Is P!P Going to Break Sableye?

Vulpix Yolk said:
Thanks James, I wanted to see the numbers, far too lazy to do that myself. I think that everyone can agree that donks are no fun, the card should be broke, not because it is unstoppable, but because donks are dumb and ruin the game. If you think about the numbers though, play at a 9 round tournament, you would only be going 7-2/6-3, at Nats that barely tops.
Click to expand...

I guess there are a lot of games that you considered "ruined". seriously there a lot of games where you can win turn 1-3. not just pokemon. DONKS HAPPEN. get used to it. or don't play. not trying to sound like some brutal jerk, but seriously. Not every game ever played has prolonged past 1-3 turns. and i mean in a lot of games. not even card games. When you agree to play a game. your agreeing to have a result, unless that game is endless.

NOTE: i am not a supporter of turn-1 sabledonk and the new trainer rule. i am a person though that excepts donk's as apart of the game.
 
^ya...i think he means if the deck is meant to do that. like sabledonk, shuppet donk, uxie donk yada yada. and yes it does ruin it. you lose without even getting to go...what is the fun in that?
 
Ok wait, let me rephrase that. Yes donks are part of the game, but when it gets to a point where you are winning or lose in one game more than once in it tournament, it is a little much. POP could be trying to make it harder to win T1, not easy, printing card like Seeker, are overall making the games less enjoyable. More than 1 Donk per person a tourney shows an unhealthy format. There I think that is better.
 
I guess there are a lot of games that you considered "ruined". seriously there a lot of games where you can win turn 1-3. not just pokemon. DONKS HAPPEN. get used to it.
Click to expand...
I'm not against donks.
I'm against decks that are built for the sole purpose of donking and not much else.

I mean if a deck has the possibility to donk but it's not the main objective (e.g. Kingdra and even Machamp), then fine, I don't have a problem. However building a deck around donking is an overcentralization.
 
catutie said:
^ya...i think he means if the deck is meant to do that. like sabledonk, shuppet donk, uxie donk yada yada. and yes it does ruin it. you lose without even getting to go...what is the fun in that?
Click to expand...

Vulpix Yolk said:
Ok wait, let me rephrase that. Yes donks are part of the game, but when it gets to a point where you are winning or lose in one game more than once in it tournament, it is a little much. POP could be trying to make it harder to win T1, not easy, printing card like Seeker, are overall making the games less enjoyable. More than 1 Donk per person a tourney shows an unhealthy format. There I think that is better.
Click to expand...

DNA said:
I guess there are a lot of games that you considered "ruined". seriously there a lot of games where you can win turn 1-3. not just pokemon. DONKS HAPPEN. get used to it.
Click to expand...
I'm not against donks.
I'm against decks that are built for the sole purpose of donking and not much else.

I mean if a deck has the possibility to donk but it's not the main objective (e.g. Kingdra and even Machamp), then fine, I don't have a problem. However building a deck around donking is an overcentralization.
Click to expand...

ok, guys. let me clarify. I AM 100% AGAINST TRAINERS ON FIRST TURN AND SABLEDONK WITH THE NEW RULES. But i am saying that donks are fair. because we agreed to play a game. thus we are agreeing to the terms and agreements on what can happen when we play.

but again. i have been complaining about sabledonk. because it's a deck that makes a meta game come down to a coin flip....not even a donk really....a coin flip auto-win
 
^I agree completely with the above statements.
 
So one of my friends who built SableDonk was testing the deck after the Pre-Release for BW. He literally was 2 prizes away from winning while his opponent never drew a single prize card at all and I was like, okay something isn't right about this.

When he was playing Reshiram/Emboar on the other hand it wasn't nearly as bad but it's more fun to play than SableDonk I can garauntee you that right now. BlastiGatr can beat it with ease which is one of the reasons why I'm rebuilding it with Sawk to counter Umbreon UD.
 
Card Slinger J said:
So one of my friends who built SableDonk was testing the deck after the Pre-Release for BW. He literally was 2 prizes away from winning while his opponent never drew a single prize card at all and I was like, okay something isn't right about this.

