(1) June 23rd Release for 'Black 2' and 'White 2' in Japan [4/8]

[signofzeta]

I have a great idea s to what Game Freak should release.

Let's take a generation for example, well let's pretend its generation 7.

Let's call the 2 versions Bob and Joe. That would sort of be like Diamond and Pearl, that is, the main series of games.

The third version, now the sequeled version, will be called Bob and Joe 2. Bob and Joe 2 will have a complete ending, and will close out the games in the generation.

Black and White 3 will be made in this generation. Bob and Joe 3 will be released in Generation 9, and will not really be a continuation, but will be stuff that happens way in the future in that region.

So the game and its sequel will be released in a generation, and to complete the "trilogy", the third game will be released 2 generations later.

Could you imagine the Gold and Silver Trilogy?

Gold Silver = Gold Silver 1
Crystal = Gold Silver 2
HeartGold SoulSilver = Gold Silver 3

All having the release dates as we had before, that is, the third game being released 10 or so years later. You know, we seen those movies, where we thought that the second movie of the series is the last one, until 10 years later, there is a third one in the series.

 

[Mitja]

I'm aware that wouldn't be a problem, but in the end it all comes down to the question of "do we really need remakes"? The answer to that is weighted towards "no"; RSE games are already compatible with DS and it's very possible to get Hoenn Pokemon on newer games. It's not like we're being left in the dark here.

Besides, if you remade RSE, there wouldn't be much to remake, most likely. They're already designed in the "newer" generations of the games, and there wouldn't be all that much to add that wasn't there already.
And this has nothing to do with Nintendo trying to make money. Needing a remake and making money off something are two completely separate concepts.

I honestly hope an RSE remake does not ever get made, both for the reasons I just stated and because I feel like Hoenn will be marred forever if they decide to do something like that.

Completely agree.
I loved RSE, but they're perfectly complete.

Remakes are pointless on a way deeper level for these.
Not to mention RS are incomplete without E already *waits for someone to honestly suggest the silly idea they could just add all the emerald stuff into them, and make a not thought through comparison to Crystal stuff in HGSS*

Id rather they introduce gba games for 3ds ware with RS or what was it, than to turn Hoenn to 3d with boring extra features.

On the other side,
I don't think anyone would mind if we paid a visit to a later Hoenn with a new adventure sometime.

---

They're not in the "Newer Generation". Why doesn't it relate to money? They would make a lot.
Do you really hate Hoenn that badly? 0.0

He probably means how gen 3 was pretty close to the mechanics that are still actual today. Theres the special/physical split but everything else was essentially there.
Gen 3 set a new standard for pokemon games, even plot-wise. FRLG HGSS brought those games to this standard.

Theyd make more by just changing things around and call it sequels for example...
No one hates Hoenn, itd just be pure milking and the result a meh game compared to the usual gamefreak quality, hence plain remakes of RS dont seem reasonable neither make much sense.

I could go on about several issues and topics regarding this till we're blue in the face.

 

[NachoMan]

Completely agree.
I loved RSE, but they're perfectly complete.

Remakes are pointless on a way deeper level for these.
Not to mention RS are incomplete without E already *waits for someone to honestly suggest the silly idea they could just add all the emerald stuff into them, and make a not thought through comparison to Crystal stuff in HGSS*

Id rather they introduce gba games for 3ds ware with RS or what was it, than to turn Hoenn to 3d with boring extra features.

On the other side,
I don't think anyone would mind if we paid a visit to a later Hoenn with a new adventure sometime.

---

He probably means how gen 3 was pretty close to the mechanics that are still actual today. Theres the special/physical split but everything else was essentially there.
Gen 3 set a new standard for pokemon games, even plot-wise. FRLG HGSS brought those games to this standard.

Theyd make more by just changing things around and call it sequels for example...
No one hates Hoenn, itd just be pure milking and the result a meh game compared to the usual gamefreak quality, hence plain remakes of RS don't seem reasonable neither make much sense.

