TPCi and their Pull Rates

[Daelum]

Hi,

I recently had the chance to talk with someone who works for TPCi in the card portion. I asked them what was up with the inconsistent pull rates in booster boxes, starting at Dragons Exalted? This was about a week ago, so I can't remember specifically what he said (sorry), but it was something like this: "Pokemon enjoys the sense of adventure, of surprise. They don't like for the booster boxes to have expected pull rates. They want things to be random, to keep things fresh." He went on about Pokemon's spirit and some random other emotional stuff like that. But yeah, the final conclusion was that TPCi no longer has generally set pull rates for their boxes - everything is random.


How do you guys feel about this?

 

[dmaster]

It's a luck based game so why not make the packs luck based? Kinda makes sense when you think about it. Opening packs has always been a risk and now they're eliminating it from the boxes. Not really that surprising at least to me.

dmaster out.

 

[DNA]

So the only thing we can depend on them doing is to not be dependable?

 

[ForeignDude]

Extremely happy. The one thing that has always been preventing me from buying a box was that it was pretty much expected to get a certain number of UR's and what not. But recently that has not been an issue at all and so I say keep it up.

 

[evilpacman]

I'd love to hear someone explain how the sense of adventure is greater knowing they may get completely screwed on a box. This isnt the lottery. You dont really win big when you hit the "jackpot" in Pokemon. You just end up getting what used to be the acceptable rate of UR's. What a bunch of crap.

 

[ForeignDude]

I'd love to hear someone explain how the sense of adventure is greater knowing they may get completely screwed on a box. This isnt the lottery. You dont really win big when you hit the "jackpot" in Pokemon. You just end up getting what used to be the acceptable rate of UR's. What a bunch of crap.

I guess it's how each person sees it. I treat my box purchases as a lottery ticket. So far I've gotten dreadful boxes each and every time but I'm definitely satisfied with the experience at the end of the day. It truly is an adventure for me. One that is full of failure but who knows, maybe one day I can find that box that gives me a pleasant surprise.

 

[Ysmir]

This is why for almost 13 years I've relied on packs. Looks like that will finally pay off. Before I just loved the fun behind opening 2-3 packs or 10 packs. But now with this pull rate stuff yeah it MAY be cheaper for a box (cause it's bulk) but your still not guaranteed the pulls you want. I'm like Foreigndude, the fun of opening packs at the end of the day is enough for me cause I collect. I only play the TCG online anyway. But the actual cards I hoard or trade for other stuff I want.

For example; I got 3 Plasma Freeze booster packs (at Wal-mart) and I pulled a Ex, ACE SPEC, and Holo. Sure they weren't exactly playable cards but hell it was fun to pull.

 

[Daelum]

Yeah, that's something else he mentioned. After I commented back with this notion that people still open boxes/packs for the feeling, he said Pokemon wants people opening boxes/packs for the feeling. It's not all about the pulls, but rather the enjoyment you get from just opening the packs.

I can see how some people get their enjoyment from getting the pulls they want - well, actually, everyone gets excited when they pull what they want. But what I'm trying to say is there are people who only derive enjoyment from getting the pulls they want, and get upset when they don't. I believe that the enjoyment should just be from opening the packs, and whatever you pull is just icing on the cake.

 

[Athena]

I think I would mind this a lot less if the pull rates for English cards were higher for premium cards. Even taking expected box pull rates out of it, you still only have a 1/3rd shot to get a holo per pack (roughly speaking), and a much smaller chance to pull an EX or better, so its very easy to get practically nothing for your money considering all the junk rares that are thrown in the sets. I don't think higher pull rates would make buyers buy less packs, since people generally don't keep buying packs over and over to get the super rare cards they want.

As much as I love the fun of opening packs, I am not about to spend $100 on the chance of being burned even more than I used to be. But then, I'd already decided I was throwing in the towel for English cards. >__>

 

[salmoncannon]

Thank you for asking what so many people have wanted to know for so long!

I think it'd be a bit better if there was a set minimum amount of ultra rares you could pull.

 

[proddy]

There are set rates for a sealed case. So while one box out 6 may be terrible, another box from the same sealed case will be amazing.

