Discussion Neglected Pokémon in the TCG

[SupremeLeaderQuagsire]

Larvitar and Pupitar appear in XY10 as well, and Deerling is in the M-Audino deck

Seel and Dewgong make their first debut since 2008. So happy they brought these two back, I love their little faces! This set may be called "Awakening of the Neglected Pokemon!" Now we just need them in Smash, Pokken, etc.

 

[Valon]

Seel and Dewgong make their first debut since 2008. So happy they brought these two back, I love their little faces! This set may be called "Awakening of the Neglected Pokemon!" Now we just need them in Smash, Pokken, etc.

Yeah, Dewgong is always overshadowed by lapras or walrein which is sad.
I would have loved Dewgong as the supporter poke instead of lapras in pokken tournament. Or at least one of the pokemon swimming that water field.

And they should have gave Dewgong the safeguard ability to give it some potential use. No one even gives it a second glance on the set review because it's just a junky filler card.

 

[ProcInc]

Does anyone consider a Pokemon "only" represented as an EX consistently to be 'neglected'?

Charizard has, like, 8 EXs in the last year but no stage 2 since Legendary treasures for instance. Ditto a lot of legendary Pokemon.

 

[bbninjas]

Charizard actually just got a Stage 2 in Generations, however I do see what you mean. Venusaur is one of those, who seems to only ever be an EX and never a Stage 2, since Dark Explorers.

 

[SupremeLeaderQuagsire]

Does anyone consider a Pokemon "only" represented as an EX consistently to be 'neglected?

I would probably not consider that Pokemon to be neglected, but its evolutions if it has any. So. before Generations, I would probably consider Charmander and Charmeleon neglected and overshadowed by their final evolution.

 

[crystal_pidgeot]

The final forms are all that matter. No one is playing Charmander or Charmeleon just so they can use them. They use them because they have to. People would much rather have 3 to 4 of a EX and not use 6 to 8 deck spots to get it out. I would much rather have Pidgeot EX rather than babysit a bunch of Pidgey and Pidgeotto and hope they don't get snipped out of the game trying to get out a stage 2.

So I wont say those Pokemon are neglected because Charizard has had all the cards, most being EX because the developers know how hard it is to get a stage 2 out. I'm expecting another 6 charizard cards before I see Pidgeot EX.

 

[SupremeLeaderQuagsire]

The final forms are all that matter. No one is playing Charmander or Charmeleon just so they can use them. They use them because they have to. People would much rather have 3 to 4 of a EX and not use 6 to 8 deck spots to get it out. I would much rather have Pidgeot EX rather than babysit a bunch of Pidgey and Pidgeotto and hope they don't get snipped out of the game trying to get out a stage 2.

So I wont say those Pokemon are neglected because Charizard has had all the cards, most being EX because the developers know how hard it is to get a stage 2 out. I'm expecting another 6 charizard cards before I see Pidgeot EX.

We aren't talking from a competitive standpoint, we're talking about how we wish these Pokemon weren't so neglected. Yeah, it would be nice to have a competitive version of these cards, but if it has been a super long time, I just want to see that Pokemon again. I was so exited Seel and Dewgong were in Awakening of the Neglec- I mean Psychic Kings, even though they aren't playable. Though I will have to say. A decent M Pidgeot FA would go for a lot!

 

[crystal_pidgeot]

We aren't talking from a competitive standpoint, we're talking about how we wish these Pokemon weren't so neglected. Yeah, it would be nice to have a competitive version of these cards, but if it has been a super long time, I just want to see that Pokemon again. I was so exited Seel and Dewgong were in Awakening of the Neglec- I mean Psychic Kings, even though they aren't playable. Though I will have to say. A decent M Pidgeot FA would go for a lot!

I guess that makes sense but I want them to be competitive because a lot of players want to use their favorite Pokemon. It makes no sense to print a Dewgong with one attack and its water gun for 20. It getting a EX (competitive or not) would do a lot for its popularity because people will notice it and not throw it to the side, which happens to most cards in a set. I'm glad to see it has a card coming out but if the card is complete garbage, its almost like it wasn't even printed.

I hope it a m Pidgeot EX full art goes for a lot. It would be as pretty looking as the Ho-Oh EX full art.

 

[SupremeLeaderQuagsire]

I guess that makes sense but I want them to be competitive because a lot of players want to use their favorite Pokemon. It makes no sense to print a Dewgong with one attack and its water gun for 20. It getting a EX (competitive or not) would do a lot for its popularity because people will notice it and not throw it to the side, which happens to most cards in a set. I'm glad to see it has a card coming out but if the card is complete garbage, its almost like it wasn't even printed.