I could go on about several issues and topics regarding this till we're blue in the face.

---

I get the mechanics part like the Pokemon party sprites, and the battle field where you stand but why would remakes ruin Hoenn? They maybe more closely modern to Diamond and Pearl than Gold and Silver. But why not update Hoenn. It was two generations ago. They could still do an graphic update with some 2D like with Castelia CIty.

 

[DNA]

but why would remakes ruin Hoenn? They maybe more closely modern to Diamond and Pearl than Gold and Silver.

Theyd make more by just changing things around and call it sequels for example...
No one hates Hoenn, itd just be pure milking and the result a meh game compared to the usual gamefreak quality, hence plain remakes of RS don't seem reasonable neither make much sense.

At this point, remaking Hoenn would change very little, if anything. Remakes would have very little to offer except for maybe some tweaked graphics and increased difficulty...but wait! Emerald already gave us both of those things!
A DS remake of Hoenn would most certainly be premature at this point in time. This is why if Game Freak remade it now in Generation 5, they'd probably destroy Hoenn's integrity forever. Heck, Hoenn may never need a remake, ever. Emerald is perfect the way it is.

 

[Zyflair]

I get the mechanics part like the Pokemon party sprites, and the battle field where you stand but why would remakes ruin Hoenn? They maybe more closely modern to Diamond and Pearl than Gold and Silver. But why not update Hoenn. It was two generations ago. They could still do an graphic update with some 2D like with Castelia CIty.

Your only argument here is that a remake would mean updated graphics. That's not enough of a reason for Gamefreak to completely remake the Hoenn games just so it would look nicer.

 

[Ophie]

One way to tell if a remake is coming is if a generation of Pokémon suddenly get left out. The biggest sign that Gold/Silver remakes were in the works for the 4th generation, for instance, was that there was very little coverage, in the games and in the TCG (and perhaps in the comics and anime too, to some extent) for Johto Pokémon. No such thing is happening here. Most notable are the Hoenn starters given out as promos in Japan. Game Freak would wait for the remakes to come out before doing such a thing if Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald remakes were to actually happen.

 

[lizapokecatcher]

One way to tell if a remake is coming is if a generation of Pokémon suddenly get left out. The biggest sign that Gold/Silver remakes were in the works for the 4th generation, for instance, was that there was very little coverage, in the games and in the TCG (and perhaps in the comics and anime too, to some extent) for Johto Pokémon. No such thing is happening here. Most notable are the Hoenn starters given out as promos in Japan. Game Freak would wait for the remakes to come out before doing such a thing if Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald remakes were to actually happen.

But why break tradition. Oh wait never mind

 

[signofzeta]

Ruby 2 Sapphire 2.

Nuff said.

 

[Ice Arceus]

Trailer 2 of Pokemon B2W2.

[video=youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxJGtJ7z9Eo&feature=player_embedded[/video]

 

[Teal]

One way to tell if a remake is coming is if a generation of Pokémon suddenly get left out. The biggest sign that Gold/Silver remakes were in the works for the 4th generation, for instance, was that there was very little coverage, in the games and in the TCG (and perhaps in the comics and anime too, to some extent) for Johto Pokémon. No such thing is happening here. Most notable are the Hoenn starters given out as promos in Japan. Game Freak would wait for the remakes to come out before doing such a thing if Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald remakes were to actually happen.

Was there really a lack of coverage for Johto Pokémon, as I didn't notice that. ;D

 

[Zygarde]

One way to tell if a remake is coming is if a generation of Pokémon suddenly get left out. The biggest sign that Gold/Silver remakes were in the works for the 4th generation, for instance, was that there was very little coverage, in the games and in the TCG (and perhaps in the comics and anime too, to some extent) for Johto Pokémon. No such thing is happening here. Most notable are the Hoenn starters given out as promos in Japan. Game Freak would wait for the remakes to come out before doing such a thing if Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald remakes were to actually happen.

