting up the next active to do their attack...both Pokemon are psychic, so their energy usage work well with each other

in GallApe...even though the two attacks they have work well in tandem, there is no real synergy between the two, they aren't the same type and they both use different energy for their attacks...one can't help the other setup it's attack and vice-versa...yes, one helps the other get a KO with it's attack, but they don't help each other setup their attacks

Mach said:
So back before HP-On there really wasn't a metagame? That's a hard concept to think about.

And why do people not like that the format has gotten more speed oriented? I can understand liking longer games better, but speed based decks can have a lot of strategy elements in it as well as the speed.

Gliscor said:
Just a fun quesiton: What is the purpose of the Gendactyl deck? I like naming things.
Click to expand...

Considering most power-users have 70-80 HP (Claydol, Pixies, Weavile), Aerodactyl MD places 2 counters on them as soon as they use it. That makes it much easier to Shadow Room for KO's to take out support faster, and then you can focus on the main attacking line, or hope for the best with Fainting Spell.
Click to expand...

There was a metagame back then, it just wasn't as prevalent as it is now, and you had to really work to make your decks work, otherwise you were just donating prizes to your opponent

as far as the speedy format not being liked as much, it really is because most of the speed decks are nearly just zombified decks, doesn't really take a whole lot of work or strategy to make them work...some people , but very few, when building their variations of these decks actually try to build more strategy into it, this is because with speed decks, most are set for an initial onslaught, and after the initial onslaught is done if the game isn't won...the probability of these decks winning in later turns is drastically lowered, so they try to add more strategy in, so they won't have to worry about being stuck in a long game

I just think it's funny so many people call decks with Machamp and/or Gengar cheap...like these SP decks running aren't cheap...let's have really fast built "basic" pokemon, give them abilities that shut down most other types of pokemon, and give them trainers that can do things that most TSS's can't do...so not only do they already have the potential for quick kills being they can setup so fast, but they can also shut down stuff other non-SP do

What's cheaper, just doing so many things in the turn that you setup yourself for a "possible" quick win...or, just having fast setup pokemon and shutting down nearly everything your opponent can do to stay in the game

I've never had a problem Machamp or Gengar, and I've gone against some pretty speedy versions of both decks
 
As DawnOfXatu said in previous formats the main decks were decks that didn't set-up as quickly as they do now, but the synergy was amazing. For instance LBS used Blastoise's poke-power to attach energy quickly to pokemon that would normally take time to set-up. I think it has to do with the disappearance of Double Rainbow pokemon like Holon's Magneton, and the Holon line. Now we use don't so much combo, but just aid each other. You know what I mean.
 
Just like Flygon delta and flygon ex,they were synergetic while gengar and machamp are a good combo covering the other's weakness.
 
GeChamp is the most synergetic deck out there now. >___> The format has definately shifted from three years ago. This format is all about speed and donks, the format before was varied and different. You didn't know what to expect because of all the different combos that seemed to fairly work well together.

dmaster out.
 
d master342 said:
GeChamp is the most synergetic deck out there now. >___> The format has definately shifted from three years ago. This format is all about speed and donks, the format before was varied and different. You didn't know what to expect because of all the different combos that seemed to fairly work well together.

dmaster out.
Click to expand...

what the??? ummm, no, there is no synergy between the two at all...it might be the most USED combination deck out there now, but in no way, shape, or form is it the most synergetic deck out there...in order for a deck to be that, it must first have synergy
 
Synergy = Combo to me. Believe me, it works. >__> To a certain extent of course.

dmaster out.
 
well, to correctly answer your question, we must first define synergy.

Simply because you can put 2 cards together and it works great, doesn't mean the cards have synergy. however, cards like Blaziken and Heatran lvX, Blastoise and Delcatty, the cards that share a common thing, like 1 discards and burns, the other puts energy back on and makes auto burn, etc.

Palkia/Dialga had No synergy whatsoever. One could spread and snipe, the other stalled and tanked. Another prime example of no synergy decks that work, GeChamp. Both cards are T1 cards, yes. but what synergy does a 3-6 counter snipe have to do with an instant KO to basics?

Just because a deck has no synergy doesn't mean it is bad. it means that Card A, and Card B, can both have their strategies in the same deck without hurting each other. Synergy says, Card A works best with Card B to help card A's strategy, and Card B works best with Card A to help Card B's Strategy. Gengar does not work best with Machamp, and Machamp doesnt work best with Gengar.

The Deck Metanite consisted of Metagross d, which let you look at the top 4 cards of deck, grab 1 card from it. And had an attack that did like 30x the ammount of energy you discard from your guys. Dragonite d had a power to attach lightning energy to your bench. Both were Lightning and Metal, both worked well together. Dragtrode consisted of Dark Dragonite, Dark Electrode, and techs/other hitters. Electrode got your energy, dragonite moved it.

List me the top decks in the format, and i will show you a list of decks that have no synergy.
 
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