I hope it a m Pidgeot EX full art goes for a lot. It would be as pretty looking as the Ho-Oh EX full art.

I get your point. It is better then nothing, but they will be overshadowed by almost every other card in that set. Quick question, any sorta neglected Pokemon you like to see get a new card. (Other than Pidgeot, I know you want that. )

For M Pidgeot EX FA I would think more of a windy backround with some blue, light blue, purple, and a little yellow as opposed to Ho-Oh's "Jesus-like" pose and style. Kinda like Shaymin EX FA.

 

[Tri2attack]

Am I the only one who wants a Cradily card again. Its one of my favorite pokemon and I believe it gets way overshadowed by other fossil pokemon

 

[SkyeVictini]

As a collector wanting to get cards of every Pokemon, I need to see Baby Pokemon again, especially Azurill, Bonsly and Mantyke! And maybe updated Fairy-type Cleffa and Igglybuff?

Also, I would love to see Cranidos and Shieldon again.

 

[crystal_pidgeot]

I get your point. It is better then nothing, but they will be overshadowed by almost every other card in that set. Quick question, any sorta neglected Pokemon you like to see get a new card. (Other than Pidgeot, I know you want that. )

For M Pidgeot EX FA I would think more of a windy backround with some blue, light blue, purple, and a little yellow as opposed to Ho-Oh's "Jesus-like" pose and style. Kinda like Shaymin EX FA.

Zangoose

 

[ProcInc]

Like in the video game, there will always be pokemon that will not be considered playable but are an essential part of a completed pokedex.

A fairly large % if not the majority of tcgers have no interest at all in competitive play, they simply want to collect and trade their favourite Pokemon.

Some Pokemon including my favs like the earlier mentioned Nidoking will never be competitive but will always look pretty in a folder.

I like Cradily (despite choosing Anorith), it is sad Cradily got a BW print (Boundaries Crossed I think?) but Anorith/Armaldo are left behind.

I would think Baby Pokemon would at least get prints in "Radiant Collections" or "Pokekyun" since those tend to focus on cutesy species and artwork and are virtually never (save for RC24 Mew) considered for competitive play.

 

[Purrloin]

Does anyone consider a Pokemon "only" represented as an EX consistently to be 'neglected'?

Charizard has, like, 8 EXs in the last year but no stage 2 since Legendary treasures for instance. Ditto a lot of legendary Pokemon.

I get what you mean. It's nice having "normal" cards of Pokemon too. In the list I maintain (in sig) I do count EX prints as qualifying for a recent print; so I technically don't consider Venusaur to be neglected, for instance, despite it not having a normal card since 2012.

But yeah, it'd be nice if EX-ized Pokemon got normal cards in the same set. Or... alternatively, if they'd start printing EX cards of rarely seen Pokemon instead of rehashing the same handful set after set.

I guess that makes sense but I want them to be competitive because a lot of players want to use their favorite Pokemon. It makes no sense to print a Dewgong with one attack and its water gun for 20. It getting a EX (competitive or not) would do a lot for its popularity because people will notice it and not throw it to the side, which happens to most cards in a set. I'm glad to see it has a card coming out but if the card is complete garbage, its almost like it wasn't even printed.

This topic is mainly from a collector standpoint. While it'd be nice to have competitively viable cards for every Pokemon, it just isn't going to happen.

Take M-Pidgeot-EX, for instance, which you are looking forward to getting at some point. If it is an awful card, are you going to stay "its almost like it wasn't even printed"? Hmm, I'd think that you'd be happy either way. Though it being useful is a plus, the fact it finally has a card at all is enough of a reward.

 

[crystal_pidgeot]

Take M-Pidgeot-EX, for instance, which you are looking forward to getting at some point. If it is an awful card, are you going to stay "its almost like it wasn't even printed"? Hmm, I'd think that you'd be happy either way. Though it being useful is a plus, the fact it finally has a card at all is enough of an reward.

Its different for a EX Pokemon versus some normal card. IMO, all EX Pokemon are viable... In some kind of way. They have the stats to either be backup attackers or their own deck. Even if m Pidgeot EX sucks, it will be good enough unless it has a attack for 1 that deal 10 damage for no added effect. The difference here is all the EX Pokemon can serve some purpose. Emolga EX can accelerate energy and can KO lightning weak Pokemon while Skarmory can take KOs on weaken Pokemon in the right case.

With most of the stage 1 and 2 Pokemon, they can't do anything. Take a look at Swanna from Breakpoint;

Swanna – Water – HP80
Stage 1 – Evolves from Ducklett

[C] Wing Attack: 20 damage.

