Finished Mafia LI: Senate Subterfuge~Game Over!

[Celever]

I'm going to even the votes, as it feels wrong to me that bbninjas is the lead lynch for today.

##VOTE: PMJ

 

[PMJ]

GM Drac did (see: "the role is not really his"). Each of us still asserted that we think Lele should definitely be lynched today. So why is Cel and I an apparent scumbuddy, and not the rest of them?

I forgot to mention drac but he's notoriously difficult to read so I don't think I'd have any strong opinions on him one way or the other.

 

[PMJ]

I'm going to even the votes, as it feels wrong to me that bbninjas is the lead lynch for today.

##VOTE: PMJ

Nice panic vote! It won't save him though, ties are irrelevant in this setup.

 

[bbninjas]

Yog's recent posts are reading rather organic to me - you can sorta see where they are up to in the thread thus far, based on what they're commenting on - and their thought process makes sense up to that point (although the reasoning is a bit flawed). So, town-lean here similar to morda.

PMJ and bb stop talking to each other- everyone has enough posts from you to decide who they think is right. If not, they will ask or vote. Until that happens, you got no reason to keep discussing unless you are scum.

I would just like to point out that I've made like only 2 (maybe 3?) posts responding to PMJ's case on me, whereas the others involved me asking PMJ questions (and follow-up questions), looking for new information I think, to help me make a read on PMJ.

Which is, I think, in reference to other mafian rolenames. If not, the whole "trapped in the basement" is flavour enough to support this theory.

This is actually makes a lot a sense! I didn't see that direct reference to "not being able to find" Caeser and Crassus, who were two of the main three who formed the Triumvirate, is rather indicative. If the next scum to flip has a scumchat-ability, then this theory would be pretty much confirmed - as Lele's flip does not feature such an Ability.

I assume you don't want to get lynched, so give us an alternative. It's actually very telling that you haven't managed to do this yet.
And another thing about the reads list –– three of the players you listed not under vague/wishy-washy reads, you've read as neutral. Which is completely ridiculous. Neutral is the very vaguest and very wishy-washiest of reads.

Emphasis mine, not really. I wasn't been around for earlier Day 3, and I'm still trying to navigate through my general uncertainty on most people (that's why I did a full reads list - writing out my thoughts helps organise them). I'm also not going to push a case out of thin air, so that's why I haven't given an alternative yet - I'm still in the read-gathering phase.

Neutral, by the way, simply means that there is not enough indicative evidence for me to make a particularly informed read on them. Do you have neutral reads on any of the more vocal players? I'm pretty sure you agreed earlier that there was plenty of WIFOM about, yet if you have no neutral reads, then you would have to be comfortable and somewhat confident on your lean reads?

Refers to the town as a separate entity; i.e., one he isn't a part of.

FoS Jabber for this grammatical nitpickery since it's pretty unhelpful/misleading, trying to indicate someone is scummy due to how they use they word "town" in relation to themself is bit ridiculous - especially for Jabber.

but bb actually did not have his vote down at the end of the Day.

How this indicative? I had forgotten that I hadn't put my vote back on.

I'm still baffled to see how people still think that we could do anything else but lynch a mod-confirmed scum. The only other reason is that we (somehow) found out about dos' role in the same time and the debate would be who is a bigger threat.

No one has and no one still is suggesting that Lele shouldn't have been lynched. That needs to be distinguished from people not being confident on the flip.

Ah right, I had forgotten you had chickenpox. I'm glad you could get back and make some nice contributions though.

FoS for this, I don't like the idea of anyone telling people to not post.

FoS on this FoS. That's not what scattered was saying at all - he was saying that back-and-forth, stagnant discussion between you and me is unproductive, distracting, deterring [players from posting - hence so many players saying they are having difficulty following/catching-up]. It's anti-town. scattered uses an argument that is not uncommon, so I think you're dumbtelling a bit. Plus, it's been said in a few different ways this day phase already. What IS common is to turn the tables on whoever might use this argument, and say that they are trying to kill discussion, and that's nothing more than avoiding the point.

 

[PMJ]

FoS on this FoS. That's not what scattered was saying at all - he was saying that back-and-forth, stagnant discussion between you and me is unproductive, distracting, deterring [players from posting - hence so many players saying they are having difficulty following/catching-up]. It's anti-town. scattered uses an argument that is not uncommon, so I think you're dumbtelling a bit. Plus, it's been said in a few different ways this day phase already. What IS common is to turn the tables on whoever might use this argument, and say that they are trying to kill discussion, and that's nothing more than avoiding the point.

