The Current Direction of the Game

[Card Slinger J]

I heard about this on Pojo and found it interesting and concerning, the Thread Starter is worried that the Pokemon TCG is moving in the direction of Yu-Gi-Oh! where each set focuses on a type and everyone runs the same 2-3 decks.

Alot of people are running G Decks and then using Machamp decks to counter against it, with an increase of Psychic Support in the most recent sets. If this keeps up it could mean trouble for the current Pokemon TCG metagame.

POP/PUI or Nintendo needs to make and print cards to tech against SP decks or we could see another Chaos Deck/Yata-Garasu meta like Yu-Gi-Oh! where the game becomes stagnant until someone makes erratas or restrict specific cards from hurting the meta or worse the banhammer... >_>

What do you guys think?

 

[Galactiratina]

I totally agree. I still think potf will bring something good!

 

[dmaster]

SP is no different then delta. They'll be long gone after PoTF.

dmaster out.

 

[Hunga]

I think the biggest problem which the Pokémon TCG is facing, is the abnormal grow of the powerlvl of cards! They're getting stronger and stronger with every edition.
They should keep it balanced, as some other card games are trying it at least.

 

[ze_draeck]

The only problem in this meta now is the amount of donk decks being played; not that they are being played or something else like SP's

 

[gyrasion]

pokemon is NOTHING like yugioh.
i play yugioh the atmosphere is totally different yugioh is mindless and basically to be good and the game AND be sucsseful you have to cheat. every yugioh pro cheats its fact.
current yugioh format is like ours but there is still a lot more variety and room for originality.
its much funner toplay and much less competitive pokemon is basically like a family game everyone can enjoy from young to old.there are very few yugioh moms and dads and very little kids doing good at yugioh.
and if you think pokemon is just like yugioh get a yugioh deck go to a regional and play tell me how much fun you have.

 

[Dimentio]

and if you think pokemon is just like yugioh get a yugioh deck go to a regional and play tell me how much fun you have.

While I agree they're nothing alike, can you tell me that someone who plays a Starter deck in a Pokemon Regionals will also have tons of fun? Dependant on the age division, maybe, but then again each division is equally competitive. If you were to use something like Battle Roads or maybe even Cities as the example I would agree, but Regionals no.

 

[don()shinobi]

I play yugioh the atmosphere is totally different yugioh is mindless and basically to be good and the game AND be sucsseful you have to cheat. every yugioh pro cheats its fact.

If you need to cheat to be successful, then you're not a pro, are you? And please explain how it's necessary to cheat to be good.

The format will be nothing like Yugioh. You're describing a situation in where there are only a few good decks. But in this format, there are dozens of viable choices.

 

[GHJamesGH]

Its not going to be as bad as yugioh, but I do think that many decks will be big in this format. From what I've been told by my friend only one deck rules over yugioh, while Pokemon has Gengar, Machamp, Gechamp. Legos, Gallade 4, Dialga G, Porygon-Z, and Flygon.

 

[gyrasion]

I play yugioh the atmosphere is totally different yugioh is mindless and basically to be good and the game AND be sucsseful you have to cheat. every yugioh pro cheats its fact.

If you need to cheat to be successful, then you're not a pro, are you? And please explain how it's necessary to cheat to be good.

The format will be nothing like Yugioh. You're describing a situation in where there are only a few good decks. But in this format, there are dozens of viable choices.

ok its not necassary to cheat to be good its necassary to cheat to be consistently good. people are good at yugioh but if your good and you play someone else that is equally as good but then you cheat to geta better start then who is going to win the match.?before the wholoe company change with yugioh there were a ton of people that were banned becasue they cheated and got caught.

 

[infmach]

Sp decks are leaving people! Accept it, they did not come to stay. There should be a card more broken than Machamp to kill SP Pokémon.

 

[Mew the source of all]

Here's a combo Flygon and Mewtwo. It kills SPs and stops Dialga!

Anyway Pokemon is much different than Yu-gi-oh.
-Limit to deck are not as random from what I've seen in pokemon
-Pokemon isn't a trinagle format like people think. (There's hundreds of unused cards that are good just go look)
-Yu-gi-oh tries new yet lame ways to breathe life into the corpse of yu-gi-oh while pokemon tries new yet fun ways to play.

 

[Dio]

pokemon is NOTHING like yugioh.
I play yugioh the atmosphere is totally different yugioh is mindless and basically to be good and the game AND be sucsseful you have to cheat. every yugioh pro cheats its fact.
current yugioh format is like ours but there is still a lot more variety and room for originality.
its much funner toplay and much less competitive pokemon is basically like a family game everyone can enjoy from young to old.there are very few yugioh moms and dads and very little kids doing good at yugioh.
and if you think pokemon is just like yugioh get a yugioh deck go to a regional and play tell me how much fun you have.