When he was playing Reshiram/Emboar on the other hand it wasn't nearly as bad but it's more fun to play than SableDonk I can garauntee you that right now. BlastiGatr can beat it with ease which is one of the reasons why I'm rebuilding it with Sawk to counter Umbreon UD.
Click to expand...

Have you seen J-Wittz play through of sabledonk? he was able to KO 3 80hp basics in 1 turn.
 
I switched all my smeargle/sableye/jirachi starters out for four spiritomb. Upped the supporter count and slightly lowered the trainers. Took out most rare candy and added more stage 1's.

This is how I will counter donk decks. If most of the pokemon community uses tomb's as their starters then all the sableye decks will have a very hard time. Yes they will still win some of the games but not consistently enough to warrant play at major tournaments.

Then in four months when sableye and BTS are gone (yes I say BTS as well because if you go first and you have BTS you can donk most decks anyway), we can get back to playing different starters.

It's not the best but it works. The only thing I don't like is if you get your only pokemon knocked out you should at least be able to have your turn to get more out there. I see too many people play this for the first time and are immediately turned off when their theme deck gets donked first turn.
 
^Agreed. I already ran spiritomb in every evolution deck I build to counter SP. So the fact that it also counters Sabeleye is a bonus.

See what I think they should have done is allow player 1 to playsupporters on the first turn, but not trainers. That way player 1 doesn't get completely because they can't get another basic out. But it would keep them from being able to consistently donk.
 
@Gliscor, I think the flame war happened already.
With everyone playing donk or anti donk, Magnerock with machamp and spiritomb as the starter will win. Sableye is a broken card. Even if there are ways to beat it. It's like how in the videogame some pokémon go to the übers class, because it makes people have to run a certain counter, or lose. Against sabledonk, you need to run one of 4 counters.. Spiritomb, your own sableye which will make it 50/50, run a ton of high HP pokemon, or have 3 SP pokemon start with at least one power spray. The last 2 can be combined and might be the best way. People will run 3-1 lines of their lv X instead of 2-2..
 
SPIRE_FAN said:
Have you seen J-Wittz play through of sabledonk? he was able to KO 3 80hp basics in 1 turn.
Click to expand...

Yeah I've seen it, though I think it's crazy that it can still win If it doesn't get the Overeager start by going first or second. It just needs to draw with Uxie using Set Up and play out their Trainers unless the opponent double Spiritombs going 1st or 2nd to get around Regice LA and shutdown half the deck itself.

Running your own Sableye to counter Sableye is pointless cause it will just be a matter of a coin flip, If they win the flip and you don't have 2 benched Spiritomb or 1 of it Active and the other on the bench you lose. If you run a full Spiritomb line you have a good chance against SableDonk but only If you get 2 out at once at the start of the game.

Those odds could be around 40% but then again the odds of getting 2 Spiritomb starts just to counter against SableDonk's start with Sableye and Regice is very slim. In the end it's the luck of the draw but either way you look at it it's very unbalanced. 90% of SableDonk relies solely on Trainer - Items, and getting that Keystone Seal lock with Spiritomb is very crucial to shutting down the deck.
 
http://pokegym.net/forums/showthread.php?t=145834

Hope for HG/SS-on?

Get your donks out at BR, guys, before they get rid of everything you love. :D

dmaster out.
 
Guys, remember what this thread is. This thread is to discuss Sableye, not decks in an HGSS-on format.
 
They're moving to HGSS-on, I'm 99% sure. They wouldn't announce that if they weren't nearly sure they were going to, and it's a good idea anyways.
I'm not worried at all.
COME AT ME SABLEYE.
 
^^I like how you posted that right after gliscor said not to.. :p

but anyways, I think that this whole "sableye breaks the format" thing is being overhyped. double spiritomb (which really isnt that hard to do now that we can play supporters/trainers on the first turn) and vileplume shut the entire deck down, then if you can keep the trainer lock going after t2-3 they lose. thats all there is to it.

IMO sabldonk decks will fall to any form of consistent trainer lock.
 
Agreed with ProfessorJ. A good trainer lock tech shuts down the Sabledonk idea. But that also means that everyone will be playing with Spiritomb and 2 lines of Vileplume, so that means that trainer lock will be everywhere, just to make Sabledonk useless. IMO, that's breaking the format: you're almost obligated to add those things if you want to survive in a tournament.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top