From this post: http://pokegym.net/forums/showpost.php?p=2433620&postcount=133

There's:

11 EX
9 FA
1 SR
7 Ace Spec

Total: 28 URs

From this post: http://pokegym.net/forums/showpost.php?p=2434721&postcount=163

11 EX
9 FA
6 Ace Spec
2 SR

Total: 28 URs

From this post: http://pokegym.net/forums/showpost.php?p=2435580&postcount=191

13 EX
8 FA
6 Ace Spec
2 SR

Total: 29 URs

From this post: http://www.reddit.com/r/pkmntcg/comments/1e2eaz/plasma_freeze_pull_rates/

14 EX
7 FA
6 Ace Spec
2 SR

Total: 29 URs

You'll notice a few boxes in those cases are truly abysmal, but there are others that are awesome.

Personally I think they went from box to box consistency to case to case because of Dark Explorers. A YouTuber broke the code after only 3 boxes and could open a sealed box, look at the pack art pattern, and pick out all the EX/Full Art/Secret Rares with near 100% accuracy. Of course people could do this before with weighed packs, but even that wasn't as nearly as accurate as straight up picking out ultra rare packs. Since Dark Explorers, pull rates have been reported as erratic across boxes, starting with Dragons Exalted.

This is purely a business move.

edit: added totals

 

[Metalizard]

I'd love to hear someone explain how the sense of adventure is greater knowing they may get completely screwed on a box. This isnt the lottery. You dont really win big when you hit the "jackpot" in Pokemon. You just end up getting what used to be the acceptable rate of UR's. What a bunch of crap.

This.
I don't see how that's a good thing... I liked to buy boxes precisely because I knew I would get at least that minimum amount of URs... I don't buy cards anymore but knowing about this I don't think that spending money on getting a box that may be totally screwed up and not have a decent amount of URs is fun... That's simply dumb...

 

[evilpacman]

I can see where people are coming from when they say they enjoy opening the packs just for the fun of it. However, I think that should only be the case for individual packs. Say you pull 3 packs from a local card shop. Those three packs may be the 3 best ones from the box, the 3 worst ones, or any combination. It is indeed a thrill to see what you might get. But with a box, you are putting a lot of money into something and you should rest easy knowing you will get a standard amount of cards in return.

Lets go back to the lottery and think about it like that. Lets pretend your local convenience store buys a roll or scratch offs that contain a certain amount of busts and a certain amount of prizes. Perhaps there is always a 1st prize that can be found in each roll (lets assume that this is a small winnings lottery and the highest prize is 50 bucks). As a customer buying one scratch off, you can expect the thrill of not knowing what you will win. But, if you were to buy the entire roll, you would expect the full range of prizes. In the end you dont come away with a profit (this is the lottery after all), but you do get a guaranteed prize. Then out of no where, they started to take away the guaranteed prizes from the roll. Every few rolls, they add it in and that is now the "good roll". For the person buying the rolls, they would call BS on it because the "good rolls" are exactly what the normal standard USED to be.

That is pretty much what these new pull rates are doing. You shouldnt feel like you are getting a good deal when you get the typical amount of cards that used to be the set standard. If the pull rate used to be 3-4 EXs per box, how is it interesting or a thrill to start getting pull rates that are more like 1-4 EXs?

 

[Reggie McGigas]

There are set rates for a sealed case. So while one box out 6 may be terrible, another box from the same sealed case will be amazing.

From this post: http://pokegym.net/forums/showpost.php?p=2433620&postcount=133

There's:

11 EX
9 FA
1 SR
7 Ace Spec

Total: 28 URs

From this post: http://pokegym.net/forums/showpost.php?p=2434721&postcount=163

11 EX
9 FA
6 Ace Spec
2 SR

Total: 28 URs

From this post: http://pokegym.net/forums/showpost.php?p=2435580&postcount=191

13 EX
8 FA
6 Ace Spec
2 SR

Total: 29 URs

From this post: http://www.reddit.com/r/pkmntcg/comments/1e2eaz/plasma_freeze_pull_rates/

14 EX
7 FA
6 Ace Spec
2 SR

Total: 29 URs

You'll notice a few boxes in those cases are truly abysmal, but there are others that are awesome.

Personally I think they went from box to box consistency to case to case because of Dark Explorers. A YouTuber broke the code after only 3 boxes and could open a sealed box, look at the pack art pattern, and pick out all the EX/Full Art/Secret Rares with near 100% accuracy. Of course people could do this before with weighed packs, but even that wasn't as nearly as accurate as straight up picking out ultra rare packs. Since Dark Explorers, pull rates have been reported as erratic across boxes, starting with Dragons Exalted.