I would FoS your FoS on my FoS if I wasn't already convinced you were scum.

First of all, in regards to "so many players" having trouble following along, only three people fit this: Gekki, Samwise, and Yog. The former two only posted that after I first posted my case on you, not after you and Celever started responding to me, so that doesn't really support your argument. Yog I'll give you, but he's been making an effort to contribute with his thoughts despite saying that, so this is overall a very weak argument.

Second, you can't use sm's quote to accuse me of dumbtelling and then use it to paint yourself in a town light in literally the same exact post. Your reasoning was that you've been trying to gather information on me, but wait. I thought the two of us responding to each other was unproductive, distracting, and deterring players from posting? Why are you allowed to respond to me, but I'm not allowed to respond to you? I'm supposed to let you fill the thread with blatant untruths under the guise of information gathering? Nice try.

Still working on that reads list, but I got alerted so I came to check it out.

 

[bbninjas]

I've been thinking hard about whether or not this PMJ / me thing is town-town or scum-town since Cel mentioned that, as it would really inform my read. I think it is scum-town, and this why:

When Player A posts a case on someone else, Player A will normally always gather suspicion. This could be a few reasons; leading, flawed logic, poor evidence, inconsistencies (or perceived inconsistencies), vague or odd statements, etc. There's some psychological stuff in the vein of reverse psychologically that plays in as well. You'd see this even more prominently when a person correctly pushes onto a mafian, as the mafia buddies will try and discredit the case.​

Now, note how quickly and eagerly the town jumped onto my lynch after PMJ posted his case. However, when some people started to suspect PMJ later in this day, the town was (and still is) very much unresponsive and apathetic! Why is there such a disparity in the response? This disparity would make sense if PMJ is mafian - if PMJ's wagon is pushed, it would be between me and him. All his buddies would have to is keep their focus on me - because they don't have defend suspicions against PMJ, but rather shown that I am scummier. To create that illusion, they can utilise the momentum on my lynch, ignore the suspicions on PMJ and continue to show their support. If this was town-town, there should be more of a debate over who (if anyone) is mafian - since the scum aren't trying to prevent one player from being lynched over the other and so they will take sides. Scum-scum should theoretically see the same trend as town-town.

There's another thing that isn't quite adding up:

PMJ has been vocal about me being the one player who should be lynched today. Yet, he's admitted that he hasn't taken a proper look anyone else - and is instead just looking at my posts, reading them as scummy and leaving it at that. But doesn't that mean that PMJ has no particular reference point, no one to compare 'scumminess'? So how could he say that I'm the one who should be lynched today, over anyone else?

##VOTE: PMJ

tl;dr
-- the town has been eager about my lynch, but apathetic towards suspecting PMJ. I explain in my paragraph why I think this indicates a scum-town interaction, as oppose to a town-town.
-- PMJ says that I am the person to lynch today. But he doesn't have any frame reference for that, so how could he say that I should be lynched over someone else?

 

[bbninjas]

PMJ, the point is that scattered claimed you and I were making back-and-forth, distracting, unhelpful posts.

You then responded to scattered's claim by saying "you're telling me not to post". I am FoSing this response of yours, because you are avoiding the point - which was obvious enough. I'm not making any implications about me in this situation, or whether or not I think you were making back-and-forth posts.

 

[Luispipe8]

So the mafia are the Triumvirate, I think it's safe to assume this means there are three of them. Town are Loyalists. There was also Double-o-Squirtle, aligned with himself. I think with the numbers we have (20 at game-start), 3+1+16 is very unbalanced in town's favour. I expect there are additional independent factions to be on the alert for.

And then apart from Triumvirate & Loyalists, players are also divided into Populares & Optimates. e.g. Squirtles goal as an Optimate was to eliminate all the Populares. There are eight of these as stated by his role. So I assume 8 and 12 unless there's a third part to this too. I don't know if that's worth chasing up. It would be important if you had a role like Squirtle's, but it seems inconsequential to me so far.

Lastly, I would like to clear up this Basement thing since it's been mentioned that there is a possibility that the rest of the Triumvirate did not actually know Lele was one of theirs. And that becomes quite an important detail if the lynch of BB is based on his defense / avoidance of Lele. Sounds to me like the basement included three players total. And the two that are not Lele are confirmed as town to each other now. This is something that *could* be worth bringing to light *maybe*. We could have a pair of confirmed town, and we could get the rules of the Basement. And no-one can fake claim here so long as both live, as if one comes forward they can quickly be caught out. Maybe this explains the buddy-buddy nature of BB & Celever?