But.. In the Pokémon Anime, Paul had a team (and personality) that resembles Silver/Kamon/Giovanni's son, and all of his Pokémon (bar Sinnoh starters) are related to Johto.
Also, in the Arceus movie, Johto starters were featured, and that was before the remakes were revealed.

 

[PG24]

Trailer 2 of Pokemon B2W2.

[video=youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxJGtJ7z9Eo&feature=player_embedded[/video]

So that IS a robotic Tyranitar.

 

[Ophie]

But.. In the Pokémon Anime, Paul had a team (and personality) that resembles Silver/Kamon/Giovanni's son, and all of his Pokémon (bar Sinnoh starters) are related to Johto.
Also, in the Arceus movie, Johto starters were featured, and that was before the remakes were revealed.

Didn't say they'd be completely omitted, or that they would never show up in the anime (it'd be unnatural if suddenly a generation of Pokémon stopped appearing.

So I decided to go through the first few Japanese sets of the 4th generation and all of the current sets in the 5th generation and sort the Pokémon cards by generation (not including reprints). Not including the 4th generation Pokémon, these were the amounts I counted (from Space-Time Creation to Temple of Anger):
Generation 1: 154
Generation 2: 103 (130)*
Generation 3: 136 (142)**
* The number in parentheses is the total amount of Generation 2 Pokémon cards if we count each Unown letter as a separate card (and they function as separate cards).
** The number in parentheses is the total amount of Generation 3 Pokémon cards if we counted each form of Castform and Deoxys separately (though you can swap one out for another at will).

For all of the current Generation 5 sets, these are the total number of cards from each generation, not including the 5th (from Black and White Collections to Dragon Blast and Dragon Blade):
Generation 1: 37
Generation 2: 17
Generation 3: 43
Generation 4: 31
These numbers are a lot lower becuse, except for a special Pikachu card, no non-Unova Pokémon appeared in the first two sets. Even then, the more recent decks have kept an emphasis on Unova Pokémon more than the Sinnoh-era sets.

So...I suppose it's pretty inconclusive. Turns out the first few 4th-generation sets did have roughly even representation of Pokémon, since if you look carefully, they're roughly proportional to the total number of Pokémon in their respective generations. If anything, there are a lack of 2nd-generation Pokémon in the Black/White sets.

 

[signofzeta]

Didn't say they'd be completely omitted, or that they would never show up in the anime (it'd be unnatural if suddenly a generation of Pokémon stopped appearing.

So I decided to go through the first few Japanese sets of the 4th generation and all of the current sets in the 5th generation and sort the Pokémon cards by generation (not including reprints). Not including the 4th generation Pokémon, these were the amounts I counted (from Space-Time Creation to Temple of Anger):
Generation 1: 154
Generation 2: 103 (130)*
Generation 3: 136 (142)**
* The number in parentheses is the total amount of Generation 2 Pokémon cards if we count each Unown letter as a separate card (and they function as separate cards).
** The number in parentheses is the total amount of Generation 3 Pokémon cards if we counted each form of Castform and Deoxys separately (though you can swap one out for another at will).

For all of the current Generation 5 sets, these are the total number of cards from each generation, not including the 5th (from Black and White Collections to Dragon Blast and Dragon Blade):
Generation 1: 37
Generation 2: 17
Generation 3: 43
Generation 4: 31
These numbers are a lot lower becuse, except for a special Pikachu card, no non-Unova Pokémon appeared in the first two sets. Even then, the more recent decks have kept an emphasis on Unova Pokémon more than the Sinnoh-era sets.

So...I suppose it's pretty inconclusive. Turns out the first few 4th-generation sets did have roughly even representation of Pokémon, since if you look carefully, they're roughly proportional to the total number of Pokémon in their respective generations. If anything, there are a lack of 2nd-generation Pokémon in the Black/White sets.

Well if anything, they did come after the HGSS series, so maybe they want to take a break?

