TCG Weekly Discussion #2: Spirit of the Game

Celebi23

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TCG Weekly Discussion
Week #2 - Spirit of the Game



Background Information:
Much like the real world weekly discussions, the TCG Weekly Discussions are threads posted to get a good discussion going about various aspects of the Pokémon TCG. If you have any ideas for topics we could discuss in the future, please PM me or leave a profile comment.

Discussion Starter:
Is there a fine line between upholding SotG and just being too nice? If so, where is it drawn? Is allowing your opponent to take back misplays upholding SotG, or is it going above and beyond that? What about pointing out their misplays for them? How about accidentally playing two supporters and not telling your opponent when you realize? Imo, there is a very fine line between SotG and being too nice, but it will be interesting to see what you guys come up with.

This discussion started on 12/20/2011.
 
This is interesting.


I think the line between Spirit of the Game and being too nice varies from person to person, me, being the honest person I am, will point out mistakes I make during a battle, which I don't think violates Spirit of the Game, it's just the polite thing to do, for example: if I accidently draw 8 cards with Professor Juniper instead of 7, I'll ask the opponent wether or not he or she wants me to put back on top of my deck, put it on the bottom, call a Judge over, ect. If someone porpously takes an extra card off of something, not only is that violating Spirit of the Game, it's cheating which is wrong in itself. I don't always let my opponent take back misplays, but if I do I make sure it won't cost me the game, or put me in a tight spot, but for example: if it's something like benching a Typhlosion Prime instead of Cyndaquil, that's understandable, and I will let them take that back.
 
Benching a Typhlosion Prime instead of a Cyndaquil breaks the gamestate, though. They can't bench a Typhlosion Prime, so you'd have to let them take it back if a judge got called over. Besides, shouldn't making them take that back benefit you? :p

Why does the line vary from person to person? Isn't there generally a distinct line between right and wrong? That's like saying it's okay if Person A steals, because his values are different from Person B's. But if Person B steals, he should go to jail.
 
Celebi23 said:
Benching a Typhlosion Prime instead of a Cyndaquil breaks the gamestate, though. They can't bench a Typhlosion Prime, so you'd have to let them take it back if a judge got called over. Besides, shouldn't making them take that back benefit you? :p

Why does the line vary from person to person? Isn't there generally a distinct line between right and wrong? That's like saying it's okay if Person A steals, because his values are different from Person B's. But if Person B steals, he should go to jail.

What I meant is for example: they have 2 cards in there hand and the cards are Cyndaquil and Typhlosion Prime and they benched the Typhlosion instead of the Cyndaquil.

The line varies from person to person because some people may not be as nice as others and count the smallest mistake as breaking the state of the game or something like that. And yes I do think there's a very distinc line between right and wrong, it's just really hard for me to word it the way I want to online, sorry if I caused any confusion.
 
Your example is still flawed as you CANNOT bench Typhlosion... so of course you would let them take it back. What would the other option be? Call judge? The judge will just tell them to take it back.

Spirit of the game is there to ensure the best play experience we can have. We want to ensure that the game is fun for everyone! I don't view misplays and retakes as part of spirit of the game. Part of SotG is promoting a good learning environment. What a better way to teach someone to not misplay by making them stick with their misplay. You would be nicer in letting them take their misplay back, but you would teach them by not. Either way, it is your call. SotG falls more into the category of "don't cheat, don't be mean", etc. SotG is very easy to uphold... just don't be rude to anyone around you, and you're upholding SotG.

As far as game errors go, NEVER try to correct it yourself unless it is a stupid think like "I put 11 damage counters on my pokemon for blue flare instead of 12". The judge should always keep track of your errors. Just call judge in a respectable manner. Tell your opponent that you'll settle it out quickly and you'll disagree if he/she gets a warning. At cities, my opponent drew 6 for sage instead of 5. I called judge over, told him the situation, and recommended that we just put the card back. Plain and simple :) The judge just had to say "ok". No warnings were given as neither of us lost track of game state... we were friendly about the call and mistakes like that happen. There is a line between major gameplay errors and minor gameplay errors... but that is a discussion for another day.


But yeah... SotG is really just not being a jerk to anybody. If problems happen, be nice about it. I had a player at my league who would raise his hand and holler "DQ" everytime something happened. That isn't very nice... When you call judge and recommend no penalty on your opponent, that is where you are upholding SotG.



Here are the following tenants of SotG from the pokemon.com website:


Fun: The Pokémon TCG is a game, and games are meant to be fun for all parties involved. When a game ceases to be fun, players find other things to do.

Fairness: Games cease to be fun when players break the rules to achieve victory. A player should prefer to lose a game than to win by cheating.

Honesty: Players of any game should strive to act honestly while playing that game. If a player inadvertently breaks a rule during a game and becomes aware of the error before his or her opponent or a judge, that player should make the opponent and the judge aware of the misplay.

Respect: Players, spectators, and staff should be treated with the same respect that players would expect for themselves. Distracting an opponent or a judge to gain advantage shows disrespect to everyone involved in a Pokémon TCG event.

Sportsmanship: Winning or losing with grace is vital to the enjoyment of a game. The desire to continue playing a game can be soured by players that berate their opponents after winning or losing a match.

Learning: Players should strive to help each other increase their Pokémon TCG play skills. It is not a player's responsibility to make his or her opponent's plays for that opponent. However, discussing strategies, offering deck tips, or constructively critiquing game play decisions after the match has been completed helps both participants to become better players.
 
I think it's hard to distinguish when it's more important to hold Spirit of the Game than win the game, especially if it's an important game/top cut. I generally don't allow my opponent to take back plays, and I don't expect others to allow me to. That's not spirit of the game, that's for fun games at league or testing.
 
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