Obviously there are also risks involved as like Luxinity, they will quickly become targets by night for one. But we will have night targets regardless. At least if one of these came forward (not both), we can play find the lady with the Mafia wanting to target them, and any Doctor among us being able to bluff some protection this night or the next. We could also follow their lead if they are obstinently against one of our current options. Since they are town for sure, they should act with virtue, and virtue is truly the only good (to borrow a Roman-themed stoic paradox). This is an advantage we can leverage in interests of the town. I think one (not both), should come forward and let us know they were part of this basement without fully claiming the rest of their role. Let us know how the basement worked exactly, and get us a bit closer to a true understanding of what goes on at night.

About the Triumvirate... not /necessarily/. It could also very well be a group of X people where 3 of them have the more central roles/flavor/etc. A multi-faction game looks a bit too complicated and last time that happend it had to be in an outside platform.

And nice point on the basement info. If needed be, we could use of that.

No one has and no one still is suggesting that Lele shouldn't have been lynched. That needs to be distinguished from people not being confident on the flip.

Well, that was a response to Cel's post:

I never said there was. I said there were better options: not that he's a bad one.

Whatever "better options" he thought about were, presumably, better than lynching scum. Get outta here :v

the town has been eager about my lynch, but apathetic towards suspecting PMJ. I explain in my paragraph why I think this indicates a scum-town interaction, as oppose to a town-town.

To be fair, I'm not really set on either of you. I can almost assure /one/ of you scum, tho... and I also have a weird feeling abour Celever considering all I said in my last post. I mean, all this also started as a Celever vs PMJ after all.

Of course we're meant to get scum, but if we lynch any of those 3 and, sadly, kill a townie, we /do/ get relevant information about interactions.

So, for now, I'm going to vote ##VOTE: bbninjas. I'm literally choosing one of you randomly and hope tomorrow we can work from that info, and this applies for the other 2 as well: if he's scum, of course we make progress; if town, we get good info.

(Also, I'm not sure if I'll be back before dusk, so I might as well place my vote)

 

[PMJ]

1. You don't need a frame of reference to call out scummy behavior. You're implying I can't make a read on you because I also haven't posted my reads on everyone else, which is stupid.

2. "the town has been eager about my lynch" - This is untrue, Jabber's vote has been on you all day and Yog only recently cast a vote for you. Everyone else has actually been coming to your defense. Sorry your argument was bullshit.

3. "but apathetic towards suspecting PMJ" - Probably because there is no reason to lynch me. It's also not accurate to say that the town is apathetic towards lynching me because no one has said anything to the effect of "hey we probably shouldn't lynch pmj" or suggested it's a bad idea. In fact, it's the opposite, because both scattered and mord tried casting doubt on my case, Samwise actually cast a vote for me, and Celever has been in your corner all day long.

You can't make any judgments about the people who haven't posted because they haven't posted.

The day is running out and Samwise's uninformed double vote is the only reason you and Celever are voting for me because it's the only chance in hell you have of not dying today. It's a painfully obvious attempt by scum to stay off the chopping block.

@Acetrainer_Samwise you need to get in here and change your vote. With a large chunk of the town missing, you can't just throw around a double vote carelessly. Look how easily scum has manipulated it.

 

[Jabberwock]

Nah. It's not helping at all. But i do it anyway. Because why not.
Also counting =/= reading everything.

Nah. I didn't and don't have time to read into things. The only thing i kinda catched is that it moved over to a case on you and Celever?
Maybe? Who knows.

We gotta look into this guy eventually. >.>

Emphasis mine, not really. I wasn't been around for earlier Day 3, and I'm still trying to navigate through my general uncertainty on most people (that's why I did a full reads list - writing out my thoughts helps organise them). I'm also not going to push a case out of thin air, so that's why I haven't given an alternative yet - I'm still in the read-gathering phase.

Most of the stuff I was gonna say to this is irrelevant now you've placed a vote. What's left is that we're always in "the read-gathering phase", and I would say that by Day 3, even if you've been relatively out of it, you should be able to place a vote.