 

[NachoMan]

At this point, remaking Hoenn would change very little, if anything. Remakes would have very little to offer except for maybe some tweaked graphics and increased difficulty...but wait! Emerald already gave us both of those things!
A DS remake of Hoenn would most certainly be premature at this point in time. This is why if Game Freak remade it now in Generation 5, they'd probably destroy Hoenn's integrity forever. Heck, Hoenn may never need a remake, ever. Emerald is perfect the way it is.

Well then they should start re-producing Pokemon Ruby and Sapphire Game Boy Andvance cartriges. You can't even find them in stores. Only stores that sell USED copies.

---

Your only argument here is that a remake would mean updated graphics. That's not enough of a reason for Gamefreak to completely remake the Hoenn games just so it would look nicer.

Maybe people wanna battle Steven with a Victini. Or a Piplup.

 

[Zyflair]

Maybe people wanna battle Steven with a Victini. Or a Piplup.

Who wants to battle Steven in the first place? I'm serious; I can't figure out who would want to battle Steven all over again. Besodes, he doesn't even compare to Red.

 

[NachoMan]

Who wants to battle Steven in the first place? I'm serious; I can't figure out who would want to battle Steven all over again. Besodes, he doesn't even compare to Red.

I was just making an example. Maybe people want to travel through Hoenn with with a Zekrom, or Kyurem, or Reshiram in their party? or Black Kyurem or White Kyurem?

 

[Zygarde]

/\ I'm all for the replay factor. But I do agree that remakes wouldn't add that much... Just look at HGSS. Personally, I was looking forward to the games, but, for some reason, they disapointed me. I realized that what I really wanted was a new Johto game. A game that would tell the story of a complete Johto, with high leveled Gym rosters and its own Pokémon League (yes Kanto, I'm blaming you). But that isn't what a 'remake' stands for.

So, I'm all in for a new Hoenn game. But just not R/S/E. I have these already.

 

[NachoMan]

So, I'm all in for a new Hoenn game. But just not R/S/E. I have these already.

Not everyone does. You can barely find them in stores now. Only stores like Gamestop would have them used. Plus, many people don't own DS lites most people only have either Nintnedo DSi, DSi XL, or Nintendo 3DS. So if I wanted to play through Hoenn right now, that would mean tracking a used copy down at Gamestop or some other store that sells used games. While if someone wanted to play through Johto, could just to store like Target, or Best Buy and pick up a copy.

 

[DNA]

Not everyone does. You can barely find them in stores now. Only stores like Gamestop would have them used. Plus, many people don't own DS lites most people only have either Nintnedo DSi, DSi XL, or Nintendo 3DS. So if I wanted to play through Hoenn right now, that would mean tracking a used copy down at Gamestop or some other store that sells used games. While if someone wanted to play through Johto, could just to store like Target, or Best Buy and pick up a copy.

It must suck to be them, then. Besides, I don't think Nintendo let that stop them before - when HGSS came out, DSi systems were all the rage, and guess what still existed that was around in DPPt? It was Pal Park, which required the GBA slot to use - that a DSi lacked. I suppose they could have thought of a different way to transfer, but why bother? It worked for DPPt just fine; if it isn't broken, don't fix it.

More to the point, your arguments about why RS remakes should be made are really just stating that people don't have GBA slots anymore or they want to play through Hoenn with newer Pokemon. That does not justify making a remake, and Nintendo knows it. They will not make it if there isn't enough new stuff to put into it, because it won't sell.

Indeed, I don't think you've given a single good reason about why there should be RS remakes - just a bunch of flippy ones that wouldn't really add much to RS to begin with. You're addressing the wrong issue; it's not whether or not members of the fanbase haven't had a chance to play the game (because most of them have, and the VG section of Pokemon is primarily geared towards the older players who have been with them since Day 1, and HGSS is proof of that), but rather, it's whether or not this new game will sell - and that is the most important bit. If there is nothing new, it will not sell well, and there will not be that large of a profit. That's what you can boil it all down to.

...This topic has been so derailed by now that we're going to need a crane to fix it again...