but why wouldn't you want your kid to be a fan of a male female? But yeah, it's true that they don't really care about us die hard fans.
When did the Anime, "Jump the shark?"
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Juliacoolo
afstandopleren said:
0.o I'm going to take that as a joke. something that may surprise us, is that if you go to a random supermarket, you're going to find out that there is a much higher supplies of pokemon action figures, and other kid merchendise, then there is TCG, and video games. I'm guessing 90% of pokemon fans don't even know that competitive play exists.
Juliacoolo said:Pokemon doesn't care about die-hard fans. They only care about the newest generation of fans who have rich parents, and buy a lot of anime junk. They want a fresh start for each generation, that's why Ash will never win the championship. It's sad enough that he's played by a girl.PokemonTrainerLisa said:What TV show was Sarah on? Where did she say that she didn't feel she could play Ash?xxashxx said:
What are you talking about? Where are you getting your "facts"?xxashxx said:
As far as I know, Pokemon USA never held a petition for the fans to see if they should keep the original cast.
In fact, 4Kids used to dub the Pokemon anime. 4Kids dubbed seasons 1 through 8. But sometime around June/July of 2006, Pokemon USA got the license to dub the anime, because they wanted to be in control of the anime (since they already owned the rights to the licensing of the video games and the TCG). One of their first decisions upon getting the anime license, was to replace the entire voice cast. That's right. Pokemon USA replaced all of the original voice actors! And the worst part is that, Pokemon USA didn't even give them a chance to continue working on the show, once season 9 came along.
Before season 9 was dubbed, Pokemon USA made a 10th Anniversary special called the Mastermind of Mirage Pokemon. This special aired on KidsWB. However, it was absolutely terrible, and all the fans hated it! And everyone emailed Pokemon USA, complaining about how bad the new voices were! Unfortunately, Pokemon USA didn't learn from their mistake. In the Mastermind special, Ash was voiced by Kayzie Rogers (aka Jamie Peacock). So, in response to the fan outcry, Pokemon USA decided to redub the special. But instead of actually listening to the fans, they kept the new voice actors (Michele Knotz, Bill Rogers, and Jimmy Zoppi - aka, Billy Beach). And, they made one change for the Mastermind redub. They got rid of Kayzie Rogers as Ash, and that's when they decided to hire Sarah Natochenny.
And I know for a fact that Veronica Taylor was never offered, nor approached, to work on the Mastermind special (or season 9). I know this, because I received emails from Veronica Taylor herself, during the time of the VA switch.
Veronica loved voicing Ash, and she definitely would have worked on the show again, if Pokemon USA would've given her that chance. But unfortunately, the company never gave her that opportunity. In fact, to this day, Pokemon USA has told Veronica that she "isn't allowed to work on the show". This makes me very upset, because I know that Veronica really wants to voice Ash again.
Yeah, but there's the old saying, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".xxashxx said:
My point is that, Pokemon USA shouldn't have replaced the original voice actors. The Pokemon anime wasn't broken, before Pokemon USA "fixed it" by replacing the original voice actors. They had no reason to make a change like this. The characters on Pokemon had the same voices and same personalities for 8 years. All Pokemon USA did, by changing the VAs, was cause fans to lose interest in the show (because they replaced the voice actors, which changed the characters on Pokemon completely). And, they did something unbelievably cruel to the original voice actors, by replacing them like this, after they had worked on the show for 8 years. And how Pokemon USA didn't even give them the chance to work on the show again, that's the part which makes me really upset.
I mean, it's obvious that Sarah Natochenny can't bring Ash to life. She just can't give him the same amount of emotion as Veronica could. And actually, the majority of fans prefer Veronica's portrayal of Ash (over Sarah Natochenny's). This makes me wonder why Pokemon USA doesn't want to allow Veronica to work on the show. They seem biased. What exactly does that this company have against her? Veronica Taylor (along with the rest of the original voice cast) worked on Pokemon for 8 years. And in my opinion, I really think Veronica deserves the chance to voice Ash again. At the very least, Pokemon USA could still offer her a chance to work on the show and regain the role that she loved. The role of Ash Ketchum.
