I'm not entirely certain which deck is the best deck in the current format, but Alohan Muk has helped immensely in my Buzzrock deck against attacking hoppa, and anytime someone plays Mew (which was a lot only a couple weeks ago).
Personally, I feel like Zoroark/Garbodor is probably the best Zoroark variant right now given the meta and Lucario is probably the most overhyped (similar to how Decidueye was)
Sorry, I should have frased the Greninja thing a bit differently, and I meant that if you can FIND a good enough list, like the one in Charlottesville, then you won’t brick very often, and I only have 30 CP because unfortunately I have very packed weekends and don’t have time to travel around to league cups and stuff, but the 30 CP is only from 3 league cups so quit disrespecting my low points. Lol.
Also, Lycanroc FBL 1HKOs Hoopas and Zoroarks with ease, and multi switch helps a lot with the attack cost, making it great in my oppinion.
What results? Enlighten me. (Not meant in a rude way, just curious)
Yes, this is why I was saying Greninja Break is good because almost nobody plays the Giratina promo anymore and it would be a good idea not to play Greninja multiple times in a row because you’ll get Teched against faster than you can say “Frogs!”
Yes, I hoped I hadn't started anything either, I'm glad we're all on the same page now. The results I'm going on are mainly from Sao Paulo, Santiago and Jakarta, also from PTCGO (although that doesn't count as 'major tournaments') which is arguably the best source for meta decks outside of major tournaments.
First of all, I'm not trying to be argumentative; but, IMO, the 1 "recent major tournament results" does not provide enough justification versus multiple major tournaments or a season of major tournaments ("like" Night March).
In regards to deck tiers, IMO, I would rank the following decks accordingly:
Tier 1: Buzzwole-Garbodor, Buzzwole-Lycanroc, and Espeon-Garbodor
My groupings are based upon several factors including: personal experience playing or competing against said deck "many" times, number of times seeing the deck played by other players, perceived popularity, versatility, damage output, attack options, and board control options.
If you asked me to bet money on a Bo3 battle with one deck of my choosing, I would likely pick Buzzwole/Lycanroc. Other than that, I would choose just about anything starring Zoroark-GX, especially Zoroark-GX/Gardevoir-GX.
VikaBulu is better than DuskZone because it has consistently placed well (and I believe better than DuskZone), and doesn't require you to have the energy in hand.
First of all, I'm not trying to be argumentative; but, IMO, the 1 "recent major tournament results" does not provide enough justification versus multiple major tournaments or a season of major tournaments ("like" Night March).
In regards to deck tiers, IMO, I would rank the following decks accordingly:
Tier 1: Buzzwole-Garbodor, Buzzwole-Lycanroc, and Espeon-Garbodor
My groupings are based upon several factors including: personal experience playing or competing against said deck "many" times, number of times seeing the deck played by other players, perceived popularity, versatility, damage output, attack options, and board control options.
Are you saying that (in your opinion) Zoroark is not a tier 1 deck? I am sorry, but that I simply cannot agree with. This may be your opinion, but factually Zoroark is a tier 1 deck, and has been for a LONG time. There is no denying that. You also place Volcanion tier 2, a deck that not seen any major tournament placements (regionals-wise) since Collinsville, which was two and a half months ago! Here is my factually backed up opinion (provided by Limitless TCG) on which decks (as wholes, not split into variants) are in what tiers:
Are you saying that (in your opinion) Zoroark is not a tier 1 deck? I am sorry, but that I simply cannot agree with. This may be your opinion, but factually Zoroark is a tier 1 deck, and has been for a LONG time. There is no denying that. You also place Volcanion tier 2, a deck that not seen any major tournament placements (regionals-wise) since Collinsville, which was two and a half months ago! Here is my factually backed up opinion (provided by Limitless TCG) on which decks (as wholes, not split into variants) are in what tiers:
Tier 1:
Zoroark
Buzzwole
Garbodor
*Vikavolt
Tier 2:
Sylveon
Gardevoir
Greninja
Ho-Oh
Tier 3:
Attack Hoopa
Turbo Metal
Turbo Fire
Glaceon
(Primarily) Lucario
(Primarily) Golisopod
Tier 4:
Mill Decks
Rogue Decks
* = Not part of the 'Top Triangle' as @FrostBiter12 described it to be, but still good enough to be classed as tier 1.
Please tell me if I missed any, and if you think I should put some decks in different tiers.
Hmm, I guess VikaBulu is good enough to be in Tier 1 since it has been placing well, but I haven't seen it win a Regional yet. I think that would be the only reason for it not to be in Tier 1, but it isn't definitely a top competitor in my opinion. The rest of the list looks pretty good, though I don't think that Ho-oh GX is better than Turbo Metal (DMN GX/Magenzone I assume) since DMN GX/Magnezone made 3 Top 64 placements in Sao Paulo while Ho-oh GX only made one (and that was in 63rd place). Sylveon GX hasn't been doing to well recently, so I would keep an eye on it to see whether or not it needs to move down a Tier. Besides that, everything else looks fine in my opinion!