Neutral, by the way, simply means that there is not enough indicative evidence for me to make a particularly informed read on them. Do you have neutral reads on any of the more vocal players? I'm pretty sure you agreed earlier that there was plenty of WIFOM about, yet if you have no neutral reads, then you would have to be comfortable and somewhat confident on your lean reads?

I think I just misread how you were formatting your reads list; Cel commented on that earlier. My issue was that you had divided it up into what I thought were "vague reads" and "not vague reads", and then put a bunch of neutral reads under "not vague".

FoS Jabber for this grammatical nitpickery since it's pretty unhelpful/misleading, trying to indicate someone is scummy due to how they use they word "town" in relation to themself is bit ridiculous - especially for Jabber.

Nah, that's a well-known scumslip, and slips are part of the game. Using "the town" instead of "we" shows you're subconsciously putting yourself outside of it. It's definitely not enough to convict him on its own, but worth noting.

How this indicative? I had forgotten that I hadn't put my vote back on.

Why was your vote taken off Lele in the first place?

 

[PMJ]

Reads

@mordacazir - quaking made no useful posts. Since subbing in, his posts haven't been super helpful. He started the end-of-day wagon on T_E, employed the same "before anyone questions this scummy behavior, here's my excuse" tactic that bb did (which is notable because he later said in this post that only scum should worry about fitting in), doubted Tapu Lele's flip until the very end and still tried making the argument that it could have been faked due to the nature of the game despite the flip coming from the hosts. scummy

@Professor_jplap - Lots of posts but none of them are useful. dos pressured him once and he said that gek reeked of scum but never explained why he thought that way. At worst it was just a sheep post. Needs to post more to allow for a stronger read. neutral leaning scummy

@scattered mind - He was asking questions during day one. Day two his posts were laser focused on Tapu Lele and pointing out that he was scum and shouldn't be trusted. He's been engaged during day three for the most part, still continuing to ask questions and aside from a couple instances of not paying attention, hasn't done anything overtly scummy. town

@GekkisaiDaiNi - Posted scummy wifom during day one, backpedaled after scattered called him out, has been absent for most of day two and all of day three. Needs to post more, etc. scummy

@Jadethepokemontrainer - He's in this game?

@GM DracLord - His posts are kind of all over. He's not really scum hunting, but he's participating, unlike jplap whose posts are pure fluff. Aside from jplap early in day one and Tapu Lele during day two, he hasn't posted anything in terms of reads, just player activity. neutral

@Jabberwock - Fairly active participant. Doubted Lele's flip which is really the only thing I can find inherently anti-town about the posts he's made so far. Would like to see a list of his reads because for all his posting, I think the only person he said he had a town read on was scattered mind. neutral leaning town

@Luispipe8 - A lot of his thoughts mirror my own, but there were a couple things that stood out to me, mainly his commenting on T_E's scum hit and his sudden thoughts on the makeup of the scum team. He claims that his vote on bb was random, which is disappointing, but we take those. neutral leaning town

@Celever - WIFOM vote for T_E, tried starting an obviously bogus case on Samwise to try and save bbninjas, defended Tapu Lele, consistently ignores my arguments for why bb is scum and omgus votes me along with bb once Samwise threw his vote on me as a last ditch effort to get me lynched. scum of the earth

@Acetrainer_Samwise - Already explained my thoughts on him but his vote is about to get me killed. Please vote for actual scum. town

@TeamAqua4Life #HEYNICK - Another person I didn't know was actually playing. Been missing for all of day three. Has not posted anything of worth. He mentioned that inactives should be looked at after Lele's lynch, which is ironic because he is now one of them. neutral

@mirdo - He isn't paying attention to the game. He didn't know that dos killed Luxinity, or that dos was saved night 1. He's gone for days at a time and continues posting activity charts despite having it explained why they aren't helpful. He also doesn't care to contribute outside of this as evidenced by his last post. He'd make a good policy lynch. neutral

@Yog - DFL made zero (0) posts. Since subbing in, he's been kinda active, not wasting too much time on Tapu Lele and instead posting thoughts on others. His sudden wall of text about the flavor was kinda out of left field. I'm guessing that whoever was in the basement qt with Tapu Lele is either inactive or barred from saying they're part of it because having two confirmed townies is pretty strong. It could also explain why no one mentioned "hey one of the three of us is scum." town

@OshaCraft360 - zzzzzzz modkill him already please


Just found that where bb or whoever said that there were posts suggesting Jabberwock was scum because of his assertiveness - it was by Tapu Lele. You know your defense is garbage when you have to rely on confirmed scum to help make it.