By the way, don't get me wrong. I have nothing against Sarah Natochenny (the new voice actor for Ash). I simply dislike her portrayal of Ash, because her emotion always seems so fake and forced. That, and she does a terrible job in certain Ash centered episodes (like "Pika and Goliath" and "Leading A Stray").
Veronica always did an amazing job voicing Ash. She truly made him who he was. That's why I want Veronica Taylor to voice Ash again. Because I feel like Sarah's Ash is a completely different character. But like I said, I have nothing personal against Sarah. I mean, if Pokemon USA were to give Veronica the chance to regain her role as Ash again, that's all that I want. Sarah Natochenny could still work on the show, and I wouldn't mind that at all. She's a good voice actress, and I'm sure she would do just fine in any other role. But, Sarah just isn't Ash (in my opinion). =P
And it's not like it would be impossible for Veronica to work on the show. Afterall, Rachael Lillis (the original voice of Misty and Jessie) did the voice of the gym leader Maylene, in 4 episodes of Pokemon Battle Dimension. So, because Pokemon USA allowed Rachael Lillis to return and do a minor role, it shouldn't be much of a stretch for them to allow Veronica to work on the show and regain her original role as Ash.
Actually it is not sad since Veronica Taylor did an outstanding job. Sarah is ok but she will never be Veronica Taylor. The just need to work with her more until she geys the voice down better.
They need to make Ash grow older. He seriously needs a MALE VA, like Brock.
Oh, I see. That's interesting.xxashxx said:
I've never heard of that show before. What network does it come on? And is it a show from the US or another country?
What is your source for that information? Do you have a link or something?xxashxx said:
I don't remember Pokemon USA ever holding a petition/comment thing, and if they did, it most likely would've been held on pokemon.com.
The only thing they have on pokemon.com is their Mailbag, and no offense, but Pokemon USA's customer service is TERRIBLE! Seriously.
But what really makes me upset, is how they aren't allowing Veronica to work on the show. That just isn't fair, considering how much Veronica wants to return, and regain her role as Ash.
Or better yet, they just need to hire Veronica Taylor and Rachael Lillis (and Eric Stuart, if he still wants to voice Brock/James). And they could easily do that too, considering the fact that there's nothing preventing the original VAs from returning. Except for the company itself, Pokemon USA/International.xxashxx said:They need to work on getting new VA's For Ash Team Rocket and Brock badly.
Are you kidding me?xxashxx said:The need to work on the voice more though. If they work with her more then it would be better.
No offense, but Sarah Natochenny's been working on the Pokemon USA dub for 3 years so far. If she was going to improve, or get better, we would've seen this happen already. But the fact is, that she hasn't improved much since Battle Frontier (in my opinion). It's obvious to me, that Sarah isn't the right person to play Ash. And this makes me wonder why so many fans are settling for Sarah as Ash, when they know that Veronica is the only one who can TRULY bring Ash Ketchum to life. Veronica deserves to voice Ash again, because she made him who he was.
As for Sarah, here are some things you may not know about her acting and portrayal of Ash:
- She's very inconsistent with her pitch (she changes the pitch for Ash's voice very often)
- She has this weird patten of putting an emphasis on certain words (Example: "I choose YOU!" instead of "I choose you!", and listen closely to how she says the titles - "PRUNing a PASSel of Pals", "Our Cup RUNNeth OVer")
- She pronounces Pokemon wrong, the way it was pronounced way back in season one ("Poh-kuh-mon")
- She pronounces Pikachu wrong, by putting an emphasis on the first syllable ("PIIII-kachu"); this is one of the things I can't stand about Sarah's portrayal of Ash.
- She uses emotion, but the kind of emotion she uses sounds forced and very fake
; and this is what I hate the most about Sarah's portrayal of Ash.In comparision, when Veronica read her lines, her acting always sounded very natural. Her pitch was very consistent, and the voice she used for Ash sounded unique and special (the perfect kind of voice for the main character). Veronica's acting was excellent and she always did a great job with her line delivery (just watch any Ash centered episode from the 4Kids dub, or movies 1 through 8 and you'll see what I mean). You could tell that Veronica always used a lot of emotion, because her portrayal of Ash makes him seem real! And of course, Veronica knew how to say Pikachu correctly.
Yep, I think Veronica is definitely a better fit to play the role of Ash.