Hmm, I guess VikaBulu is good enough to be in Tier 1 since it has been placing well, but I haven't seen it win a Regional yet. I think that would be the only reason for it not to be in Tier 1, but it isn't definitely a top competitor in my opinion. The rest of the list looks pretty good, though I don't think that Ho-oh GX is better than Turbo Metal (DMN GX/Magenzone I assume) since DMN GX/Magnezone made 3 Top 64 placements in Sao Paulo while Ho-oh GX only made one (and that was in 63rd place). Sylveon GX hasn't been doing to well recently, so I would keep an eye on it to see whether or not it needs to move down a Tier. Besides that, everything else looks fine in my opinion!
I can agree with you on that, I'll swap Turbo Metal and Ho-Oh around. I'll keep Sylveon where it is for now, although if a deck were to overtake it (I find whenever a deck falls a tier, another one usually takes it's place) I would say it would be Glaceon, as it hasn't seen as much play as it was hyped up to.
I firmly believe that one of the universal goals for rogue deck players like me is to beat the BDIF, a.k.a Best Deck in Format. Two problems ensue:
What is the BDIF?
How do we cream its crop? (In other words, how do we beat it?)
Unlike the title says, however, this is a tier list with the BDIF in bold, the most fun deck (by vote) in italics, and rogue decks that could actually be in the tier list are underlined.
Unlike @AFEX's thread about Standard budget decks, these are top-built meta decks.
As suggestions are made, I will update this post's tier list.
Said tier list is here:
Tier 1:
-Buzzwole GX Variants (weak to not dominating the field)
-Zoroark GX (weak to ability lock)
Tier 2:
-Gardevoir GX (weak to inconsistent setup)
-Dusk Mane Necrozma GX/Magnezone (weak to Fire types)
-Greninja BREAK (weak to Giratina Promo)
Tier 3:
-VikaBulu (weak to...?)
Tier 4:
-Quad Sylveon (weak to...?
-Hoopa (weak to strong 1 Prize attackers)
-Salazzle GX/Lurantis (weak to slow setups)
Honorable Mention (Usually Prominent Techs)
-To Garbodor for its powerful ability lock
-To the above Salazzle GX/Lurantis for its rogue win ratio of 20/22 wins.
If you suggest a deck, suggest what deck it is ('duh' implied), suggest what it's tier is, and most importantly, what you believe that deck's biggest weakness to be. (Type weakness too, but preferably game weakness.)
Note that decks with many archetypes will just be under one name: all the Buzzwole variants will be simply "Buzzwole."
Let’s hop to it!
I'm not going to be trouble this time like the "dragon incident."
Oh, VikaBulu is weak to over 210 HP Pokemon, and the KOing of there Vikavolt.
Quad (more like triple) Sylveon is weak to cards that can accelerate energy from the discard fast, and recovery cards.
I think that Volcanion deserves a tier 2 spot for its sheer consistency and high damage output, and Volc has done well every once in awhile and has decent mach-ups across the board (Except for Glaceon), but is weak to decks that can KO multiple Volcs at the same (Jet Punch), hit for weakness, or out speed it.
Oh and by the way Goomy, I think the comparison you made between my thread, and "Top Built Meta Decks" was extremely disrespectful, you basically just offended my whole team, and the people who built some of those decks, by inferring they weren't "Top Built". They may not be the best, but that comparison was unesecary. That was genuinely uncalled for. It just makes you look selfish. Your character really came into question there. Im hurt you would say something like that, and leap to that. Im speechless. Im no trying to make you feel bad or hurt Goomy, Im just shocked you would say something like that.
No one mentionned Passimian/Mew FCO decks. It has what it takes to be a good anti meta rogue deck. It hits for weakness on both Psychic or Fighting types so it can beat Buzzwole-Gx and Zoroark-Gx kinda easily. It can also beat Garbodor and its friends, Drampa-Gx and Espeon-Gx easily (unless the Ability lock is done very early).
Currently i am testing with Passimian/Mew FCO deck. Instead of focusing solely on these attackers, i am trying to include a few pokemon friends to the deck. Since the deck neturally uses Mew FCO and Counter Energy, it opens a lot of tech possibilities. Sudowoodo, Cobalion and such are the first ones we think of but there can be so many. For exemple, this deck does not use Gx attack but could easily include a single pokemon Gx copy just so that Mew FCO can copy its Gx attack.
I used Mew FCO in one of my deck this weak to copy Timeless Gx and take 4 prizes while i was behind 4-1. Timeless Gx or Glutton-Gx are extreme attacks one could copy with Mew FCO but there are many options.
Are you saying that (in your opinion) Zoroark is not a tier 1 deck? I am sorry, but that I simply cannot agree with. This may be your opinion, but factually Zoroark is a tier 1 deck, and has been for a LONG time. There is no denying that. You also place Volcanion tier 2, a deck that not seen any major tournament placements (regionals-wise) since Collinsville, which was two and a half months ago!
Zoroark was just an oversight on my part; however, it is used in a lot of different decks and not all (not even half + (?) would qualify for T1, IMO).
IMO, just because a deck may not be as popular as others does not dis-qualify it from a high deck Tier ranking. Volcanion decks got an interesting "boost" with the FL set and it still setups fast, has versatility, good attackers and can inflict significant damage. The right pilot could do well with this deck...