Agreed for the most part, but not every player in Yu-Gi-Oh is a cheater. I've played it on and off since it first came out here and in my experience, it has the highest concentration of cheaters. Basically what they do is "pile shuffle", grouping cards together so that no matter how you cut it, your opponent will get cards that work well together. And many players at SJCs and higher have been caught doing this. In fact, a lot of the "pros" have been disqualified at one point or another. But that doesn't mean there aren't any cheaters in Pokemon. A PTO told me why optional mulligans won't work is because people can shuffle their decks to keep a specific card on top. A judge watched this one guy do it and he was automatically DQ'd.

One main difference between the two games is that Yu-Gi-Oh generally tends to have a few overpowered chase cards, with the rest being crap. These cards can fetch over $100 on the secondary market. Even when Crush Card Virus was in the Gold series it was still $250. But in Pokemon the most you will ever have to pay for a single card is $40, and there are tons of playable cards. You also have a better chance of pulling these cards as well in Pokemon. Not to mention that you can just buy a booster box for $80 shipped, get at least two LV. Xs and a few secrets, and the box pays for itself and you get tons of other good cards.

The chances for pulling premium rare cards is way better in Pokemon too, at least 1 in 3 to pull a holo. Not to mention that you also get a reverse holo in each pack which could potentially be another premium holo. There's also a good chance it will be a holo version of a good rare or good trainer, and will be highly tradeable. Yu-Gi-Oh is a "rich man's game" where you must pay hundreds of dollars to stay competitive.

Now suppose that we DO end up with a few decks that are the only ones played. We will still have G variants, Machamp variants, and antimeta variants. No matter what the top deck is, people will always be trying out new cards. And who knows, these decks will become better than the last onces. I just don't see this game getting dull anytime soon.

 

[Ophie]

It's also the one card game where I'm seeing COMMON-rarity cards show up in the competitive scene. It's an interesting thing I've only seen show up recently, what with Skuntank G and Turtwig GL and all that. Not to mention that you need Common cards to evolve from, in nearly all cases.

I had long suspected a lot of this shuffling going on near the top of any card game. I wish we could have more people watching for deck-stacking, as I've observed a lot of illusionists do it. They're practically indistinguishable from a real shuffle, except that the order of the cards stay exactly the same.

When my sister played in the Pasadena Regionals, twice in a row, her opponent got two Poké Drawer + on the initial hand, plus a Rare Candy. While it's definitely possible that they can get all three cards out of the 7 they draw at the beginning, I wouldn't doubt if at least one of them had been shuffling in this way.

Why do you see it happen more with the Yu-Gi-Oh! players? Is it because the higher price of the cards makes people more desperate to win? Is it because the nature of the game requires you to obtain very specific cards to get as early an advantage as possible?

 

[Dio]

I think it's the latter. If you can get card advantage early in the game, you're very likely to win. Then you set up field presence and control the tempo of the game. When building a deck in ANY card game, especially with Yu-Gi-Oh, it's important to have synergy so that most of the cards work well together. And that's why people pile shuffle. The way that it works is they group the cards into different piles, and no matter how you cut it, cards within A and B will work together. A good starting hand might be: Graceful Charity, Cyber Dragon, Chaos Sorceror, Dark Armed Dragon, Sangan and a Mystic Tomato. This gives the player a LOT of good options from the very beginning, and more when they draw into something.

 

[hrmz]

I think the game is going to have SP pokemon playing a more supportive role, as oppose to being the main threat in the deck ...

 

[ghoztmazta1]

pokemon is NOTHING like yugioh.
I play yugioh the atmosphere is totally different yugioh is mindless and basically to be good and the game AND be sucsseful you have to cheat. every yugioh pro cheats its fact.
current yugioh format is like ours but there is still a lot more variety and room for originality.
its much funner toplay and much less competitive pokemon is basically like a family game everyone can enjoy from young to old.there are very few yugioh moms and dads and very little kids doing good at yugioh.
and if you think pokemon is just like yugioh get a yugioh deck go to a regional and play tell me how much fun you have.

Word on that, i played yu-gi-oh and i was good at it, but it sucket to play! way to much numbers each turns and stuff like that.
And the cards, they are so boring, the artwork is good, but they are dark and boring. I like pokemon becuse i am grown up with it and its fun to play, and really nice colors and artwork etc.
So, i dont think YGO is so fun to play with, sorry.

 

[CFOURCOLTSFAN]

Pokemon is like yugioh except for the fact yugioh is more expensive and they only ban cards not sets. Although I quit because it was more expensive than pokemon. I do agree on the cheating part a little bit, I've been to 3 tournaments in the past 2 years, just for fun, and in 2/3 tourneys I was cheated against but since I wasn't an active player they didn't buy it. Just a funny thing on yugioh though, last year I was playing in a GenCon Nats qualifier with a "Marik" deck(aka almost everything from Pharonic Guardian) and was one turn away from qualifing. But I like pokemon more, the people are nicer.