Come on, Pokemon anime fans, we need to convince Pokemon USA (or rather, Pokemon International) to give Veronica a chance to work on the show, and regain her role of Ash Ketchum.
If anyone here wants to help bring Veronica back to Pokemon, please send me a PM. I can tell you how you can help her return. ^_^
PokemonTrainerLisa said:Oh, I see. That's interesting.xxashxx said:
I've never heard of that show before. What network does it come on? And is it a show from the US or another country?
It is U.S.A. and Canada only/ It is on NBC or CBS. I forget which one on Saturdays and Sunday's.
What is your source for that information? Do you have a link or something?xxashxx said:
I don't remember Pokemon USA ever holding a petition/comment thing, and if they did, it most likely would've been held on pokemon.com.
It was a Save our VA's thing where you could write to them by E mail, A few members here did that and so did WPM. Alot of fans did as well but it was no good.
The only thing they have on pokemon.com is their Mailbag, and no offense, but Pokemon USA's customer service is TERRIBLE! Seriously.
I have heard about that. I never go to the mailbag. It is not worth it.
But what really makes me upset, is how they aren't allowing Veronica to work on the show. That just isn't fair, considering how much Veronica wants to return, and regain her role as Ash.
I know. They just did not like them so they got rid of them. They don't care about the best VA's.
Or better yet, they just need to hire Veronica Taylor and Rachael Lillis (and Eric Stuart, if he still wants to voice Brock/James). And they could easily do that too, considering the fact that there's nothing preventing the original VAs from returning. Except for the company itself, Pokemon USA/International.xxashxx said:They need to work on getting new VA's For Ash Team Rocket and Brock badly.
Are you kidding me?xxashxx said:The need to work on the voice more though. If they work with her more then it would be better.
No offense, but Sarah Natochenny's been working on the Pokemon USA dub for 3 years so far. If she was going to improve, or get better, we would've seen this happen already. But the fact is, that she hasn't improved much since Battle Frontier (in my opinion). It's obvious to me, that Sarah isn't the right person to play Ash. And this makes me wonder why so many fans are settling for Sarah as Ash, when they know that Veronica is the only one who can TRULY bring Ash Ketchum to life. Veronica deserves to voice Ash again, because she made him who he was.
As for Sarah, here are some things you may not know about her acting and portrayal of Ash:
- She's very inconsistent with her pitch (she changes the pitch for Ash's voice very often)
- She has this weird patten of putting an emphasis on certain words (Example: "I choose YOU!" instead of "I choose you!", and listen closely to how she says the titles - "PRUNing a PASSel of Pals", "Our Cup RUNNeth OVer")
- She pronounces Pokemon wrong, the way it was pronounced way back in season one ("Poh-kuh-mon")
- She pronounces Pikachu wrong, by putting an emphasis on the first syllable ("PIIII-kachu"); this is one of the things I can't stand about Sarah's portrayal of Ash.
- She uses emotion, but the kind of emotion she uses sounds forced and very fake
In comparision, when Veronica read her lines, her acting always sounded very natural. Her pitch was very consistent, and the voice she used for Ash sounded unique and special (the perfect kind of voice for the main character). Veronica's acting was excellent and she always did a great job with her line delivery (just watch any Ash centered episode from the 4Kids dub, or movies 1 through 8 and you'll see what I mean). You could tell that Veronica always used a lot of emotion, because her portrayal of Ash makes him seem real! And of course, Veronica knew how to say Pikachu correctly.
Yep, I think Veronica is definitely a better fit to play the role of Ash.
Come on, Pokemon anime fans, we need to convince Pokemon USA (or rather, Pokemon International) to give Veronica a chance to work on the show, and regain her role of Ash Ketchum.