 

[GM DracLord]

Sorry, got a really pack weekend. It's to digest all those blocks of text bb & PMJ been posting (and I still haven really digest them).

I believe the vote is still tied between bb & PMJ so I wouldn't be voting for either yet since I find you both equally scummy with those post.
Although at least you both are active. At this point I'm game if we decide to lynch others instead of these 2.

For instance the one that I don't trust since Day 1

##VOTE: @Professor_jplap

 

[mirdo]

We gotta look into this guy eventually. >.>

Jup. Not beeing able to read into stuff is very scummy. You are correct. You cracked the code.

@mirdo - He isn't paying attention to the game. He didn't know that dos killed Luxinity, or that dos was saved night 1. He's gone for days at a time and continues posting activity charts despite having it explained why they aren't helpful. He also doesn't care to contribute outside of this as evidenced by his last post. He'd make a good policy lynch.

Lol.
I mean. Mostly it's that i just can't really handle all the shi...stuff i have going on right now. Inside and Outside of PB. Im trying to contribute somewhat.
I do care to contribute. But so far I can't find the time to read through all your guys novells worth of stuff.

And I was aware that DoS was survived D1. But it was early in the morning and I was just not awake enough to connect the dots or look down to read the death message of Lux.

So that's that

Also: @PMJ you say that Celever is very scummy in your last post.

If we not regard you beeing in a tie with BB. Would you suggest Cel beeing a better lynch than bb?

 

[PMJ]

If we not regard you beeing in a tie with BB. Would you suggest Cel beeing a better lynch than bb?

No. bbninjas is the only real lynch candidate today. The only reason I have any votes on me at all is because Samwise's double vote is enabling Celever and bb to put me in the lead. Once he unvotes, bb will have no chance, unless more people vote for bb and put the final nail in this scum's coffin.

Celever is still definitely scum and discussing his lynch without bb clogging up the thread with his lies will be much easier.

 

[mordacazir]

morda - I've been reading morda as quite town since he's been inquisitive and thoughtful, and as a byproduct of that, he seems to be thinking things through and have a clear thought process. Specifically the latter point, I tend to consider a more innocent indicator (since scum thought processes normally aren't that "complete" or "full"), so he's really my only town read. (inno-lean)

Why is your read so different from PMJ’s

Mordacai's contributions on day one are not really inspiring.
Now we can see his vote came at the right time for scum to flip target.

1) Please dont call me mordacai :/.
2) I dont understand this post but it seems to be directed at me.

But I don't think it's productive to pursue either of them right now. A part of me wants to lynch PMJ so that the thread becomes less centralised, because he keeps pushing attention onto bb which is really unproductive and sets the town back massively, even if the guy is mafia.

^^This. Either PMJ or BBninjas has to be lynched today,

@mordacazir - quaking made no useful posts. Since subbing in, his posts haven't been super helpful. He started the end-of-day wagon on T_E, employed the same "before anyone questions this scummy behavior, here's my excuse" tactic that bb did (which is notable because he later said in this post that only scum should worry about fitting in), doubted Tapu Lele's flip until the very end and still tried making the argument that it could have been faked due to the nature of the game despite the flip coming from the hosts. scummy

Same as BB, why is your reas so different from bb?

 

[Scattered mind]

I haven't really looked at Celever's posts, but it's good to hear that he apparently set this in motion. Doesn't mean much because they're both definitely scum.

Remember, PMJ first posted at the end of Day 2 and in that time hasn't "really looked" at my posts, which is worrying as I'm one of the primary contributors to this thread; I'm sure no one would object to top 5. And, when people look through games, they tend to look at the most notable players first, and then get more obscure from there. So if PMJ hasn't "really looked" at the posts of one of the top 5 contributors to the thread, that means he's looked at less than 5 of them total. Which, finally, means this case has been made because PMJ wants bb to be lynched, and not because PMJ thinks bb is mafia: it would be a massive flaw in rationalism to tunnel bb as massively as he is right now without having read the posts of (m)any other people.


@PMJ please post a full reads list of all players in the thread, with reasons given for your stance on each one. This is to ensure that you've actually read this game thread and, on balance, think bb is the best option, as opposed to the only one you've looked at so far.

Lot of assumptions you're making there. bb's extensive post on Lele's flip possibly being fake is what got me looking at him harder. Enough of his posts were questionable to make me believe he was scum. Thus, I pushed his lynch.