This is purely a business move.

edit: added totals

You make a good point. But where is the youtube video where the guy broke the code?

Also, here is my take on this (be warned this is an unpopular opinion)

I think this is a stupid move. How would you feel if you paid 95 or more dollars and you got 1 unplayable EX (like celebi, reshiram, or heatran), and a couple cheap holos? I would prefer set pull rates, example 3 EXs and 2 ace specs guarenteed, and either 2 FAs or 1 shiny.

 

[Daelum]

Also, here is my take on this (be warned this is an unpopular opinion)

I think this is a stupid move. How would you feel if you paid 95 or more dollars and you got 1 unplayable EX (like celebi, reshiram, or heatran), and a couple cheap holos? I would prefer set pull rates, example 3 EXs and 2 ace specs guarenteed, and either 2 FAs or 1 shiny.

What if you get the 3 worst EXs in the set?

 

[proddy]

snip

You make a good point. But where is the youtube video where the guy broke the code?

Also, here is my take on this (be warned this is an unpopular opinion)

I think this is a stupid move. How would you feel if you paid 95 or more dollars and you got 1 unplayable EX (like celebi, reshiram, or heatran), and a couple cheap holos? I would prefer set pull rates, example 3 EXs and 2 ace specs guarenteed, and either 2 FAs or 1 shiny.

Here's the YouTube series: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkJodGU_qXs

Here's one where he pulls them directly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wX-E9mWO6vU

That's part two. I think it takes him 2-3 boxes to establish the pattern, and for the rest of the boxes in the case he just pulls the ultra rares. He only messes up once or twice, and only because he miscounted.

I agree, I didn't like opening a box with only 2 EX and 1 Ace Spec, which did happen to me with Plasma Freeze. Those EX were Heatran and Tornadus half arts. There should be a minimum and no maximum, so you get your money's worth but could also hit the jackpot. I think that's a better incentive for people to buy boxes, if there's the possibility of an amazing box with say 8 EX, 3 FA, 1-2 SR. Make it 1 in 100 if you want, but it's there. The rumors will spread, that Jimmy got an amazing box, and you could too!

 

[Frost]

Call me crazy, but when I buy a $90 booster box, I'd kind of prefer at least ONE full art over "a sense of adventure" or whatever BS they're spewing.

 

[MrSquarepants]

How is it a sense if adventure? =_= that's just them sugar coating "we want more money so if people know they aren't guaranteed anything they might buy even MOAR packs!!! Instead of one cheap box they'd buy 3 or a whole case!!!"

100$ is a whole 10hr miserable day at work for me. I don't want to waste that and be EVEN MORE miserable after wasting it on crappy cards. At minimum there should be 2 ultra rares for a set that has 20 of them to collect.

It's already a gamble enough knowing it might not be the card in looking for.

But I already decided that Plasma Freeze is my last set to buy packs for and I'll probably quit after I finish Skyridge. MAYBE... Might look into XY depending on what they look like.

But I'm never buying English packs again.

It's messed up to have people spend 100$ on cards and be like "oh hey it's random and your REALLY unlucky!!! You only got 6-10 holos!!! Everything else... Worthless rares. Buy another one maybe? :3"

 

[bagoly14]

I don't see why everyone is complaining...I mean I thoroughly enjoy the thought of cards like Deoxys EX and Thundurus EX being even more expensive because of random pull rates

This whole concept is ridiculous. If this is true then boxes should not cost over 45$.

Then again I don't care because I stopped collecting English cards 6 months into it because of this kind of nonsense. Bought some old WOTC boxes, got angry with the quality of the cards and never looked back.

 

[proddy]

I don't see why everyone is complaining...I mean I thoroughly enjoy the thought of cards like Deoxys EX and Thundurus EX being even more expensive because of random pull rates

This whole concept is ridiculous. If this is true then boxes should not cost over 45$.

Then again I don't care because I stopped collecting English cards 6 months into it because of this kind of nonsense. Bought some old WOTC boxes, got angry with the quality of the cards and never looked back.

They can double dip as well. Make super duper awesome Ultra Rares like Thundurus and Deoxys, make the rates random as hell to drive the prices up. Then a few months later put them in tins and tank the price but while scraping in the cash from tin sales.