If anyone here wants to help bring Veronica back to Pokemon, please send me a PM. I can tell you how you can help her return. ^_^
I know it is not the best but you just have to take in what they dish out. Maybe in a few years they will realize what they did and bring them back.
the best ones were kanto and the jhoto region!! in my opinion
Series one was descent becdause they appreciated thatthe people watchign weren't all below the age of 7. Since Gen 3, watching pokemon makes you feel like watching a baby's TV show, which it has become. Its to the extent now that someone who avidly follows the pokemon anime over hte age of about 10 is as bad as watchign somethign like telitubbies or bob the builder. Its so patronising, the way the characters speak, act, etc. And don't get me staerted on the sandwhices which are really rice balls. And then the doughnuts are rice balls too. Its just lpain dumb. Ash is about 3 yeras old, but acts younger. I mean, he has had a pikachu for like 11 years of pokemon, and he stil hasnt realised that vp;t tacl;e dpesnt hit ground types, or that psychic won't hit a weavile. And this whole buisness of how a pokemon can just dodge a move. Its all plain dumb.
I disagree with the sentiment the anime has gone downhill over the years. The writing has actaully been improving quite a bit, some people are just too blinded my nostalgia to give some of the newer stuff a chance. I am referring to the Japanese version of the anime however, the current english dub is outright terrible in almost every way.
For the current dub, Pokemon USA's quality of voice work and opening music is worlds below what 4Kids used to produce, I am pleased with the lack of paint edits, but everything else just drags the production waaaay down.
For the current dub, Pokemon USA's quality of voice work and opening music is worlds below what 4Kids used to produce, I am pleased with the lack of paint edits, but everything else just drags the production waaaay down.
Ah, I see. You are referring to SOVA: Save Our Voice Actors.xxashxx said:It was a Save our VA's thing where you could write to them by E mail, A few members here did that and so did WPM. Alot of fans did as well but it was no good.
I'm actually one of the supporters of that campaign. I've been trying to bring back the original voice actors ever since the campaign first started.
However, SOVA isn't affiliated by Pokemon USA in any way. SOVA is simply a non-profit organization, started by fans, and supported by fans.
So, are you saying it's right for a dubbing company to replace voice actors who have worked on a show for 8 years? Are you saying this is a good thing for companies to do?xxashxx said:I know. They jusr did not like them so theu got rid of them. They don't care about the best VA's.
If you believe it's okay for voice actors to be replaced, especially after they've worked on a show for so long and gotten attached to the characters they've played, then I completely disagree with you there.
That's exactly what I'm trying to say. There is still hope!!xxashxx said:I know it is not the best but you just have to take in what they dish out. Maybe in a few years they will realize what they did and bring them back.
And that's because of the fact that, Veronica still wants to work on Pokemon, but the company isn't allowing her to return. Also, 4Kids voice actors have worked on the Pokemon USA dub. Rachael Lillis even had a minor role on the show, as Maylene. And, people like Dan Green, Sean Schemmel, Ted Lewis (aka Ed Paul), and Lisa Ortiz are currently working for Pokemon USA. And if they could hire those voice actors, I see no reason why they would be unable to hire Veronica.
I think Pokemon USA is biased against Veronica, and they prefer Sarah for some reason. But, I know that the majority of fans prefer Veronica as Ash.
However, if Pokemon anime fans have this kind of attitude "Let's watch Pokemon anyway, despite the poor quality of the voice acting", and "Let's do nothing to right this wrong, nothing to bring back what we lost". I believe if too many fans have this opinion, then Pokemon USA will not bring back Veronica Taylor, because so many people are doing exactly what you suggested "taking what Pokemon USA dishes out".
From my perspective, many Pokemon fans are just settling for poor quality voice acting, because that's what Pokemon USA is giving us. A lot of fans seem to be doing this, rather than doing something more positive - hoping and believing that they can make a difference and bring back the original voice actors. In my opinion, many fans have forgotten that there was a time when you would turn on the TV to watch Pokemon and the voice acting would be absolutely amazing. For older fans like myself, we knew exactly what to expect from the show. But nowadays, with D/P, everything is different. The show no longer feels the same, because the characters have changed (both their voices and personaities have changed).
Just compare the quality of the voice acting from the Pokemon USA dub, to the 4Kids dub (season 1 through 8) and you'll see what I mean.
Anyway, my point is that, if the majority of fans prefer Veronica Taylor as Ash Ketchum, then they should do something to help her return. Fans who really miss Veronica's Ash voice, and who prefer her portrayal of Ash (over Sarah's portrayal) - they need to get involved and do something to help make this happen.