Everyone take note of how Celever and bb keep saying the opposite, despite my clarifying it several times already.

You are avoiding the point. The point was that you were tunneling bbninjas, while not paying attention to the other players. If you didn't read Celever's posts, it is safe to assume you did not fully pay attention to the thread, since Celever was a big part of it and the whole debate regarding Lele's reveal. You then say that you preferred looking into bbninjas harder after noticing a scummy post, but looking harder suggests that you looked at other's posts beforehand, and you chose to go after bb after reading them all, which you say you didn't really do that at least with Celever- who, again is a huge part of the lele debate, and what caused bbninjas to react to the idea of lele's reveal being false in the first place.

FoS. I answered this already. This is now the second time that I've seen you making uninformed posts.

What are you talking about? You answered AFTER my post.

Tunneling is not misleading because it, by definition, cannot be. Tunneling happens when one person's lynch is pushed despite their being better cases. Well, there are no other cases, so I guess I'm not tunneling by definition, but I use the term because I will still push this lynch until one of us is dead. It's why I haven't bothered building a case on Celever yet.

1- there are no other cases because you are tunneling bbninjas. There would be at least two cases if you have bothered to look into Celever. And that's just from your point of view.
2- If you die because people preferred lynching you, how would you be able to build a case on Celever? This is the flaw in tunneling- you are preventing yourself and the town from explaining other scummy options that can be used later on before or after you may die. Locking yourself to one player is scummy then, because there is no reason to share thoughts about other scummy options for scum, not for town.

@Celever - WIFOM vote for T_E, tried starting an obviously bogus case on Samwise to try and save bbninjas, defended Tapu Lele, consistently ignores my arguments for why bb is scum and omgus votes me along with bb once Samwise threw his vote on me as a last ditch effort to get me lynched. scum of the earth

Is this something you looked into just after being requested to share a readlist?

 

[Scattered mind]

@Celever - WIFOM vote for T_E, tried starting an obviously bogus case on Samwise to try and save bbninjas, defended Tapu Lele, consistently ignores my arguments for why bb is scum and omgus votes me along with bb once Samwise threw his vote on me as a last ditch effort to get me lynched. scum of the earth

To try and save bbninjas? He voted Ace before you made any case on bbninjas. Also, after his vote you asked him if he thinks bbninjas was innocent and Celever said "not in the least" and that he actually think he is scummy.

 

[PMJ]

That's an outdated read, he said as much himself.

Re dying: I'll have the case posted before day's end. No one will hit majority with this do-nothing town.

Rest latte

 

[PMJ]

Rest later*

 

[Jabberwock]

@mordacazir - quaking made no useful posts. Since subbing in, his posts haven't been super helpful. He started the end-of-day wagon on T_E, employed the same "before anyone questions this scummy behavior, here's my excuse" tactic that bb did (which is notable because he later said in this post that only scum should worry about fitting in), doubted Tapu Lele's flip until the very end and still tried making the argument that it could have been faked due to the nature of the game despite the flip coming from the hosts. scummy

Interesting you say that.

@Jabberwock - Fairly active participant. Doubted Lele's flip which is really the only thing I can find inherently anti-town about the posts he's made so far. Would like to see a list of his reads because for all his posting, I think the only person he said he had a town read on was scattered mind. neutral leaning town

Townreading scattered, Cel, Yog to an extent. Leaning town on you just because I'm leaning scum on bb and I don't see this being orchestrated.

A'ight let's see what claiming actually does in this game. I am in a neighbor chat with mord (and nobody else). Here's a list of all his relevant posts from it:

What up, my dude? Do you have anything good? My ability is pretty trash. (this is quaking's)

Yeah I’m town. And I think you’re town too. Do you have any interesting observations this day (That you’re willing to share)?

Hi. I have strong evedince that BB is scum (because of the no kill), but I’m afraid to claim it and still thinking if I trust you enough.

Nvm if dos claim is true than its not bb

(at this point I told him "Even if I'm scum there's nothing I can do to you if you tell me what you've got.")

Well if dos his claim is true my thing is completely useless. We were just lucky.

(several IRL days pass)

We should use this chat more. What do you think off Samwise and PMJ?

TL;DR, mord was fishing hard, gave up for a while, then got reminded to do so by his scumchat. He continually asked for reads and whatnot without offering any of his own. He's one of my top scumreads atm, and given bb's defense of him it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if they were buddies.