[C][C][C] Brave Bird: 80 damage. This Pokemon does 20 damage to itself.

Weakness: Lightning (x2)
Resistance: Fighting (-20)
Retreat: 0

There is almost no reason to ever use this Pokemon so its better off not existing at all where as each m/EX can do something.

 

[Purrloin]

Its different for a EX Pokemon versus some normal card. IMO, all EX Pokemon are viable... In some kind of way. They have the stats to either be backup attackers or their own deck. Even if m Pidgeot EX sucks, it will be good enough unless it has a attack for 1 that deal 10 damage for no added effect. The difference here is all the EX Pokemon can serve some purpose. Emolga EX can accelerate energy and can KO lightning weak Pokemon while Skarmory can take KOs on weaken Pokemon in the right case.

With most of the stage 1 and 2 Pokemon, they can't do anything. Take a look at Swanna from Breakpoint;

Swanna – Water – HP80
Stage 1 – Evolves from Ducklett

[C] Wing Attack: 20 damage.

[C][C][C] Brave Bird: 80 damage. This Pokemon does 20 damage to itself.

Weakness: Lightning (x2)
Resistance: Fighting (-20)
Retreat: 0

There is almost no reason to ever use this Pokemon so its better off not existing at all where as each m/EX can do something.

I too wish there were less filler cards in each set. I sometimes think TPC is afraid that having too many viable cards will lead to an unbalanced game, so they take the easy way out and make just a handful of viable cards so it's easier to manage.

TPC also seems to focus on collectability just as much as competitive play -- the recent Mythical mini set, for example, is largely useless, but they are geared more towards people who collect. It'd be great if they were viable as well, but for me and others like me, just having them in shiny full-art cards is awesome enough.

So I disagree that a competitively useless card is better off not existing, because lots of collectors would still want them. If I were a Swanna fan, I'd be elated to have the new card you mentioned, despite it being useless competitively. A more personal example would be Sawsbuck; I'd really love to add a new one to my collection, and when one eventually is printed, I also wholly expect it to suck competitively. But I still want it a lot.

 

[crystal_pidgeot]

I too wish there were less filler cards in each set. I sometimes think TPC is afraid that having too many viable cards will lead to an unbalanced game, so they take the easy way out and make just a handful of viable cards so it's easier to manage.

TPC also seems to focus on collectability just as much as competitive play -- the recent Mythical mini set, for example, is largely useless, but they are geared more towards people who collect. It'd be great if they were viable as well, but for me and others like me, just having them in shiny full-art cards is awesome enough.

So I disagree that a competitively useless card is better off not existing, because lots of collectors would still want them. If I were a Swanna fan, I'd be elated to have the new card you mentioned, despite it being useless competitively. A more personal example would be Sawsbuck; I'd really love to add a new one to my collection, and when one eventually is printed, I also wholly expect it to suck competitively. But I still want it a lot.

I guess we are different then. I too am glad to have my favorites printed but it pains me when I can't play them. Collection is nice, I have plenty of that but I want to be able to do well at tournaments with the Pokemon I love, which I'm sure a lot of other people want to do as well.

 

[ProcInc]

In terms of high-tier competition, very few people are able to play with their favourite Pokemon and get very far.

Night March is the dominant deck for instance and I doubt Joltik, Pumpkaboo and Lampent are fan favs.

It's not that TPC is afraid of having viable cards or focuses on collection. It's that it is a game for all ages, competition levels and budgets. As well as balanced between play and collection.

For a kid who gets one booster a week and plays against other kids, Swanna would do just fine against other decks made of commons/uncommons and the odd rare. Especially if each person wanted to use their favourites rather than the strongest or most strategic.

Just like in the Pokemon World, some Pokemon are inherently weak and others literally control time or are God and some trainers are too young or inexperienced to have more than a top-tiered rattatta. You haven't *gotta* catch em all if that's not the plan.

 

[HA559]

I mentioned some time ago here that they should make a mini fossil set with all the fossil pokemon similar to what they did with dragon vault but also have extra support cards to get them into play more easily.

 

[Purrloin]

I mentioned some time ago here that they should make a mini fossil set with all the fossil pokemon similar to what they did with dragon vault but also have extra support cards to get them into play more easily.

I'd love to see a Fossil-focused set.

The coming Fossil Excavation Kit in Fates Collide should come a long way in helping get fossils into play, which is welcome considering the Omastar line in particular is pretty powerful in that set. I'll be trying out a Kabutops deck myself (though it isn't the greatest card; but the Strong Energy reprint should give it a better chance going forward).