It's true that we're only fans, but we can still make a difference. We can and will bring back Veronica Taylor! But in order for this to happen, everyone who wants Veronica to return must stand up and be willing to fight for her.
Some fans have what it takes. Some fans are willing to fight, other's aren't. It just depends on how big a fan you are of Veronica (and the other voice actors), whether you are willing to do something to help, and how determined you are to make this happen.
Bottom line: If anyone here has read what I've said, if you agree with me, and - if you REALLY want Veronica Tayor to return as Ash, then please send me a PM.
"One person can make all the difference." - Remember this quote? It's from Pokemon 2000!!
PokemonTrainerLisa said:Ah, I see. You are referring to SOVA: Save Our Voice Actors.xxashxx said:It was a Save our VA's thing where you could write to them by E mail, A few members here did that and so did WPM. Alot of fans did as well but it was no good.
I'm actually one of the supporters of that campaign. I've been trying to bring back the original voice actors ever since the campaign first started.
However, SOVA isn't affiliated by Pokemon USA in any way. SOVA is simply a non-profit organization, started by fans, and supported by fans.
So, are you saying it's right for a dubbing company to replace voice actors who have worked on a show for 8 years? Are you saying this is a good thing for companies to do?xxashxx said:I know. They just did not like them so theu got rid of them. They don't care about the best VA's.
If you believe it's okay for voice actors to be replaced, especially after they've worked on a show for so long and gotten attached to the characters they've played, then I completely disagree with you there.
No it is not right. That is what they basically did though. I want better VA's but we have to deal with it for now. SOVA is not helping apparently. If they cared they would have brought them back in Season 10.
That's exactly what I'm trying to say. There is still hope!!xxashxx said:I know it is not the best but you just have to take in what they dish out. Maybe in a few years they will realize what they did and bring them back.
And that's because of the fact that, Veronica still wants to work on Pokemon, but the company isn't allowing her to return. Also, 4Kids voice actors have worked on the Pokemon USA dub. Rachael Lillis even had a minor role on the show, as Maylene. And, people like Dan Green, Sean Schemmel, Ted Lewis (aka Ed Paul), and Lisa Ortiz are currently working for Pokemon USA. And if they could hire those voice actors, I see no reason why they would be unable to hire Veronica.
I think Pokemon USA is biased against Veronica, and they prefer Sarah for some reason. But, I know that the majority of fans prefer Veronica as Ash.
However, if Pokemon anime fans have this kind of attitude "Let's watch Pokemon anyway, despite the poor quality of the voice acting", and "Let's do nothing to right this wrong, nothing to bring back what we lost". I believe if too many fans have this opinion, then Pokemon USA will not bring back Veronica Taylor, because so many people are doing exactly what you suggested "taking what Pokemon USA dishes out".
From my perspective, many Pokemon fans are just settling for poor quality voice acting, because that's what Pokemon USA is giving us. A lot of fans seem to be doing this, rather than doing something more positive - hoping and believing that they can make a difference and bring back the original voice actors. In my opinion, many fans have forgotten that there was a time when you would turn on the TV to watch Pokemon and the voice acting would be absolutely amazing. For older fans like myself, we knew exactly what to expect from the show. But nowadays, with D/P, everything is different. The show no longer feels the same, because the characters have changed (both their voices and personaities have changed).
Just compare the quality of the voice acting from the Pokemon USA dub, to the 4Kids dub (season 1 through 8) and you'll see what I mean.
Anyway, my point is that, if the majority of fans prefer Veronica Taylor as Ash Ketchum, then they should do something to help her return. Fans who really miss Veronica's Ash voice, and who prefer her portrayal of Ash (over Sarah's portrayal) - they need to get involved and do something to help make this happen.
It's true that we're only fans, but we can still make a difference. We can and will bring back Veronica Taylor! But in order for this to happen, everyone who wants Veronica to return must stand up and be willing to fight for her.
Some fans have what it takes. Some fans are willing to fight, other's aren't. It just depends on how big a fan you are of Veronica (and the other voice actors), whether you are willing to do something to help, and how determined you are to make this happen.
Bottom line: If anyone here has read what I've said, if you agree with me, and - if you REALLY want Veronica Tayor to return as Ash, then please send me a PM.
"One person can make all the difference." - Remember this quote? It's from Pokemon 2000!!
I want Veronica back most definetly. For some reason PUSA does not like the original cast or they would have kept them.
I quit after the Johto seasons..I still however, enjoy the movies.
Actually the Anime changed drasitcally in season 8 because the hardcore players want to see more battles rather than the way it was the first 7 seasons. That was when things started to change. After that was when it started going downhill. It is pretty good now but season 9 was not that great for the VA's but is slowly getting better but never will be the same as the old cast.
I don't think the new voices are that bad. They were horrible at first, but I think they're fine now. I never really cared much for the old voices, anyway. lol
I think the main reason for the show going downhill is because it's kinda boring now. It use to be more entertaining and funny.
I think the main reason for the show going downhill is because it's kinda boring now. It use to be more entertaining and funny.
Wow, that's an interesting opinion you have there, lol.meowth14 said:I never really cared much for the old voices, anyway. lol
Most people I know seem to prefer the original voices. Hehe, it's funny how you like the new voices better. XD
i hate all of the voices
There is a fellow with a site, I know he is a mod over at Serebii, his username escapes me at the moment, but he refers to the "Pokemon OVA". While not being on OVA, it was broadcast on TV, it has a radicaly different feel to the rest of the series.
What is the Pokemon OVA? Pokemon, I Choose You! to Electric Shock Showdown. Yes, alot of the first series is considerably darker than Jhoto onwards(Sabrina and Mewtwo strike me as specificaly dark), the tone was different in these earlier episodes. The colour pallet used in these episodes is also different to what is used afterwards.
The reason for this I believe is Pokemon found it's audience, small children. Alot of shows are much different in their first season. This also may be the reason why older fans have preference to Kanto, other than Naustalgia.
Pokemon, after it found it's audience, never jumped the shark, it's just that most people posting or playing the games "properly" aka Competitively, are not the target audience. It's just as bad or good, depending on view, as it always has been after the initial episodes.
EDIT:
On the topic of VAs, I didn't read past page one, I don't get why the fandom loves 4kids so much. I watched sense the beginning, and can honestly say I believe strongly that the new cast is far superior. So superior that I'd like to one day see them redub the whole thing. I don't want to go into detail, but I had never laughed at Brock before Pokemon USA, enjoyed James either. Don't get me started on how happy I am that May isn't a slightly altered April O'Neil now.
What is the Pokemon OVA? Pokemon, I Choose You! to Electric Shock Showdown. Yes, alot of the first series is considerably darker than Jhoto onwards(Sabrina and Mewtwo strike me as specificaly dark), the tone was different in these earlier episodes. The colour pallet used in these episodes is also different to what is used afterwards.
The reason for this I believe is Pokemon found it's audience, small children. Alot of shows are much different in their first season. This also may be the reason why older fans have preference to Kanto, other than Naustalgia.
Pokemon, after it found it's audience, never jumped the shark, it's just that most people posting or playing the games "properly" aka Competitively, are not the target audience. It's just as bad or good, depending on view, as it always has been after the initial episodes.
EDIT:
On the topic of VAs, I didn't read past page one, I don't get why the fandom loves 4kids so much. I watched sense the beginning, and can honestly say I believe strongly that the new cast is far superior. So superior that I'd like to one day see them redub the whole thing. I don't want to go into detail, but I had never laughed at Brock before Pokemon USA, enjoyed James either. Don't get me started on how happy I am that May isn't a slightly altered April O'Neil now.
PokemonTrainerLisa said:Wow, that's an interesting opinion you have there, lol.meowth14 said:I never really cared much for the old voices, anyway. lol
Most people I know seem to prefer the original voices. Hehe, it's funny how you like the new voices better. XD
Well, I think the old ones were better. I just don't think the new ones are as bad as some people think. lol
The only time that I loved the voice acting was in the first two seasons. If you compare the first and eighth season, the voices are quite different. Even though it's the same voice actors. That's why I don't really care much for the old ones.
i started in late hoenn but i watched most of johto and kanto some way or another but it is pretty bad know i just have a habit the biggest thing a hate about it is the voices the original ones were awesome
but it is pretty bad know i just have a habit the biggest thing a hate about it is the voices the original ones were awesome- Status